Why church is so dangerous !!!

[Hokulele]

Excellent! I love pork chops, but my husband is sort of meh, so we don't have them that often.

OK, we have moral guidance, pork chops, and brownies so far. Anyone else?

 

[Foster Zygote]

Actually Foster, I am a live and let live kind of guy who just believes in choice without force and intimidation, this unlike the evolutionists and athiests that demand adherance to their theories.

Claiming that we are trying to force you to change your views through intimidation is laughable. I suspect this is a distraction tactic that you are employing to obscure what has really been done to your claims by members of this forum. Namely, the demonstration that your elaborate claims are riddled with fundamental errors.

You claim that you have mathematically deciphered Biblical prophecy, yet you have been shown several glaring computational errors in your "proofs". You refuse to acknowledge these errors and continue on as though they do not exist.

You claim that various ratios to be found in nature prove the existence of God's design, yet you have been shown conclusively that these ratios do not conform to the values you claim. A prime example is your infamous "the moon is 216,000 miles away" statement. When shown that this distance is actually variable yet never even comes close to your claimed value you tried to claim that it was actually the Earth/moon Lagrange 1 point that is located at the magical distance. Not only is this also false but you embarrassingly confused the L1 point with the Earth/moon barycenter (spelling it barrycenter) which is located deep within the Earth. You now refuse to acknowledge these errors and continue on as though they do not exist.

You quoted Bible verses detailing how to recognize a false prophet. Then it was pointed out that your own prophecies meet the criteria for falsification as described in the scriptures you quoted. When your first prophecy failed to materialize you altered the dates to move the predicted events out of the past and into the future again.

You continually state that evolution is random. You ignore all statements showing that this is not the case. Even after being shown that you are wrong you hang on to your false beliefs because you like the sound of them too much and because you can avoid confronting real challenges by simply giving your favorite straw man a good flogging for your own edification.

You claimed that Charles Lyell's uniformitarianism demanded that we accept that nothing had changed since the Big Bang (you never explained how Lyell could know about the big bang). You have made no move to acknowledge this error.

You proclaimed, without any evidence, that those who challenged your claims all believe everything that the government tells them. This is demonstrably false, you only need visit the politics section of this forum to see that. Yet you still drag this straw man out from time to time when you need to defeat an easy, if insubstantial and inaccurately representative, opponent.

And you still claim that atheists "believe in nothing" (I'll bet that just kills in a sermon, eh?). You've been shown that this is not true but, again, you like the musical ring of this one too much to let go of it. And telling yourself that atheists believe in nothing distracts you from having to acknowledge the bankruptcy of your own claims.

This is just a partial list of your demonstrably false statements. You have yet to admit to a single error. When RandFan came here as a theist and a dualist he had the courage to examine his beliefs in the face of the evidence that came his way and the honesty to revise his position in the face of that new knowledge. That was before my time here but I'd be willing to bet that the flaws in RandFan's earlier position were no where near as prominent as the flaws in your claims. I'm sure none of this criticism will have the slightest impact on you. I've come to accept that the "evidence" you present is secondary to the sense of self importance it gives you. You may be able to ignore your own errors but they are laid bare at your feet for everyone else to clearly see.

 

[Glen.Nogami]

The trouble with false skeptics and systemites is that they are willingly ignorant. You have the potennial to understand as you can read and write and comprehend, but because you are so attached to the system and your position in it, it clouds your intellect and decisions, and hence makes you willingly ignorant.


2Pe 3:5 For this they willingly are ignorant

Its your will, that is the problem. As you have access to the information concerning conspiracies but choose to IGNORE these truths that are discoverable.


Jhn 15:22 If I had not come and spoken unto them, they had not had sin: but now they have no cloke for their sin.

In other words, false skeptics have no cloak for their sin of not knowing these cons and deceptions, WHY because it is readily available knowledge now, thru the internet and other sources, besides the Lord's SPIRIT.

So Glen, false skeptics have no excuse, no cloak for their sin of not knowing. They are responsible and have to grow up and get clued in, as they have been given chance after chance

They are without excuse, even though they claim they just need proof. For their claim of needing more and more and more proof is bogus and can no longer be justified.

So what you're saying is that we should be doing the work of hunting up evidence? I have some sad news. The burden of proof rests upon the person making the absurd claim, here meaning you. You have not yet provided a single scrap of proof. I am shutting my eyes to nothing, because there is nothing there.

Post Script:

The Bible is a meaningless jumble of myth and inaccurate history, and about as far from evidence as you are from mental competence.

 

[Athyrio]

Claiming that we are trying to force you to change your views through intimidation is laughable. I suspect this is a distraction tactic that you are employing to obscure what has really been done to your claims by members of this forum. Namely, the demonstration that your elaborate claims are riddled with fundamental errors.

You claim that you have mathematically deciphered Biblical prophecy, yet you have been shown several glaring computational errors in your "proofs". You refuse to acknowledge these errors and continue on as though they do not exist.

You claim that various ratios to be found in nature prove the existence of God's design, yet you have been shown conclusively that these ratios do not conform to the values you claim. A prime example is your infamous "the moon is 216,000 miles away" statement. When shown that this distance is actually variable yet never even comes close to your claimed value you tried to claim that it was actually the Earth/moon Lagrange 1 point that is located at the magical distance. Not only is this also false but you embarrassingly confused the L1 point with the Earth/moon barycenter (spelling it barrycenter) which is located deep within the Earth. You now refuse to acknowledge these errors and continue on as though they do not exist.

You quoted Bible verses detailing how to recognize a false prophet. Then it was pointed out that your own prophecies meet the criteria for falsification as described in the scriptures you quoted. When your first prophecy failed to materialize you altered the dates to move the predicted events out of the past and into the future again.

You continually state that evolution is random. You ignore all statements showing that this is not the case. Even after being shown that you are wrong you hang on to your false beliefs because you like the sound of them too much and because you can avoid confronting real challenges by simply giving your favorite straw man a good flogging for your own edification.

You claimed that Charles Lyell's uniformitarianism demanded that we accept that nothing had changed since the Big Bang (you never explained how Lyell could know about the big bang). You have made no move to acknowledge this error.

You proclaimed, without any evidence, that those who challenged your claims all believe everything that the government tells them. This is demonstrably false, you only need visit the politics section of this forum to see that. Yet you still drag this straw man out from time to time when you need to defeat an easy, if insubstantial and inaccurately representative, opponent.

And you still claim that atheists "believe in nothing" (I'll bet that just kills in a sermon, eh?). You've been shown that this is not true but, again, you like the musical ring of this one too much to let go of it. And telling yourself that atheists believe in nothing distracts you from having to acknowledge the bankruptcy of your own claims.

This is just a partial list of your demonstrably false statements. You have yet to admit to a single error. When RandFan came here as a theist and a dualist he had the courage to examine his beliefs in the face of the evidence that came his way and the honesty to revise his position in the face of that new knowledge. That was before my time here but I'd be willing to bet that the flaws in RandFan's earlier position were no where near as prominent as the flaws in your claims. I'm sure none of this criticism will have the slightest impact on you. I've come to accept that the "evidence" you present is secondary to the sense of self importance it gives you. You may be able to ignore your own errors but they are laid bare at your feet for everyone else to clearly see.

Well stated. At the risk of spamming the board, i would love to copy and paste what you just said in response to everything DJJ posts from now on. Of course, that would constitute a conspiracy.

 

[RandFan]

And you still claim that atheists "believe in nothing" (I'll bet that just kills in a sermon, eh?). You've been shown that this is not true but, again, you like the musical ring of this one too much to let go of it. And telling yourself that atheists believe in nothing distracts you from having to acknowledge the bankruptcy of your own claims.

Good post. It would be nice if he would read it.

 

[Foster Zygote]

Well stated. At the risk of spamming the board, i would love to copy and paste what you just said in response to everything DJJ posts from now on. Of course, that would constitute a conspiracy.

I'll have to ask my official conspiracy commander...

He says it's cool.

 

[Foster Zygote]

Good post. It would be nice if he would read it.

Part of me thinks he reads everything even remotely about himself. But another part of me thinks he skims over other's posts looking for something sermon worthy.

 

[Foster Zygote]

Randfan is really not worth cmmunicating with as can be noted.

Noted by whom? The quality of RandFan's communitation is, in my opinion, superior to the quality of your communication.

So I avoid the devoid til they become rational and cool down.

Avoid the Noid if it suits you, but I've seen nothing to indicate that RandFan needs to cool down. His side of the exchange with you has been unemotional and has attempted to address the inconsistencies of your flailing attempts at reason. I strongly suspect that you are avoiding him because you would rather not address the uncomfortable problems regarding your claims that he has focused his attention on.

Some are doing this, some are not.

Choices, choices, choices....

We all have them and we all make them.

Hope you make better ones ?

This sort of stuff is the cereal filler of "working the crowd".

 

[Athyrio]

i, for one, welcome our new official conspiracy commander overlord.

 

[Davidjayjordan]

So what you're saying is that we should be doing the work of hunting up evidence? I have some sad news. The burden of proof rests upon the person making the absurd claim, here meaning you. You have not yet provided a single scrap of proof. I am shutting my eyes to nothing, because there is nothing there.

Post Script:

The Bible is a meaningless jumble of myth and inaccurate history, and about as far from evidence as you are from mental competence.

Glen, glen glen....

I don't have to prove anything to you. You have to porve things to yourself. I am not going to spoonfed you, when you are not willing to do the personal work of studying and opening your mind, and researching and trying and TESTING. That's your job, not mine.

The majority of you guys and gals seldom stand for anything only NOTHING and are spineless and meander from topic to topic without aim or purpose. You connect up nothing with nothing and end up with nothing.

Not my fault, yours. Learn something, defend something, progress from that base to further expand what you know. If you don't have a base or standards, try JESUS.

Prove these things for yourself....

http://www.geocities.com/davidjayjordan/Proveit.html

.

 

[Hokulele]

<snip>do the personal work of studying and opening your mind, <snip>

My mind is open, but not empty.

 

[Grimoire]

I don't have to prove anything to you. You have to porve things to yourself.

If you are claiming something, then the burden of proof is on you to prove it.

That's your job, not mine.

Your claim, your job.

The majority of you guys and gals seldom stand for anything only NOTHING and are spineless and meander from topic to topic without aim or purpose.

Your insults grow as tiring as your inattention to basic spelling and grammar.

Learn something, defend something, progress from that base to further expand what you know.

You really need to understand the core concepts of a logical argument. A logical argument is not simply a repetition of your beliefs, followed by an automatic nay saying of your opponent.

If you don't have a base or standards, try JESUS.

Why should I try JESUS? Just because? Is that your entire argument?

 

[RandFan]

If you don't have a base or standards, try JESUS.

Jesus condoned slavery and did not speak out on behalf of the rights of women. He didn't tell people to stop the stupid act of killing animals in the name of god. The problem is that his philosophy is thousands of years old. In this day and age, the enlightened of us recognize that women deserve equal rights. We believe that all people have a right to life liberty and the pursuit of happiness. That was something unheard of in Christ's time and never spoken of by him.

Christ was ok for his times, however I think we can do much better.

Join us in the 21st century.

 

[The_Fire]

My mind is open, but not empty.

*Grin*
This reminds me of a thing a friend of mine once did:

http://www.redcedars.net/arcey_0098.htm

 

[Hokulele]

*Grin*
This reminds me of a thing a friend of mine once did:

http://www.redcedars.net/arcey_0098.htm

I like it.

 

[Foster Zygote]

The following will contain no ad hominem attacks on my part, only my genuine opinion of you. As you continue to derogate others I'm sure you will agree that this at least opens the door to an examination of your motives.

I don't have to prove anything to you. You have to porve things to yourself. I am not going to spoonfed you, when you are not willing to do the personal work of studying and opening your mind, and researching and trying and TESTING. That's your job, not mine.

The burden of proof is on you to prove your claims. Since you have presented no supporting evidence, and since a huge portion of the evidence you have presented is demonstrably false, you have no justification for implying that we are fools for failing to validate your claims for you.

The majority of you guys and gals seldom stand for anything only NOTHING...

To quote someone who often irritated me, but who was a far more worthy opponent that yourself: BULLSPIT!

The majority of guys and gals on this forum stand for a great many important things. Some even stand for religious values based on faith. The fact that no one has seen fit to validate your claims is not their fault but yours. You tell yourself that they believe nothing in order that you might comfort yourself.

...and are spineless and meander from topic to topic without aim or purpose. You connect up nothing with nothing and end up with nothing.

Now that's good irony. You have shown nothing but intellectual cowardice in your refusal to even acknowledge the many gross errors in your meandering, disjointed writings. You have repeatedly connected nothing to nothing. Or would you now care to address the many errors in your claims? Tell me, does your website still give the distance to the moon as 216,000 miles or have you corrected it and recalculated your equations in the interest of truth?

Not my fault, yours. Learn something, defend something, progress from that base to further expand what you know. If you don't have a base or standards, try JESUS.

You have repeatedly demonstrated how much you have not learned. If you deny this I will make a list of every false numerical value you given and every erroneous calculation you've made. Then we will see if you can defend your failures. As for Jesus, some of those who have called your claims false are Christians, many others among us have tried Jesus in the past and found him wanting.

Prove these things for yourself....

Well, you've been a miserable failure at proving things to us so I suspect this is your last hope. But you see we did engage in just the sort of scrutiny that you've invited with the above challenge. The verdict: Bullspit.

 

[Davidjayjordan]

I can show you where the water is, but you have to drink. I can;t drink for you.

Life is not spoon feeding of false skeptics, true skeptics search for answers and eventually find them.

False skeptics love doubt and their fears of finding something to stabilize them as they are petrified of standing up for something. they prefer nothing which is why they are nothing.

 

[Davidjayjordan]

False skeptics love their church system of doubt and getting no where as they then can think in their minds that no one is going anywhere and they all should join their church of complacency and the status quo.

But true skeptics move on from truth to truth building connections and stability in life and love.

 

[Foster Zygote]

Does your website still give the distance to the moon as 216,000 miles?

 

[Kochanski]

I can show you where the water is, but you have to drink. I can;t drink for you.

Life is not spoon feeding of false skeptics, true skeptics search for answers and eventually find them.

False skeptics love doubt and their fears of finding something to stabilize them as they are petrified of standing up for something. they prefer nothing which is why they are nothing.

Your understanding of doubt is childish. You speak of true skeptics searching for answers, but how can you search for answers if you believe you know them all as you do? Without doubt there is no search.

Doubt is not nothing. Doubt means questioning and searching. It means always keeping your mind open to new information and reevaluating what you know based on new information. Doubt means uncertainty.It means provisional acceptance of things. It means we are not afraid to admit we do not know everything.

As far as standing up for things, it is evident here that you are ignoring the fact that we stand up for evolution and many other things that science has proven. This is not nothing.

Why are you afraid of doubt? Why are you afraid to expose your beliefs to question? Is your faith so weak that it could be broken by facts?

That is pretty poor faith.