What is paranormal in Homeopathy

[geni]

PLEASE start treating this loon with the contempt he so richly deserves.

Where have 17 pages of polite discussion got you.

He is either mentally disturbed or is laughing at you !

Remember some of us have had past experence with this guy.

 

[Jocce]

PLEASE start treating this loon with the contempt he so richly deserves.

Where have 17 pages of polite discussion got you.

He is either mentally disturbed or is laughing at you !

Well...maybe we should take better care of them. I'd hate to see them go. Kumar, MAS and those guys are an unlimited source of amusement for me. It would be pretty boring without all those whacky ideas.

So kumar....come back...all is forgiven... and mass existing without any vested interest of course

 

[Badly Shaved Monkey]

MAS and Syed

If you were honest participants in this discussion, you would have answereed by now these very simple questions.

You have been back to post replies about many things, including a lot of complaining about people not being nice to you, but the one thing you have not done is answer these questions. If you really want to debate whether homeopathy is paranormal we need to establish some facts first and back up some of the things you have said and the route to that is via answers to these questions.

Frankly it doesn't matter whether you are who you claim to be, if you cannot or will not answer these questions, you are dishonest and an affront to decent society, which is especially despicable for people who so freely cite Allah in their posts as the being the sustaining force behind them.

Just for fun, let's teach Mr MAS some simple physical chemistry.

Syed, you might want to read this, it will help you do your homework. I'm still waiting for you to hand it in.

Right. Here we go.

MAS, let's say you have a 1ml of 1 molar solution of Na₂SO₄ solution. In 1 litre you would have 6.022 x 10²³ of each of the component moieties of Na₂SO₄. In 100ml you will have 6.022 x 10²².

If you want to use this as the basis for your next 1 in 100 dilution you will draw 1ml into a pipette and add 99ml water.

If the solution was well-mixed when you drew up that 1ml it will contain 6.022 x 10²⁰ of each of the components of Na₂SO₄.

You are suggesting that there may be some other number drawn up.


Edited to add this quote so as to stuff his own words back down his throat and remove his scope for claiming I have misunderstood him

How many? What are the chances that the aspirate will conatin a number substantially different from 6.022 x 10²⁰?

Now here is the bit to help Mr Syed. Let me remind you that 6.022 x 10²⁰ can be written fully as 602,200,000,000,000,000,000.

Syed, you need to do a simple piece of arithmetic.

Divide 602,200,000,000,000,000,000 by 800,352,112.676.
What is the answer? How many atoms or molecules are there in the epinephrine solution you mentioned?

I would expect a bright 10 year old to do these sums accurately and have a feel for the size of the numbers. You seem to be struggling badly.

 

[Zep]

Quiet, isn't it.



Kitten recipes, anyone?

 

[delphi_ote]

Kitten recipes, anyone?

Preparing food for kittens, preparing food according to kitten customs, or preparing the kittens themselves to be eaten?

 

[Zep]

Preparing food for kittens, preparing food according to kitten customs, or preparing the kittens themselves to be eaten?

The door's wide open - run with what you are good at!

 

[Kumar]

Whether it is "paranormal" or "placebo":

"A young boy/girl look at or think about a young smart girl/boy & get some feeling/effects. I don't think, there is any involvement of "molecular presence" in this interaction/feeling effect. How??? Whether all feelings/psychlogical effects are alike paranormal/placebo?

OR

Can there be any aspect in mass existance, which can be considered as "paranormal" or "placebo"?

 

[Jocce]

"A young boy/girl look at or think about a young smart girl/boy & get some feeling/effects. I don't think, there is any involvement of "molecular presence" in this interaction/feeling effect.

So that's what you don't think. A little digging would reveal what science do think.

It would be interesting to know what you believe is wrong with the scientific explanation of those feelings/effects and even more interesting to hear your alternate explanation.

I can hardly wait...

 

[Darat]

So that's what you don't think. A little digging would reveal what science do think.

It would be interesting to know what you believe is wrong with the scientific explanation of those feelings/effects and even more interesting to hear your alternate explanation.

I can hardly wait...

Silica.

 

[Kumar]

Silica.

Spondo.....digestive pHs/iron/calcium/ relaxed condition/loss of elasicity-ferrum phos/calc.phos/calc. fluor/silicea. ????Check.

Best wishes.

 

[Kumar]

So that's what you don't think. A little digging would reveal what science do think.

It would be interesting to know what you believe is wrong with the scientific explanation of those feelings/effects and even more interesting to hear your alternate explanation.

I can hardly wait...

Where is the molecular interaction/presence in this type of feeling/effect?

 

[Donks]

Where is the molecular interaction/presence in this type of feeling/effect?

Are you proposing that homeopathy works by getting people horny?

 

[Zep]

The molecules of the remedy fall in love and want to stay together forever so they bond. And then they have little molecules that grow up into polymers, etc.

How amazingly cute...and wrong.

 

[Kumar]

Page 3
ECH GENERAL ASSEMBLY – XVIII Symposium of GIRI12 to 14th of November 2004 Scientific Report experiments of this team are published (Dr Lucietta Betti. DISTA-department of Agroenvironmental Science and Technology. University of Bologna.).

Experiments are well led, in controlled conditions, with a sufficient number of plants, animals or cells, with a fair statistical treatment. The facts are indisputable, statistically significant, reproducible, even if they cannot be explained using the molecular paradigm.•The second question to be addressed is the content of homeopathic very high diluted preparations. Professor Jean Cambar introduced the theme asking what are the contributions of the different spectroscopy’s ( Raman, Ultraviolet, X or Magnetic Nuclear Resonance) to show the structure of water and solvents in high dilutions? What is the real pertinence of Avogadro number to evaluate the precise pattern of molecules? Can a dilution work without any molecule? One ofthe most innovative perspectives in this last decade was to demonstrate that the activity and effectiveness of high dilutions occurred as well in presence of molecules (even with only some molecules) as in organized structured solvent without any molecule and also depends oninformation level (material or immaterial information). Professor Louis Rey, Doctor ès sciences, Lausanne, a specialist in low temperature thermoluminescence already published on the topic in international journalsNature(1988;391:418),C.R.Physique(2000;1:107-110). He presented the latest results of the experiments he carried together with Dr. Philippe Belon on the thermoluminescence of ultra-high dilutions of lithium chloride and sodium chloride.

The conclusions are : Ultra-highdilutions of lithium chloride and sodium chloride (10-30g cm-3) have been irradiated by x- and- rays at 77K, then progressively rewarmed to room temperature. During that phase, their3
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Report thermoluminescence has been studied and it was found that, despite their dilution beyond the Avogadro number, the emitted light was specific of the original salts dissolved initially. Much to our surprise, the experimental results do show, without any ambiguity, the specificity of the contained information, these findings did prove to be reproducible in the course of many different identical experiments. As a working hypothesis, we believe that this phenomenon results from a marked structural change in the hydrogen bond network initiated at the onset bythe presence of the dissolved ions and maintained in the course of the dilution process,probably thanks to the successive vigorous mechanical stirrings.Physica(2003;A323:67-74).Professor Guadalupe Ruiz-Vega from the Michoacana de San Nicolás de Hidalgo University(Morelia – Mexico) presented her most recent publications in the field of thermodynamic. She could demonstrate the biological effect of two ultra-low-dose compounds. Publication inprocess.The use of modern techniques in the hand of specialists is the best way to show sceptics that the experimental facts are well grounded and confirmed by such reproducible experiments. Even in ultra-molecular homeopathic dilutions specific information of the prime dissolved substance still remains in the preparation and can be detected explainingits efficacy.•The third question to be addressed is the theoretical framework in which the effects of homeopathic diluted preparations could be explained. Two G.I.R.I. members (Groupe International de Recherche sur l’Infinitésimal, seewww.giriweb.com) Professor Madeleine Bastide (University of Montpellier) and AgnèsLagache (Professor of Philosophy, Paris) are working on this topic since 16 years. A new paradigm for medical sciences is needed to explain these facts and to allow more accurate research models in the future. A working group of 7 members applied this new paradigm tothe analysis of experimental results.4
http://64.233.161.104/search?q=cach...h112004-1.pdf+ECH+general+assembly+giri&hl=en

Just read & explain it.

 

[wahrheit]

(from that PDF, emphasis mine)
Conclusions: clear indications exist about clinical effectiveness of homeopathy; homeopathy is effective in uncontrolled practice or versus comparison groups; enough indications exist that “placebo” is an insufficient explanation for the effects of homeopathy. Homeopathy is similar or better in effectiveness than conventional treatment and where it has been studied it is cheaper on the long run. Many interesting questions not even asked would be prioritized such as the preventive potential of homeopathy in children avoiding invasive measures, in primary care settings the long term preventive effect of chronic complications.

 

[Darat]

Just read & explain it.

Silicon toxicity.

 

[Psiload]

Just read & explain it.

http://64.233.161.104/search?q=cach...h112004-1.pdf+ECH+general+assembly+giri&hl=en

You have to scroll all the way down to the bottom for the punchline:

The professors expressed their amazement at the lack of response from the health authorities to these convincing results.

You gotta love those wacky homeopaths... in a perpetual state of befuddlement.

 

[Kumar]

Silicon toxicity.

OK.

Best wishes.

 

[Kumar]

http://64.233.161.104/search?q=cach...h112004-1.pdf+ECH+general+assembly+giri&hl=en

You have to scroll all the way down to the bottom for the punchline:



You gotta love those wacky homeopaths... in a perpetual state of befuddlement.

You can test in a way, they indicated. Any problem?

 

[Donks]

You can test in a way, they indicated. Any problem?

Why should anyone bother? As long as you don't bother providing evidence that homeopathy works, I don't see why anyone should bother checking theories as to how it would theoretically work in Planet X if administrered by naked nurses and purple bunnies.