Moderated The NYPD and Molten Concrete

[yankee451]

While I'm sure he could easily tell the difference between a Glock and a Browning pistol, the curator of the police museum is/was not competent to tell if concrete "melted" or not. This demonstrates the dangers of venturing beyond one's field of competence. (Hint, hint - know thyself, Yankee).



The U.S. didn't go to war over whether or not there was melted concrete in the police museum display, any more than whether or not the notorious "WTC Meteorite" had "melted steel" in it. (It didn't.) Whether or not the U.S. had casus belli under international law is another manner.

"international Law" Don't make me laugh.

This is a class war, always has been, and our class is losing. International law is the law of the jungle.

 

[Sabretooth]

Class Warfare = Molten Concrete?

Brilliant!

 

[Slowvehicle]

Anyone willing to seriously answer the question or are personal attacks and sarcasm all I can expect?

The police claimed the fires were so intense the concrete melted. They even built a museum exhibit to display their unscientific conclusions.

Were they incompetent or lying?

http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/loaded-question
http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/strawman
http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/begging-the-question
http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/black-or-white

 

[jaydeehess]

Class Warfare = Molten Concrete?

Brilliant!

I'm not sure that I recall that Marx, Engles or Lenin ever made that connection!

 

[jaydeehess]

http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/loaded-question
http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/strawman
http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/begging-the-question
http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/black-or-white

I think arguement from ignorance might fit in there as well.

 

[twinstead]

I think arguement from ignorance might fit in there as well.

Let's throw in personal incredulity just for kicks

 

[yankee451]

http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/loaded-question
http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/strawman
http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/begging-the-question
http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/black-or-white

If you think there are other options when it comes to explaining away such an outrageus claim from the NY Police Department regarding this evidence from the crime of the century, I'm all ears. Do "crime-labs" and stuff only happen on TeeVee shows or what?

 

[LSSBB]

If you think there are other options when it comes to explaining away such an outrageus claim from the NY Police Department regarding this evidence from the crime of the century, I'm all ears. Do "crime-labs" and stuff only happen on TeeVee shows or what?

They made a mistake isn't an option? You know, like claiming missiles made a crater in Shanksville, against all the evidence. People make mistakes, 'taint no big thing.

 

[Myriad]

Do "crime-labs" and stuff only happen on TeeVee shows or what?

Crime labs as they are depicted on TV shows do only exist in TV shows. This causes problems in some jury trials, because many jurors expect analysis of evidence to be as clear and definitive as it is in the fictional TV shows they've seen, and it generally is not.

Truthers (especially those who use words like "TeeVee") usually make fun of people whose world view is too dependent on what they see on television. Which makes it ironic that you would expect crime labs and the uses of crime labs to be like what you see on fictional shows on television.

But do tell... why do you think the gun in question would have been sent to a crime lab at all? What open case, against whom, would the gun be evidence in?

Respectfully,
Myriad

 

[Redwood]

Loose language

They made a mistake isn't an option? You know, like claiming missiles made a crater in Shanksville, against all the evidence. People make mistakes, 'taint no big thing.

There's also the use of imprecise, colloquial language to consider. Ask a random sample of people if the steel columns in the photo below "melted", and a good portion of them will say yes. Obviously, they did not.

 

[yankee451]

Crime labs as they are depicted on TV shows do only exist in TV shows. This causes problems in some jury trials, because many jurors expect analysis of evidence to be as clear and definitive as it is in the fictional TV shows they've seen, and it generally is not.

Truthers (especially those who use words like "TeeVee") usually make fun of people whose world view is too dependent on what they see on television. Which makes it ironic that you would expect crime labs and the uses of crime labs to be like what you see on fictional shows on television.

But do tell... why do you think the gun in question would have been sent to a crime lab at all? What open case, against whom, would the gun be evidence in?

Respectfully,
Myriad

Everyone loves the TeeVee. Especially people who like to label other people.

Seems the NYPD has a robust forensics lab that is currently seeking help. What sort of work does a criminologist do?

The New York City Police Department is seeking applicants for the position of Criminalist in our Police Laboratory in Jamaica, Queens. Criminalists perform work in the chemical and/or physical analyses of evidentiary materials such as hair, fibers, body fluids, fingerprints, gunshot residue, fire accelerants, questioned documents, controlled substances, soil, metals, polymers, glass, and other types of forensic trace evidence required in scientific criminal investigations.
http://www.nyc.gov/html/nypd/html/careers/civilian_employment.shtml

And how about the museum (don't say propaganda). Are they indoctrinating school children about what happened on 9/11?

http://www.nycpolicemuseum.org/


Here's the floor plan where you can see the exhibits. Seems they're still exploiting 9/11. On the first floor there's an interactive exhibit for children designed to teach the skills and fundamentals of police work; such as verifying whether concrete can melt before one builds a museum exhibit that might give school children the impression concrete CAN melt.

http://www.nycpm.org/PDF/floorplan/Floorplan_English.pdf

 

[Myriad]

Everyone loves the TeeVee. Especially people who like to label other people.

I like television. But I recognize that most of the shows on it are fiction, and present the world unrealistically. I can see how people who are not aware of that might have problems telling fantasy from reality sometimes. Apparently, projecting that very problem onto others that have no such difficulty is also pretty common. If you find television objectionable enough to want to call it funny misspelled names, perhaps you should give it up.

Seems the NYPD has a robust forensics lab that is currently seeking help. What sort of work does a criminologist do?

I don't see "prepare museum exhibits" anywhere on that list.

And how about the museum (don't say propaganda). Are they indoctrinating school children about what happened on 9/11?

How about it? Would you prefer important historical events and cultural artifacts to be ignored and forgotten? I like museums, even more than television.

Here's the floor plan where you can see the exhibits. Seems they're still exploiting 9/11. On the first floor there's an interactive exhibit for children designed to teach the skills and fundamentals of police work; such as verifying whether concrete can melt before one builds a museum exhibit that might give school children the impression concrete CAN melt.

Again, you've shown no evidence that creating museum exhibits is part of the fundamental skills of an NYPD criminalist or other law enforcement worker.

However, since sintering (the actual process that solidified the amalgam around the gun) does involve melting of some fractions of the mixture, the label is largely accurate.

Respectfully,
Myriad

 

[yankee451]

I like television. But I recognize that most of the shows on it are fiction, and present the world unrealistically. I can see how people who are not aware of that might have problems telling fantasy from reality sometimes. Apparently, projecting that very problem onto others that have no such difficulty is also pretty common. If you find television objectionable enough to want to call it funny misspelled names, perhaps you should give it up.




I don't see "prepare museum exhibits" anywhere on that list.




How about it? Would you prefer important historical events and cultural artifacts to be ignored and forgotten? I like museums, even more than television.




Again, you've shown no evidence that creating museum exhibits is part of the fundamental skills of an NYPD criminalist or other law enforcement worker.

However, since sintering (the actual process that solidified the amalgam around the gun) does involve melting of some fractions of the mixture, the label is largely accurate.

Respectfully,
Myriad

I trust rational people won't be as forgiving of such a minor infraction as indoctrinating school children with blatant falsehoods. Perhaps we should teach school children to take museums with the same grain of salt they should take authority, not to mention the TeeVee.

 

[twinstead]

I trust rational people won't be as forgiving of such a minor infraction as indoctrinating school children with blatant falsehoods. Perhaps we should teach school children to take museums with the same grain of salt they should take authority, not to mention the TeeVee.

No, we should teach them common sense, not to jump to irrational conclusions, and how to view events in a rational, objective way without letting their ideology blind them.

Yea, you are no different than the reddest necked flag waving jingoist--just the other side of the woo woo coin.

 

[beachnut]

What did the Board of NYCPM say?

I trust rational people won't be as forgiving of such a minor infraction as indoctrinating school children with blatant falsehoods. Perhaps we should teach school children to take museums with the same grain of salt they should take authority, not to mention the TeeVee.

Rational people don't lie about the Passengers on flight 11, 175, 93, and 77. Why do you? Rational people don't make up fantasy about missiles on 911.

What did they say?
The New York City Police Museum
100 Old Slip
New York, NY 10005
tel: 212-480-3100
fax: 212-480-9757
email: [email protected]

What did they say, when you discovered they might of made a mistake when the gun was crushed and corroded on 911?

What percent of the museum is the display you have problems with as you rant against the police and government in general?

 

[LSSBB]

I trust rational people won't be as forgiving of such a minor infraction as indoctrinating school children with blatant falsehoods. Perhaps we should teach school children to take museums with the same grain of salt they should take authority, not to mention the TeeVee.

Did Columbus discover America?

 

[yankee451]

For uncounted people, their first exposure to the lies of 9/11 was from the NYPD museum.

Ethical Responsibilities in Museums
One of the most common ways that anthropology reaches a public audience is through museums. Merriam-Webster's collegiate dictionary defines a museum as "An institution devoted to the procurement, care, study, and display of objects of lasting interest or value." A museum is a place where the public can be educated about diverse peoples, cultures, and time periods. For many people this is their only exposure to this information.http://www.d.umn.edu/~lbelote/Senior_Seminar/PublicAnth-ethics_in_anthropology.htm

 

[yankee451]

9/11 Remembered

Here they are again - since they were so outrageously wrong about the molten concrete, why would anyone believe anything they say about anything?

9.11 Remembered


PERMANENT

The New York City Police Museum has opened a permanent multi-media exhibit that chronicles the extraordinary role the NYPD played in response to September 11, 2001. Through exclusive on-camera interviews, striking photographs, and numerous Ground Zero artifacts, the exhibit tells the dramatic and remarkable story of New York's Finest, through their eyes and in their own words.
http://www.nycpm.org/exhibitions/911/

 

[yankee451]

What else were the police "mistaken" about?

According to the same guys who claimed the concrete melted and then turned back to concrete without melting the guns encased therein, a jet wheel impacted this column, breaking all the bolts simultaneously, flying it 700 horizontal feet while it fell 1000 vertical feet to gently land on the concrete without shattering it. This panel weighs between 4 and 6 tons.

 

[Kid Eager]

Here they are again - since they were so outrageously wrong about the molten concrete, why would anyone believe anything they say about anything?

Outrageously? I look forward to evidence of the outrage that your alleged discovery generates.

Interestingly, if one were to apply the same standards of faux-outrage to the claims you have made in the 3 threads-of-a-feather, why would anyone believe anything that you say about anything?