Bigfoot - The Patterson-Gimlin Film

[FFed]

Here are black bear prints; big ones. That's a size 12 wader I'm wearing.

See the claw prints?

Yes I see the claw marks. So your point is what? That all bear tracks leave claw marks?

Having to argue over bear tracks as evidence for bigfoot is ridiculous. Kinda shows what little real "proof" there is for bigfoot.

 

[FFed]

Well, I’m not sure where one goes to "find the nearest bloodhound". I’ve stated on BFF that, despite being a big game hunter, I know of no bear hunting dogs, and thought that trained dogs were no longer around, because hunting bears with dogs has become illegal nearly continent-wide. Rockinkt replied that dogs are still used in BC. I believe him. I guess one would run to town, get on the Net, and Google “hunting dogs – BC”?

Yes, dogs are allowed to hunt for ALL game in BC. They are used for bear, but most commonly for cougar.

 

[LAL]

Exposing Roger Patterson's 1967 Bigfoot Film Hoax

See the walk here:

http://www.katu.com/news/story.asp?ID=67036

http://www.katu.com/news/story.asp?ID=66988

And the confirmation for the kid's story is what? The Morris suit stank?

 

[LAL]

But weren't the casts made in dirt not snow?

RayG

Right. The casts were made at the garbage dump. Dahinden recovered the originals which show faint dermals in three places as was pointed out on the copies by Ed Palma.The print in snow was later and seems to have been cast by Krantz, according to the interview with Noll, but I don't know what happened to that cast. Maybe it's at Idaho State.

 

[LAL]

Let's see, " The ambulance chasing argument .. "

Knoll says ' it doesn't work '.

When that argument was brought up, I believe I asked the question

" As opposed to what ? "

I don't remember getting an answer.. Did I overlook it ?


Explain to me again, why Knoll, with a fresh Sas butt print, didn't find the nearest bloodhound, and go after the greatest find of the 21st century ?

Instead, he put some peanuts and fruit out for bait, and went to bed..

added:
I'm pretty sure Knoll isn't stupid.. It just might have occurred to him that bringing in a tracking dog, would make all the speculation and the casting thing a total waste of time.
And maybe make him look a little foolish when it became apparent the trail they were
following belonged to an elk, or anything besides a Bigfoot..




Think again about P&G..
Tracking Patty would have been the most logical thing in the world to do ..

It was absolutely known that the trail was fresh, but it was totally ignored, supposedly while the great Sas hunters cast tracks..

" Hey Roger don't you think we ought to track her while the trail is fresh? "

" Naw. We got 60 seconds of film, that may or may not be any good. And we got these here tracks. "

" We don't need no Bigfoot.. Never have.. All we need is some plaster casts.. "

It's "Noll", not "Knoll". You must have missed it. I posted a post of Noll's on "ambulance chasing". He favors luring, still, evidently. There's a discussion on methods on BFF, which see.

Aren't you one of the ones who argued P&G must've been lousey trackers if they couldn't find her in 3.5 miles on horseback?

The Skookum animal could have had an hours head start. They did broadcast calls and try to lure it in again, but tracking anything in that area is exceedingly difficult. The mudhole was in hard ground as colobus noted, by a road. Where would the tracks be to even point the direction?

"Which way did he go? Which way did he go?"

The imprint had priority. It was beginning to dry and crack.

 

[LAL]

We?

Maybe you'all been tracking with the wrong companions.



I guess I just haven't been out there working hard enough like we.

C'mon, Hunster. Bill went hiking in Virginia and didn't see one. He was also stationed at Fort Lewis and didn't see one there either. He knows all about this.

 

[LAL]

Huntster, don't you find it a little puzzling that no further pursuit was attempted for the situations described?

The same things seems to happen on BFRO expeditions. Enough of an encounter to keep paying customers showing up, but never any pursuit of the pesky squatch.

RayG

We're not saying MM is credible now are we? The Skookum Expedition was long before all the good people resigned.

Noll carries a 9mm, but I don't know if he did then. The other members seem to have been unarmed. So what do you do if you catch up? Invite it over for lunch?

Didn't you ask all this in you debate with him? I'll have to look that up again. Last I recall he seemed to be getting a little irritated.

 

[LAL]

I see from quotes that Lu really misses me. It's just like her to discuss me when she knows I can't read what she says unless someone else quotes her.

Nope, you are still on ignore.

How like Bill to put me on Ignore and then continue to mention me as though I can't read the board. I've been hoping someone would repost at least some of what I say. I would have ignored him months ago, but I was laughing too hard. I miss our wrangles, but since he's just going over old ground, there's not much I can say that I haven't said before. Any one interested can do a search on about half a dozen threads.

If anyone would like to repost this, feel free. I hate to see him laboring under yet another misconception.

 

[LAL]

LAL, do you have some medical links to info on 'Erectus Femoral Hernia', the only exact matches I get in Google link to bigfoot information. If I remove Erectus and only enter 'Femoral Hernia', I get lots of medical information like this:

A femoral hernia is a protrusion of a loop of the intestine through a weakening in the abdominal wall, located in the groin near the thigh.

No idea how the intestine would be able to make its way to the outside area of the thigh though. There's even a picture:

http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/imagepages/18025.htm

Wrong kind of rupture. Dr. Nelson (an expert in biomechanics) explains it in detail on LMS. I can get the technical terms later. Did you see Noll's post on LMS where he says they couldn't have gotten a better sceptical crew? He was the only investigator on the show. This came up top on a search for hernia + thigh:

Femoral hernia – a thigh hernia. Even though this hernia appears on the upper thigh, the weakened area occurs between the abdomen and thigh. This is one hernia that’s more common among women.

http://vanderbiltowc.wellsource.com/dh/Content.asp?ID=1450

Surely you've heard the old adage, you get what you pay for. Yeah, I've seen the skeletal recreation on page 93 of Meet the Sasquatch. The first image looks like Patty is giving birth, and the second image reminds me of the pose my wife sometimes adopts when she has to pee really badly. Maybe Hajicek should have gone with a higher bidder. (Was it the same digital guy that has bigfoot with fingers hanging to the knees on page 94? That alone suggests his accuracy is a wee bit off.)

RayG

I don't know, but the digital guy was a sceptic when he started. Meldrum noticed the rotating action of the knee originally. The digitalization shows that. See it in motion. There's a clip on Thomas' website if you don't have LMS. $100,000 isn't exactly cheap. If the digitalization wasn't good enough, I'm sure Hajicek would have wanted his money back.

 

[LAL]

Krantz examining a bossburg print preserved under cardboard, which he presumably did not cast???

Someone please tell Bill he said in the interview with Noll he cast it. No point in me posting the interview again.

 

[LAL]

Can you make a cast of a print in snow?

Yes, apparently. See the interview.

Matt, if you're here, have you tried that?

 

[LAL]

Do you really believe a big, stinky, crippled primate, would have gone undetected all this time? Jumping from one downed log to another? Walking over barbed wire?
Show me.

Why did it stop leaving tracks after a couple of times ?

A student of Krantz' reported to him he'd found tracks like that 5 or 6 years later, twenty miles away. And a farmer reported he'd seen them 20 years earlier.

 

[LAL]

http://www.vancourier.com/issues01/07101/news/07101N1.html

How can anyone even begin to take the bossburg prints seriously?

To whom it may concern: Green took Marx' film seriously at first. He was somewhat humiliated when Byrne exposed it, especially since he was fond of Byrne. He may have overreacted. But isn't it interesting Dahinden didn't challenge Krantz on those tracks? He's the one who counted 1089 of them.

 

[LAL]

Which situations are those?



I'm highly skeptical of BFRO "expeditions". While I can understand the possibility that the organization might be on to something, and may be hording information/evidence, as time goes on and no revelations are released, that becomes less likely.

They seem to be way too private and withholding while simultaneously making fantastic claims to be believable.

Noll left before anybody. Eight curators resigned in a week. Who's left but the paying customers? (At least one of them left too.)

Whatever happened to the pancake-eating Kentucky Sasquatch video?

 

[LAL]

Not to mention paddling or swimming across the Columbia River.

RayG

There have been reports from Skamania County of them swimming in the Columbia. There've been sightings on the other side and tracks found on one of the islands. There's a place near Bonneville Dam where swimming across would be fairly easy.

 

[LAL]

LAL, serious question here. Why is it most of the 'best' bigfoot evidence is associated with known hoaxsters or hucksters?

RayG

Other than Bossburg, which best evidence? Patterson was not a known hoaxer, and I don't think he qualifies as a huckster. Who on the Skookum expedition is or was a known hoaxer? MM didn't get grabby until years later, apparently. That hardly negates the findings.

And then there are all those casts over decades in widely separated arras.............

 

[LAL]

Are you certain they're a match? Aren't the casts with the bone structure drawn in a set that Krantz had? Weren't these originally cast in dirt?

Hasn't this been discussed before? I haven't actually held the cast in my hand, nor was I present when the photo was taken in the snow, but it seems obvious that the little toes are quite different between the two casts and the snow-print. The little toe in the snow seems to be pointing directly forward, while the plaster cast little toes are not. The two humps don't seem to be in quite the same place either. Were you able to place your copy of the cast into the snow-print to confirm an exact match?

RayG

The track melted in 1969, didn't it? And the cast was not made from that print.

Yes, it was discussed. You thought one of the bunionettes was a little toe print, didn't you?

Since the cast was not made from the snow print, the toes needn't be in the same orientation. The fact that the angle is different argues for authenticity, doesn't it?

They appear to have been made by the same foot with articulating toes.

There are photos of other casts where the crippled foot was quite bent, in Murphy's book, I believe.

So how many fake feet do you think Marx had altogether? And when did anyone find them? Why hasn't anyone mentioned Ray Pickens? Too far fetched?

 

[LTC8K6]

Hunster, I have never claimed that bears are disappearing.

You are the one who claimed that earlier regarding the East coast. You were shown to be wrong, and admitted same.

You also went on and on about the lack of bear surveys in your area. Relating it to the lack of people in the woods who might see bigfoot. That point was also disputed by myself and others.

Now you seem to know how many bears there are in your area.

Curious.

 

[LTC8K6]

Huntster:

All the wilderness areas of the eastern U.S. are completely isolated by the Great Plains and oceans.

It also harbors the majority of human habitation on this continent.

Other large mammals are extinct, nearly extinct, or going extinct there, including bears and pumas.

Again, if current conditions continue, or if human populations there increase, I don't think a sasquatch species will last.

How long? I don't know.

I'm guesstimating a century.

 

[LTC8K6]

Patterson and Gimlin were certain that they had the goods.

Of course they were.....

We wanted to get back and take plaster casts of the tracks and then go on into town to see if we had anything on film. We weren’t sure from Roger stumbling and falling down on the sand bar and getting up and running, ..we didn’t even have an idea that we had anything on film at that time...in fact it was doubtful that we did have anything.

Bob sounds real sure.....