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[Continuation] Corona Virus Conspiracy Theories Part V

People are not dropping like flies in NZ

USA Today debunked a false claim regarding New Zealand and vaccination. "A Dec. 3 Instagram post (direct link, archive link) questions the safety of COVID-19 vaccines.

“BREAKING: A New Zealand government whistleblower has come forward with explosive official data that shows more than 20% of the nation’s citizens that received COVID mRNA vaccines died,” reads a post from X, formerly Twitter, shared in the Instagram post. The words “COVID mRNA vaccines” are crossed out but remain legible.

The Instagram post was liked more than 2,000 times in four days. The original X post, from right-wing account Leading Report, was shared more than 1,000 times in four days."
I hope all of my Kiwi friends mark themselves "Safe" regarding misinformation about the vaccines.
 
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Chris_Halkides said:
USA Today debunked a false claim regarding New Zealand and vaccination. "A Dec. 3 Instagram post (direct link, archive link) questions the safety of COVID-19 vaccines.

“BREAKING: A New Zealand government whistleblower has come forward with explosive official data that shows more than 20% of the nation’s citizens that received COVID mRNA vaccines died,” reads a post from X, formerly Twitter, shared in the Instagram post. The words “COVID mRNA vaccines” are crossed out but remain legible.

The Instagram post was liked more than 2,000 times in four days. The original X post, from right-wing account Leading Report, was shared more than 1,000 times in four days."
I hope all of my Kiwi friends mark themselves "Safe" regarding misinformation about the vaccines.
Click to expand...

Hard to believe that would be posted. Complete lack of fundamental critical thinking/numeracy. Now, if the only people vaxed were over 90 y/o .....
 
Guss said:
I wonder how many were unvaxxed?
Click to expand...


I made the mistake of taking Guss's question seriously!

I had forgotten about his body of work:
Guss said:
dann said:
It turns out that Guss doesn't know what he is talking about and simply resorts to spreading lies!
Maybe Guss can tell us how the virus managed to spread before the vaccines against it were developed.
It would also be interesting to hear why "so many people and children began dying in huge numbers" from Covid-19 before the vaccines, but why bother about minor detalis like this?
The Danish numbers make it pretty obvious that vaccines alone are not enough to fight the SARS-CoV-2 pandemic. The number of Covid-19 deaths in October for the years 2020, 2021 and 2022 were 70, 55 and 271!
The Cuban numbers make it obvious that it is possible to fight it with a combination of vaccines and other precautions.
However, the health authorities in most Western countries have no interest in fighting it after they resorted to the 'learning-to-live-with-the-virus' strategy.
Click to expand...

I was clearly talking after rollout, it's absolutely true that the vaxxed were the ones spreading the virus compared to the unvaxxed since they were denied freedom of movement.
As the vaccines rolled out a huge spike in overall non covid deaths has been the result, it continues.
Click to expand...
 
dann said:
I made the mistake of taking Guss's question seriously!

I had forgotten about his body of work:
Click to expand...

Big Pharma and its supporters refuse to publish the data, such a monstrous question for all humanity yet they continue to run and hide from such easily accessible data.
Pretty obvious who's the best protected.
 
Guss, you should take your ranting to the Conspiracies and Conspiracy Theories subforum!

More data from Sweden's current outbreak of the pandemic that was supposed to have been over years ago:
In Sweden, where the pandemic officially ended in February 2021. For a country with no pandemic it sure seems to create some chaos.
Sweden Christmas time 2022 vs Christmas time 2023.
WicMar (Twitter/X, Dec 22, 2023)
Click to expand...
With news clippings translated into English.


At Sweden's biggest news site, the Chief Epidemiologist answers why we did not start vaccinations when we got it, but waited a month?
He ignores if it would have saved people & just answers its effect on the spread of the disease would be marginal.
Why ignore dead and injured?
jorgenponder (Twitter/X, Dec 21, 2023)
Click to expand...
Question and answer in Swedish and English.
 
dann said:
I made the mistake of taking Guss's question seriously!

I had forgotten about his body of work:
Click to expand...

dann said:
Guss, you should take your ranting to the Conspiracies and Conspiracy Theories subforum!

More data from Sweden's current outbreak of the pandemic that was supposed to have been over years ago:

With news clippings translated into English.



Question and answer in Swedish and English.
Click to expand...

Every single time you desperately change the subject.
Childish smears is a common tactic by those that have little to no education in vaccine research.
The question the whole world wants answered is vaxxed vs unvaxxed data and the corrupt will do anything to hide it, more and more understand as fewer and fewer will go near the "vaccines".
 
Spoken like a true antivaxxer, believing that the antivaxxer attempts to question the safety and efficacy of vaccines represent "the whole world".

As for my own country, at least 77% of the people eligible for the free booster shots of the latest updated C19 vaccines already got them. 76% got the flu shots. More will get them before the offer expires.
Vaccination mod influenza og covid-19 - 1. oktober 2023 - 15. januar 2024 (SST.dk, Dec 19, 2023)
It may look different in countries where antivaxxers hold more of a sway over the flow of information to the uneducated.

As for Guss's (allegedly "the whole world's) question about "vaxxed vs unvaxxed data":
De variantopdaterede covid-19-vacciner, som er rettet mod nyere varianter af coronavirus, og som er blevet givet siden oktober i år, giver god beskyttelse mod alvorlig sygdom.
Efterårets covid-19-vacciner reducerer risikoen for indlæggelse med 75 procent (SSI.dk, Nov 16, 2023)
Click to expand...
The variant-updated COVID-19 vaccines that have been administered since October 2023 and are targeted at the new variants of coronavirus give good protection against severe disease.
The COVID-19 vaccines this autumn reduce the risk of hospitalization by 75 percent

That is not ideal, of course. It would obviously have been much better if the vaccines completely eliminated the infection and thus the disease like the MRF vaccines, for instance. But it's still pretty good considering the no-vax alternative.
 
Guss said:
Big Pharma...
Click to expand...
Fail.

and its supporters...
Click to expand...
More fail.

dann said:
As for my own country, at least 77% of the people eligible for the free booster shots of the latest updated C19 vaccines already got them. 76% got the flu shots. More will get them before the offer expires.
Vaccination mod influenza og covid-19 - 1. oktober 2023 - 15. januar 2024 (SST.dk, Dec 19, 2023)
It may look different in countries where antivaxxers hold more of a sway over the flow of information to the uneducated.
Click to expand...
Those are excellent numbers. In New Zealand the take-up is 20% for the first booster, 11% for the second and 5% for the 3rd booster. Anti-vax attitudes aren't strong here though, so why are so few getting vaccinated? I can only presume it's because most Kiwis are selfish and lazy. They only do the right thing when they have no choice.

Reinfections here now exceed 70% in the age group from 20 to 49. These people should know better, but even with vaccinations being free they can't be bothered. Such a shame - the virus could have been all but eliminated by now if only they would take half an hour every 6 months to get the latest booster shot. Scientists and health professionals must be so disappointed to see an easily solved problem continue to fester because Kiwis are too lazy to even protect themselves. :mad:
 
dann said:
Spoken like a true antivaxxer, believing that the antivaxxer attempts to question the safety and efficacy of vaccines represent "the whole world".

As for my own country, at least 77% of the people eligible for the free booster shots of the latest updated C19 vaccines already got them. 76% got the flu shots. More will get them before the offer expires.
Vaccination mod influenza og covid-19 - 1. oktober 2023 - 15. januar 2024 (SST.dk, Dec 19, 2023)
It may look different in countries where antivaxxers hold more of a sway over the flow of information to the uneducated.

As for Guss's (allegedly "the whole world's) question about "vaxxed vs unvaxxed data":

The variant-updated COVID-19 vaccines that have been administered since October 2023 and are targeted at the new variants of coronavirus give good protection against severe disease.
The COVID-19 vaccines this autumn reduce the risk of hospitalization by 75 percent

That is not ideal, of course. It would obviously have been much better if the vaccines completely eliminated the infection and thus the disease like the MRF vaccines, for instance. But it's still pretty good considering the no-vax alternative.
Click to expand...
Nice try, aside from the bans, those who are willing to vax have absolutely plummeted worldwide, the outrageous lies/claims about the "vaccines" is a crime against humanity.
Excess deaths are another fact, hiding the vax status of those who are dying is another crime against humanity.
The corrupt fear what humanity will do to them.
Spitting on the Nuremberg code is what i call "Operation Mengele"
 
dann said:
As for Guss's (allegedly "the whole world's) question about "vaxxed vs unvaxxed data":

The variant-updated COVID-19 vaccines that have been administered since October 2023 and are targeted at the new variants of coronavirus give good protection against severe disease.
The COVID-19 vaccines this autumn reduce the risk of hospitalization by 75 percent (SSI.dk, Nov 16, 2023)
Click to expand...


The Danish article has a link to this preprint of the study it's based on:
Abstract
The XBB.1.5 updated COVID-19 mRNA vaccines currently form part of the national immunisation programmes in many countries including Denmark. Here we present a cohort analysis with national electronic health registry data estimating the protection offered by the updated vaccines against hospital admission in October 2023. After adjustment in a Cox proportional hazards regression model for sex, age, residency region and comorbidities, those who had received the seasonal COVID-19 vaccine were much less likely to have been hospitalised for COVID-19 compared with those who had not received the vaccine (HR=0.247, 95% CI 0.157, 0.389), although a negative control outcome analysis indicated that the unvaccinated group had somewhat poorer health in general. Overall, our early results indicate a high level of protection from the XBB.1.5 vaccines.
Effectiveness of the XBB.1.5 updated COVID-19 vaccine against hospitalization: a nation-wide cohort study in Denmark, October 2023 (SSRN, Nov 8, 2023)
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I guess antivaxxers must believe that Mengele was accused of having protected prisoners at Auschwitz from severe disease.
 
dann said:
The Danish article has a link to this preprint of the study it's based on:



I guess antivaxxers must believe that Mengele was accused of having protected prisoners at Auschwitz from severe disease.
Click to expand...

Your response is no better than "Nobody is safe until we're all safe"
The Nuremberg codes were broken and you support it.
Pretty obvious it is the pandemic of the vaccinated, natural immunity is a dirty word.
 
Guss said:
Big Pharma and its supporters refuse to publish the data, such a monstrous question for all humanity yet they continue to run and hide from such easily accessible data.
Pretty obvious who's the best protected.
Click to expand...

There are numerous published studies investigating vaxxed vs unvaxxed outcomes, so "Big Pharma and its supporters" aren't doing a very good job.
 
Chris_Halkides said:
USA Today debunked a false claim regarding New Zealand and vaccination. "A Dec. 3 Instagram post (direct link, archive link) questions the safety of COVID-19 vaccines.

“BREAKING: A New Zealand government whistleblower has come forward with explosive official data that shows more than 20% of the nation’s citizens that received COVID mRNA vaccines died,” reads a post from X, formerly Twitter, shared in the Instagram post. The words “COVID mRNA vaccines” are crossed out but remain legible.

The Instagram post was liked more than 2,000 times in four days. The original X post, from right-wing account Leading Report, was shared more than 1,000 times in four days."
I hope all of my Kiwi friends mark themselves "Safe" regarding misinformation about the vaccines.
Click to expand...

Yeah, that conspiracy came from a couple of our Kiwi anti-vax nutters, Lawyer Sue Grey and former broadcaster Liz Gunn

I confronted Sue Grey on her Facebook page. I asked her why, if 800,000 people are supposed to have been killed by the vaccines, where are they buried, or if their bodies were disposed of, how was that done without anyone finding out. I also pointed out that, the math doesn't stack up.

Stated in a very simple fashion, with minimum complexity, on average every person in New Zealand personally knows at least 50 people including family, friends and colleagues. If 800,000 people died specifically from vaccinations, that would mean 40 million people in New Zealand would personally know someone who died from the vaccine - except of course, there are only 5 million people in this country, and there would be a lot of cross-over. On average, every person would have eight people in their circle of 50 friends, colleagues and family members who died from the vaccinations. I have yet to meet anyone who knows anyone who died. That is because there were only four, not 800,000 as she claimed.

Her response was not unexpected.... my post was taken down, and I was blocked.
 
Guss said:
The Nuremberg codes were broken and you support it.
Click to expand...

For those who, like me, didn't previously know what the Nuremberg codes are, here's a link:
https://research.unc.edu/human-research-ethics/resources/ccm3_019064/

Now, clearly this is the new talking point that the gullible and paranoid , sorry, fearless, free-thinking truthseekers, have been primed to parrot, but it would, be interesting to see some more detail.
Guss: which specific parts of the codes have been broken, and what evidence do you have to support this claim?

Guss said:
Pretty obvious it is the pandemic of the vaccinated, natural immunity is a dirty word.
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While it may be pretty obvious to you, it isn't to me. Can you show the evidence for this claimed 'pandemic of the vaccinated'?
 
smartcooky said:
Indeed. The idea of gaining herd/natural immunity to Covid was always an impossibility. You don't even have to be a virologist to understand this!
Click to expand...

Haven't you heard?
Virology is a scam? There's no such thing as a virus now.
 
Cosmic Yak said:
For those who, like me, didn't previously know what the Nuremberg codes are, here's a link:
https://research.unc.edu/human-research-ethics/resources/ccm3_019064/

Now, clearly this is the new talking point that the gullible and paranoid , sorry, fearless, free-thinking truthseekers, have been primed to parrot, but it would, be interesting to see some more detail.
Guss: which specific parts of the codes have been broken, and what evidence do you have to support this claim?
Click to expand...

The "Nuremberg Code" thing has been around for a few years.

Here - https://www.respectfulinsolence.com/2022/09/06/covid-19-vaccines-and-the-nuremberg-code-revisited/# - is a piece from RI in which Gorski gives it the usual treatment. Note that it has long been touted by the likes of Mary Holland and RFK Jr.
 
smartcooky said:
Yeah, that conspiracy came from a couple of our Kiwi anti-vax nutters, Lawyer Sue Grey and former broadcaster Liz Gunn

I confronted Sue Grey on her Facebook page. I asked her why, if 800,000 people are supposed to have been killed by the vaccines, where are they buried, or if their bodies were disposed of, how was that done without anyone finding out. I also pointed out that, the math doesn't stack up.

Stated in a very simple fashion, with minimum complexity, on average every person in New Zealand personally knows at least 50 people including family, friends and colleagues. If 800,000 people died specifically from vaccinations, that would mean 40 million people in New Zealand would personally know someone who died from the vaccine - except of course, there are only 5 million people in this country, and there would be a lot of cross-over. On average, every person would have eight people in their circle of 50 friends, colleagues and family members who died from the vaccinations. I have yet to meet anyone who knows anyone who died. That is because there were only four, not 800,000 as she claimed.

Her response was not unexpected.... my post was taken down, and I was blocked.
Click to expand...

Wait! They're claiming that 800,000 died of the vaccines in New Zealand alone? Not globally, but in New Zealand? They're claiming that vaccinations killed off about 15% of the population of New Zealand? ******* seriously? And some people are moronic enough to believe that???
 
Foster Zygote said:
Wait! They're claiming that 800,000 died of the vaccines in New Zealand alone? Not globally, but in New Zealand? They're claiming that vaccinations killed off about 15% of the population of New Zealand? ******* seriously? And some people are moronic enough to believe that???
Click to expand...

Do the math... The claim Sue Grey and Liz Gunn were backing is that 20% of those living in New Zealand who received the Covid19 vaccinations, died as a result of the vaccine.

- The population of New Zealand is about 5 million
- 80% of the population are vaccinated.. so that's 4 million
- 20% of four million is 800,000.

Remember, that conspiracy theory thinking is not based in any form or reality.
 
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I'm getting a COVID booster in a few weeks. Just like I got my annual flu shot last October. No big deal.

I work in the travel industry and I'll point out that the Chinese have not resumed world travel at anywhere near the levels they did in 2019. The main reason is fear, but the other reason is they had 1.4 million COVID deaths in December, 2022 after easing of health restrictions for the general population. We don't have any official numbers from the PRC, but we suspect they lost a hell of a lot of people.

But sure, COVID is some kind of scam and whatnot.:rolleyes:
 
smartcooky said:
Do the math... The claim Sue Grey and Liz Gunn were backing is that 20% of those living in New Zealand who received the Covid19 vaccinations, died as a result of the vaccine.

- The population of New Zealand is about 5 million
- 80% of the population are vaccinated.. so that's 4 million
- 20% of four million is 800,000.

Remember, that conspiracy theory thinking is not based in any form or reality.
Click to expand...

The only thing left to wonder is whether she's really stupid enough to believe that herself, or if she doesn't believe it but is just taking advantage of the fact that other people are that monumentally stupid in order to increase her political power.
 
Foster Zygote said:
The only thing left to wonder is whether she's really stupid enough to believe that herself, or if she doesn't believe it but is just taking advantage of the fact that other people are that monumentally stupid in order to increase her political power.
Click to expand...

Getting low IQ crédules to believe dumb stuff is Sue Grey's stock-in-trade
 
Almost as disturbing as the pandemic are the number of anti-science, anti-vax scumbags.
 
smartcooky said:
Indeed. The idea of gaining herd/natural immunity to Covid was always an impossibility. You don't even have to be a virologist to understand this!
Click to expand...

The problem is that even within the medical domain, the term "immunity" has been used in different ways and meant different things - immunity to infection, immunity to disease, enhanced immune response

Most lay people think of it as "immunity to infection", but even then it's really "immunity to symptomatic infection"

This has caused *a lot* of miscommunication over the pandemic, some accidental, some deliberate.

The #letitrip crowd have all pretty much coalesced just on "enhanced immune response", so by that token, on normal measures and ignoring the evidence of immune system damage, between infections and vaccinations we've nearly all got "immunity" now.

Might still hospitalise you, kill you, or make you chronically ill, just not as badly! :rolleyes:
 
Carrot Flower King said:
The "Nuremberg Code" thing has been around for a few years.

Here - https://www.respectfulinsolence.com/2022/09/06/covid-19-vaccines-and-the-nuremberg-code-revisited/# - is a piece from RI in which Gorski gives it the usual treatment. Note that it has long been touted by the likes of Mary Holland and RFK Jr.
Click to expand...

Thanks for this- an interesting read.
The claim about the Nuremberg Codes is, as was almost inevitable, the usual mix of dishonesty, hyperbole and ignorance that characterises the conspiracy theory movement. It is such a shame that so many people fall for this rubbish.
 
The thing about herd immunity is that in real life it comes from the few survivors of the larger herds that were killed off by the virus, getting together to form a new herd. And it only makes them immune from that one virus, and not the next one wherein the process repeats itself.

I'm not sure how this is still an argument.
 
Ladapo's second verse the same as his first

The New York Times reported, "Florida’s surgeon general on Wednesday called for a halt to the use of Covid vaccines, citing widely debunked concerns that contaminants in the vaccine can permanently integrate into human DNA...Dr. Ladapo’s latest contention is “very irresponsible,” said John Wherry, a vaccine expert and director of the Institute for Immunology at the University of Pennsylvania."

The Guardian reported, "Dr David Gorski, professor of surgery and oncology at Wayne State University and managing editor of Science-Based Medicine, which debunks misinformation in medicine, told the newspaper: 'I’ve never seen a state health authority parrot anti-vaccine disinformation as a justification for stopping the use of a vaccine that has saved so many lives before.'"
 
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Cosmic Yak said:
For those who, like me, didn't previously know what the Nuremberg codes are, here's a link:
https://research.unc.edu/human-research-ethics/resources/ccm3_019064/

Now, clearly this is the new talking point that the gullible and paranoid , sorry, fearless, free-thinking truthseekers, have been primed to parrot, but it would, be interesting to see some more detail.
Guss: which specific parts of the codes have been broken, and what evidence do you have to support this claim?



While it may be pretty obvious to you, it isn't to me. Can you show the evidence for this claimed 'pandemic of the vaccinated'?
Click to expand...

Never to pressure or entice anyone to take an unlicensed
medical product, ever again.
But Operation Mengele(covid vax) experimented on countless children and their families in an unbelievable horror.
They lied about transmission, they lied about vax status, they lied about the DNA in the vax, they continue to lie about vax protection and death, and the gullible eat it up.
 
smartcooky said:
Indeed. The idea of gaining herd/natural immunity to Covid was always an impossibility. You don't even have to be a virologist to understand this!
Click to expand...

It's not gonna happen if you jabbed, the unvaxxed with natural immunity are never hospitalized or die of any of the variants.
It is truly a pandemic of the jabbed.
 
Guss said:
Never to pressure or entice anyone to take an unlicensed
medical product, ever again.
But Operation Mengele(covid vax) experimented on countless children and their families in an unbelievable horror.
They lied about transmission, they lied about vax status, they lied about the DNA in the vax, they continue to lie about vax protection and death, and the gullible eat it up.
Click to expand...

Cosmic Yak asked if you had evidence for your claims. A response which simply repeats them is an answer of "absolutely no evidence whatsoever". Which makes you the one who's gullible.
 
Pixel42 said:
Cosmic Yak asked if you had evidence for your claims. A response which simply repeats them is an answer of "absolutely no evidence whatsoever". Which makes you the one who's gullible.
Click to expand...
Claims ?
You mean the fact that the jab is being banned more and more, or that very few people will even touch it?
Hundreds of thousands are dying in excess and the culprit stands alone.
The corrupt won't investigate and they can care less, gee i wonder why.
As for the Nuremberg codes?
Amazing how few here even knew it exists.
The evidence is right before your eyes, but you just can't see it, at least for now.
 
Guss said:
Claims ?
You mean the fact that the jab is being banned more and more, or that very few people will even touch it?
Hundreds of thousands are dying in excess and the culprit stands alone.
The corrupt won't investigate and they can care less, gee i wonder why.
As for the Nuremberg codes?
Amazing how few here even knew it exists.
The evidence is right before your eyes, but you just can't see it, at least for now.
Click to expand...

No facts here, just more unevidenced claims.
 
Axxman300 said:
The thing about herd immunity is that in real life it comes from the few survivors of the larger herds that were killed off by the virus, getting together to form a new herd. And it only makes them immune from that one virus, and not the next one wherein the process repeats itself.

I'm not sure how this is still an argument.
Click to expand...
Have you ever heard of cowpox?
I rest.
 
Guss said:
It's not gonna happen if you jabbed, the unvaxxed with natural immunity are never hospitalized or die of any of the variants.It is truly a pandemic of the jabbed.
Click to expand...

There aren't any people with natural immunity against Covid.

And your lie flies in the face of facts... unvaccinated people become more seriously ill and die at much higher rates that those who are vaccinated. This is a verified and indisputable fact.

Note: Higher rates ≠ higher numbers.
 
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