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Cont: Today's Mass Shooting (2)

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EaglePuncher said:
Dogwhistle for "Ya'll silent as church mouses when those black people shoot someone!!!"
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And, in my opinion, I don't mind someone saying that, but they're wrong. We aren't quite as chuch mice. It's just that it happens so often that we can't react like this every time.

I'll say it again. I appreciate what Bogative does in this thread. Yeah, it seems racist to me, too. I don't care. I want people calling attention to the slaughter that goes on every day in the US. It's disgraceful. We should do something about it.

We shouldn't stop by making it harder to have guns, but we should start that way.
 
dudalb said:
I strongly disagree with the blanket condemnation of the police that is going on here but there are a lot of questions about what went on at the site. The report that the police got their own kids out, but left others is really troubling.
I understand that if the decsiion is made to storm a building in a hostage situation it should be done by units that are throughly trained to do it, and you should wati for them, but that seems not to be the only thing that happened.
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a murderer walking around killing kids in classrooms is not a 'hostage situation'

It has been mentioned before that the lesson from Columbine and subsequent school shootings is immediate and rapid action is required.
 
Thermal said:
Of course not. A half dozen should have followed Ramos right through that door and continued engaging till Ramos breathed no more. Then they could all high five and sit around the parking lot doing crowd control and smoking cigarettes with only one fatality, God willing.



Wanna bet the final version of facts is much, much worse for the brave officers reputations?
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In the video clip I saw, it seemed to me that the officers were not very close to the shooter at the time the shooter entered the building, and the shooter was concealed by a wall. I'm not sure. I don't know if what you are suggesting was possible.

One of the things that will come out is exactly what was the interraction between the on scene cops and the shooter, but that hasn't come out yet.
 
shemp said:
Texas Lt Gov Dan Patrick says our schools should be firetraps.



https://twitter.com/atrupar/status/1529819857394483200
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Another brilliant response from Dano. Not only firetraps, but lets bunch 200+ kids up at a single entrance milling around to be checked by security, metal detector and backpack search one at a time.
Kids will end up like a Russian convoy driving through Ukraine.
I'm sure the next solution is for turrets on each corner of the school with .50 cals and snipers on top the bus stops.
 
Meadmaker said:
In short, give it a rest. It's just deflection. What you are actually seeing is a lot of people saying, "See I told you so", because we say it again and again and again all the time when people get shot, but it takes 19 dead ten year olds to cause the cries to get loud enough for people like you to respond, and your response is, "We shouldn't make this political."

Yes, we should. Now would be a very good time to make this political.
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A good time to make it political, if some care so much, is ALL the time. Not just when you've got a sudden pile of dead bodies in the much-maligned TX. But week after week, these victims stack up across the country...and this thread is awfully quiet. Maybe it is less palatable for some to rant about some very famous Dem-run cities that are one step above the old west.

So, no, I don't think I will give it a rest, thank you very much. :)
 
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Thermal said:
This one doesn't warrant it's own thread yet? Just plop it in with Today's Mass Shooting? Really.
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I would say start one, but I think that would just be confusing.

It's too much work to ask the mods to move all these comments into a new thread, but if I can make an open suggestion, they could just start a thread and ask posters to move future comments to that one.

Meanwhile, three dead in Houston in another incident. All died of gunshot wounds.

https://cbsaustin.com/news/local/th...ion-sheriff-deputies-detectives-gunshot-texas

It's too easy to get guns in this country.
 
Tony99 said:
Another brilliant response from Dano. Not only firetraps, but lets bunch 200+ kids up at a single entrance milling around to be checked by security, metal detector and backpack search one at a time.
Kids will end up like a Russian convoy driving through Ukraine.
I'm sure the next solution is for turrets on each corner of the school with .50 cals and snipers on top the bus stops.
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I believe we had two entrances, but that more or less describes my experience at a Texas HS. Also more like 2,000+ kids.
 
The media loves to have something 'new' to talk about especially in this era of 24/7 news; the more sensational, the more controversial, the better. Who did it and why has been pretty much answered so they need a new topic which is questioning aka criticizing the police response before we have all the info. I've seen reporters obviously with a bias and agenda doing this.

Here is the first account I've found told by one of the surviving children inside that classroom:
A fourth grader who survived the mass shooting at Robb Elementary has shared gut-wrenching details about what he witnessed inside that classroom.

"He shot the next person’s door. We have a door in the middle. He opened it. He came in and he crouched a little bit and he said, he said, 'It's time to die,'" the boy recalled.

Authorities say the suspect barricaded himself inside a classroom and opened fire on the people inside, killing 19 children and two teachers before he was killed by law enforcement.

"When I heard the shooting through the door, I told my friend to hide under something so he won't find us," he said. “I was hiding hard. And I was telling my friend to not talk because he is going to hear us.”

The boy and four others hid under a table that had a tablecloth over it, which may have shielded them from the shooter's view and saved their lives. The boy shared heartbreaking details about what happened in that room.

“When the cops came, the cop said: 'Yell if you need help!' And one of the persons in my class said 'help.' The guy overheard and he came in and shot her," the boy said. "The cop barged into that classroom. The guy shot at the cop. And the cops started shooting.”

He said that once the shooting stopped, he came out from under the table.

“I just opened the curtain. And I just put my hand out,” he said. "I got out with my friend. I knew it was police. I saw the armor and the shield.”

He said his teachers, Irma Garcia and Eva Mireles, saved their lives.

“They were nice teachers," he said. "They went in front of my classmates to help. To save them.”
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It's been reported that the husband of one of the teachers killed, Irma Garcia, has died of a heart attack. They had four children, ages 13, 15, 19, and 23.
 
Warp12 said:
A good time to make it political, if some care so much, is ALL the time. Not just when you've got a sudden pile of dead bodies in the much-maligned TX. But week after week, these victims stack up across the country...and this thread is awfully quiet. Maybe it is less palatable for some to rant about some very famous Dem-run cities that are one step above the old west.

So, no, I don't think I will give it a rest, thank you very much. :)
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"You're not 100% perfect!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!How dare you have an opinion on anything!!!!!!!!!!"
 
EaglePuncher said:
Sure as hell we don't need Bogatives hateful and useless posts for that. What are you thinking dude...:confused:
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I'm thinking that no one else is doing it. At least at times, he calls attention to the fact that every day, people are shot to death in America.

I wish someone else would take over for him, without the racism angle. The people who die one or two at a time from gun violence are also important.


(Actually, I don't even know if he has been doing that lately. At some point I unsubscrbed to the thread. I picked up again after the Buffalo shooting.)
 
I have few humble suggestions:

Stop the "This is the only/best solution" argument. Accept that multiple responses to the problem might work well in tandem. Improved mental health services. Sensible gun control. Increased security at public places. Something else?

Don't expect a single response/solution to answer the problem. Expecting so is a good way to do nothing. All we have to do is poke holes in the other guy's solution. . .it gets thrown in the trash and we do nothing.

No solution is going to work in every case. People and situations are different. The idea that plan B wouldn't have stopped person C is often a phony argument.

Don't use the situation to settle old scores. You hate cops? Despise liberals? Don't like guns? Get over it. Hate Hillary? Think Trump should have been removed from office? Nobody cares.

Don't forget there are things you can do at a personal, family and community level.

It's going to take money, time and hard work to solve this.

---------
Dope Clock II: It's been 346 days since Bobby Menard announced plans to create "Artists Valley". So far all he has done is lie through his teeth.
 
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Thermal said:
With each and every fact coming out, it gets worse and worse.

Active shooter enters full elementary school. There is zero time from that second on to philosophize in the parking lot. It is time to engage.

How am I so sure? 20 body bags are a convincing argument. There is no counter argument except widdle powiceman was ascared.
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I agree there seems to have been a lot of incompetence shown, but I suggest the cops just going in with guns blazing might have gotten more people killed.
This is why "forced entry" is reserved to specific units who are extensively treained for it, on a level you simply don't have the resources or time to train every officer in.
 
dudalb said:
What I want to know is what SC decision is he talking about???
I share this dislike of the current court but somehow I doubt they made a ruling saying what he thinks they said.
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This from 2005:

Justices Rule Police Do Not Have a Constitutional Duty to Protect Someone

WASHINGTON, June 27 - The Supreme Court ruled on Monday that the police did not have a constitutional duty to protect a person from harm, even a woman who had obtained a court-issued protective order against a violent husband making an arrest mandatory for a violation.

The decision, with an opinion by Justice Antonin Scalia and dissents from Justices John Paul Stevens and Ruth Bader Ginsburg, overturned a ruling by a federal appeals court in Colorado. The appeals court had permitted a lawsuit to proceed against a Colorado town, Castle Rock, for the failure of the police to respond to a woman's pleas for help after her estranged husband violated a protective order by kidnapping their three young daughters, whom he eventually killed.
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Well, regarding weapons and gun control, the USA is royally ******. Try to change laws? People will stockpile weapons until the new law is in action. The new law is in action and you can't buy a gun anymore? Your neighbour Cletus has about 100 AR-15s buried in his backyard, just ask him.
 
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