The Oklahoma City Bombing Coverup

[Manny]

That is preposterous. Most of you guys will actually go and look for mostly irrelevent dirt on someone before you even address their assertions. You got a few badasses here, I will definitely give you that. Chipmunk comes to mind. But to say "oh, we address facts here, not people" is laughable at best.

We are curious about the sources for statements, and how people come to believe them, I'll give you that. Gen. Partin is a guy with legitimate explosives expertise (though it may or may not be directly relevant to a particular explosion and he may or may not be accurate about one thing or another). It certainly seems logical that he'd be a source (though not the source -- as you know, citing others) of information or at least informed speculation about a topic like a bombing. Whatever I believe about the Murrah bombing, I think, having checked, that he's a perfectly legitimate source. But again, I'm curious about how you choose to believe him or not. I'm pretty confident that you don't think it was leftists who blew up Murrah, correct? And that you don't believe that UAL flight 93 was shot down over Shanksville, PA, also correct?

As a gesture of good faith, let me tell you the kinds of questions I'm not asking you. There isn't any evidence that you're an anarchist terrorist supporter like Alek. That's why I'm not bothering with questions like how a guy like General Partin gets to such a high level in an Air Force co-opted by the NWO, or how it is that he walks the earth free to say the things he's saying now. Questions would be non-sensical when posed to a person who hasn't opined that there is a NWO which controls our every move.

 

[Huntster]

Two years ago, the university I work for hired a demolition company to take down one of our old high-rise dormitories. 12-story, reinforced concrete structure. It took them two months of heavy-duty drilling, jack-hammering, and so forth to prep the building for demolition. Then they had to place the large number of charges and wire them ever so carefully together for maximal effect.

This would be a process that would be likely to attract attention in a working building, I'd imagine.....

That is all true and valid, however, a professional demolition engineering organization is performing a precise imploding operation, designed to demolish a structure with no damage to nearby facilities, and for maximum demolishing affect (in order to facilitate outloading).

ANFO bombs (slow and cumbersome, but which materials are easily obtained and which is easily constructed) are a completely different explosion, and (when used against public facilities) are detonated with a completely different goal.

 

[Nyarlathotep]

How does your asserion negate the Highway Patrol logs and DOD memos?

Simple. Where is the evidence of these other bombs? Are you saying that people never make mistakes in high pressure situations?

On 9/11 I heard several reports that the White house and the State Department buildings were blown up. The reports were wrong. Same type of situation.

 

[conspiracybeliever]

You do realize that not all alleged points have to be refuted in one post at the same time, right?

But he's cherry picking the info. Why did he address that but not the most daming info in the post? How come no one has addressed it? And he doesn't refute anything. He just says, "that's impossible because [insert theory]."

 

[Manny]

Thanks Manny, too much CT stuff to sift through

De nada. Yeah, it took a few "minus signs" in the ol' Google box to find that one, though thinking of it now if I'd have restricted the search to .mil sites I could have saved myself some time.

 

[Nyarlathotep]

But he's cherry picking the info. Why did he address that but not the most daming info in the post? How come no one has addressed it? And he doesn't refute anything. He just says, "that's impossible because [insert theory]."

You, of all people, have no room to bitch about anyone "Cherry picking" info.

ETA, and all your doing is saying "It ahd to be the gubbmint because [insert theory]".

ETA And if you read the post, I DO address the DOD logs.

 

[conspiracybeliever]

Simple. Where is the evidence of these other bombs? Are you saying that people never make mistakes in high pressure situations?

On 9/11 I heard several reports that the White house and the State Department buildings were blown up. The reports were wrong. Same type of situation.

Well, in this case 6 govt agencies stated they had the defused bombs. Where are they now? Good question. Also, if they DIDN'T find bombs (which they all said they did), they killed people looking for them because they held back emergency and rescue teams DUE TO THE "EXISTANCE OF OTHER BOMBS"

. If you want to blow this off without thinking or researching it, be my guest "skeptic"... lol

 

[chance]

Seems to me the real problem here is not a lack of investigation nor sceptical thinking, but a lack of metaphors!


“Reds under the bed”,
“Gay’s in the closet”,
“fairies at the bottom of the garden”
Time to retire those I think, we need one for the conspiracies,

“A conspiracy behind every curtain” perhaps




“A gaggle of geese, “
“A pride of lions,”

“A plot of conspiracy theorists.” Perhaps




“A Cub is to a Lion, as a Kitten is to a cat”
“A puppy is to a dog as a hatch is to a conspiracy theorist” Perhaps

 

[conspiracybeliever]

You, of all people, have no room to bitch about anyone "Cherry picking" info.

ETA, and all your doing is saying "It ahd to be the gubbmint because [insert theory]".

I've been very specific on this subject. I've cherry picked nothing. No one is willing to address most of the key issues. Very typical.

 

[Nyarlathotep]

I've been very specific on this subject. I've cherry picked nothing. No one is willing to address most of the key issues. Very typical.

Yes, you get every bit of 'evidence' to build your case by mining the reams of info ont he subject, picking out those bits that support your preconceived notion and ignoring the rest. If that isn't cherry picking, I don't know what is.

 

[Manny]

Well, in this case 6 govt agencies stated they had the defused bombs. Where are they now? Good question. Also, if they DIDN'T find bombs (which they all said they did), they killed people looking for them because they held back emergency and rescue teams DUE TO THE "EXISTANCE OF OTHER BOMBS"

It's a fair question. Where do you think they went? Did the OKC fire department join the conspiracy? Or did the Feds take the devices away and convince OCFD to not ask why? I met a bunch of OCFD after 9-11 -- they seemed awful nice and not the type to do something like that, but you never know people, of course.

And yes -- I believe that their errors (which is what I believe they were, for the record) may have cost lives by keeping search and rescue people away from the scene. Similarly, the poor design of NYPD and FDNY's radio system cost lives on 9-11. That doesn't make it a conspiracy, it makes it an error. And failing sufficiently to dwell on those instances doesn't make people conspirators, it makes them human.

 

[J. Arthur Hastur]

Ah-ha! I found this, according to the Federal Charges against Timothy McVeigh he was charged with the murder of 11 Federal Agents from both the ATF and FBI, along with his other charges of using a weapon of mass destruction and other murder counts.

I will admit that there are dozens of webpages that mention that no ATF or FBI agents were killed in the blast but they do not cote any sources other than 'eyewitnesses', but the above is from a .pdf of the Charges against Timothy McVeigh and Terry Nichols. Of course you will say that the government added those cahrges as a further cover up.............

 

[conspiracybeliever]

These are good questions. They negate nothing.

The following entries from the Oklahoma Highway Patrol’s radio dispatch logs:

– 10:29 a.m. "There is another bomb on the south side of the bldg. Need to get away as far as possible.... Evacuate the area of the bldg immediately, evacuate the S. side of the bldg immediately."

– 10:33 a.m. "Adv CP [Advise Command Post] we poss [possibly] have another device." "If it is the one on the S. side we have already gb’d [grabbed] it." "Okay." "Did you have anything further beside the one on the S. side?" "Neg [negative]."

– 10:37 a.m. "OC Fire Dept. confirms they did find a second device in the bldg." "O.K." "Cont. [contact] all troopers and have them move all civilian personnel back 1 more block."

– 2:00 p.m. "Unable to contact ATF." "Keep tring [trying] they think they have found another device. Have one of there [sic] people contact HQ48 on the northside of the bld."

• A Forces Command, Fort McPherson, Georgia, log entry for April 19, 1995 at 11:57 a.m. which states: "Two more explosive devices were located vicinity the explosion site. Evidently intended for the rescuers."

• A DoD Atlantic Command memo from Norfolk, Virginia on April 20, 1995, which states: "A second bomb was disarmed, a third bomb was evacuated."

• A Federal Emergency Management Agency Situation Report for April 20, 1995 which reads: "A second and third bomb were located in the building. The second bomb was disarmed and the third bomb was evacuated."

http://www.thenewamerican.com/tna/1998/vo14no15/vo14no15_bombs.htm

 

[Nyarlathotep]

These are good questions. They negate nothing.

The questions do indeed negate nothing. The lack of existance of these allegedly defused bombs negates the reports.

 

[conspiracybeliever]

Ah-ha! I found this, according to the Federal Charges against Timothy McVeigh he was charged with the murder of 11 Federal Agents from both the ATF and FBI, along with his other charges of using a weapon of mass destruction and other murder counts.

I will admit that there are dozens of webpages that mention that no ATF or FBI agents were killed in the blast, but the above is from a .pdf of the Charges against Timothy McVeigh and Terry Nichols. Of course you will say that the government added those cahrges as a further cover up.............

So give me the names of the BATF agents killed. Simple.

http://worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=47320

 

[J. Arthur Hastur]

I wouldn't exactly cite the New American as a trusted news source, I'd like to see other data on alleged emergency radio transcripts, as of yet I have not found any additional sources.

 

[conspiracybeliever]

The questions do indeed negate nothing. The lack of existance of these allegedly defused bombs negates the reports.

http://www.philipdru.com/okc_stream.html

The following entries from the Oklahoma Highway Patrol’s radio dispatch logs:

– 10:29 a.m. "There is another bomb on the south side of the bldg. Need to get away as far as possible.... Evacuate the area of the bldg immediately, evacuate the S. side of the bldg immediately."

– 10:33 a.m. "Adv CP [Advise Command Post] we poss [possibly] have another device." "If it is the one on the S. side we have already gb’d [grabbed] it." "Okay." "Did you have anything further beside the one on the S. side?" "Neg [negative]."

– 10:37 a.m. "OC Fire Dept. confirms they did find a second device in the bldg." "O.K." "Cont. [contact] all troopers and have them move all civilian personnel back 1 more block."

– 2:00 p.m. "Unable to contact ATF." "Keep tring [trying] they think they have found another device. Have one of there [sic] people contact HQ48 on the northside of the bld."

• A Forces Command, Fort McPherson, Georgia, log entry for April 19, 1995 at 11:57 a.m. which states: "Two more explosive devices were located vicinity the explosion site. Evidently intended for the rescuers."

• A DoD Atlantic Command memo from Norfolk, Virginia on April 20, 1995, which states: "A second bomb was disarmed, a third bomb was evacuated."

• A Federal Emergency Management Agency Situation Report for April 20, 1995 which reads: "A second and third bomb were located in the building. The second bomb was disarmed and the third bomb was evacuated."

 

[Arkan_Wolfshade]

But he's cherry picking the info. Why did he address that but not the most daming info in the post? How come no one has addressed it? And he doesn't refute anything. He just says, "that's impossible because [insert theory]."

And what, in your opinion, is the damning piece of info that has not been addressed?

 

[conspiracybeliever]

I wouldn't exactly cite the New American as a trusted news source, I'd like to see other data on alleged emergency radio transcripts, as of yet I have not found any additional sources.

That's because you are "skeptical", right?

 

[Arkan_Wolfshade]

Well, in this case 6 govt agencies stated they had the defused bombs. Where are they now? Good question. Also, if they DIDN'T find bombs (which they all said they did), they killed people looking for them because they held back emergency and rescue teams DUE TO THE "EXISTANCE OF OTHER BOMBS"

. If you want to blow this off without thinking or researching it, be my guest "skeptic"... lol

If there were bombs that were diffused, it is, iirc, SOP to destroy them afterwards.

Regardless of whether there were bombs or not, if the people directing the rescuers had reasonable suspicion that they may have been more bombs, you don't send the rescuers into that area.