Moderated The NYPD and Molten Concrete

[leftysergeant]

I don't understand what you mean.

Concrete didn't melt - the police lied. The FDNY lied about molten steel. NASA and the USGS lied about hotspots.

Care to set me straight on the matter?

Do you think that any of this has anything to do with thermite?

 

[beachnut]

Do you think that any of this has anything to do with thermite?

He has the missile fantasy, no thermite. He says the police lied about melted concrete to support high temperatures, melted steel etc. He claims no melted steel, no melted concrete; he has something against the police.

He is a no plane fantasy person. Missiles did his fantasy; invisible ones, which look like flights 11 and 175. Plus a missile for 93 filled with DNA, and the same for 77.

The OP was actually a cut and paste of his website, where he rants about police. He claims the police lied to support a fake official story. He show evidence of aircraft landing gear stuck in a section of the exterior of the WTC which flew from the WTC to the street - debunking his no plane fantasy.

Self debunking.

 

[Sunstealer]

I don't understand what you mean.

Concrete didn't melt - the police lied. The FDNY lied about molten steel. NASA and the USGS lied about hotspots.

Care to set me straight on the matter?

I'll leave that up to C7.

P.S. None of us debunkers think that concrete melted btw. The plaque in the museum is a simple mistake.

 

[Animal]

You make it sound as if you can't make up your mind unless someone writes a "paper".

It is smarter than the troofer method of "I saw it on YouTube" it must be true."

 

[yankee451]

I'll leave that up to C7.

P.S. None of us debunkers think that concrete melted btw. The plaque in the museum is a simple mistake.

Tell me what you do believe then - were they hot enough to cause the rivers of molten steel as reported by the FDNY?

This is the New York Police Department museum's stated mission.

Incorporated in 1998, The New York City Police Museum is dedicated to preserving the history of the New York City Police Department, the world’s largest and most famous police service. The Museum strives to be an accessible resource for all the communities of the city of New York. Through its exhibitions, collections and educational programming, the Museum illustrates how the policies and culture of the NYPD have evolved over time to meet the changing needs of the City. The Museum serves as an educational institution, living memorial, and bridge of understanding between the various communities of New York, the international community and the New York City Police Department.


The Police Museum gives visitors an insider’s look at the history and traditions of the largest police service in the country and its role in the history of New York City. With artifacts that date all the way back to the Dutch settlers, visitors can discover the impact of the NYPD over the last three centuries. They will find out the reason police precincts around the nation are marked with green lights outside their doors, why officers are called “cops,” why their bosses are called “brass” and which came first, the Model T or the Highway Unit? Visitors will hear the moving stories of officers responding to the tragic attacks of September 11, 2001 and learn how the NYPD now works beyond the borders of New York City to ensure the safety of every citizen. They will also view the shields of every officer who lost their lives in the line of duty since 1857, and can contemplate the bravery and dedication it takes to be one of New York's Finest.

 

[beachnut]

Tell me what you do believe then - were they hot enough to cause the rivers of molten steel as reported by the FDNY?

This is the New York Police Department museum's stated mission.

The FDNY did not report rivers of melted steel. Why do you spread nonsense?

And the mission statement is? Why do you hate the New Your Police?

 

[LSSBB]

Tell me what you do believe then - were they hot enough to cause the rivers of molten steel as reported by the FDNY?

This is the New York Police Department museum's stated mission.

So where's that FDNY metallurgical report on the river of molten steel? Quick now, have at it! Times a wasting, there's a guy on trial in Gitmo you think is innocent.

 

[Dash80]

The propagandists don't need any such reports. They know people believe authority by virtue of their authority..

We're not all dribbing morons, we can infact make our own decisions about things.
It's ok to have a healthy skepticism of authority, but extreme paranoia is taking it a bit too far Steve.

 

[OCaptain]

You make it sound as if you can't make up your mind unless someone writes a "paper".

I am not an expert in everything, so I have no ego to check when to comes to subjects that are outside my realm of understanding.

The behavior of concrete in commercial buildings (like the WTC) when subjected to intense heat is one of those subjects that, amazingly, I am outside of my expertise.

The caption provided in the NYPD Museum that seems to speak to this, would need to have some science behind it in order for me to take it as written.

Otherwise, I'd have to conclude that they're just pulling it out of their proverbial asses.

 

[yankee451]

I am not an expert in everything, so I have no ego to check when to comes to subjects that are outside my realm of understanding.

The behavior of concrete in commercial buildings (like the WTC) when subjected to intense heat is one of those subjects that, amazingly, I am outside of my expertise.

The caption provided in the NYPD Museum that seems to speak to this, would need to have some science behind it in order for me to take it as written.

Otherwise, I'd have to conclude that they're just pulling it out of their proverbial asses.

Sooo...do you treat most information you get from museums with the same bucket of salt, or do you save that for when you're arguing without a leg to stand on?

 

[OCaptain]

Sooo...do you treat most information you get from museums with the same bucket of salt, or do you save that for when you're arguing without a leg to stand on?

Which part of my comments have no leg?? Do you think we should take museum signs at face value?

 

[HotRodDeluxe]

Do you think we should take museum signs at face value?

I have seen Roman coins in a museum collection attributed to the wrong Emperor. The OP seems to be ignoring human fallibility.

 

[beachnut]

Sooo...do you treat most information you get from museums with the same bucket of salt, or do you save that for when you're arguing without a leg to stand on?

Pushing silly, fantasy based lies to support an anti-war stand; ends justify the means, most Nixon like. You are what you hate.

Everyone agrees (except idiots in 911 truth movement, like Balsamo, or Gage) there was no melted concrete - you take a simple error and turn it into silly claptrap to attack police and fire fighters; based on your fantasy version of 911.

 

[leftysergeant]

I have seen Roman coins in a museum collection attributed to the wrong Emperor. The OP seems to be ignoring human fallibility.

I have seen pyrolusite identified as fossilized moss in basalt. Now if that fell into the hands of some whacktard who wanted to disprove evolution and show us that fossils are fake...Oy!.

 

[Jono]

Tell me what you do believe then - were they hot enough to cause the rivers of molten steel as reported by the FDNY?

First of all, it's not possible to spot what kind of a metallic compound "river" of metal would made up of. I certainly couldn't, and I've worked with industrial smithing and steel for about a decade. What I have noticed, however, is that people (laymen, basically) tend to use the word 'steel' and 'metal' a bit interchangebly. And no thermitic reaction et al could possibly create "rivers of molten steel" in any case.

Second of all, regarding this picture of the gun and the concrete:

I don't buy the idea that it got so hot that the concrete melted and then encased a gun. Why not? Well, from what I can see; the concrete clearly didn't get hot enough for it to have melted. It does, however, look like the concrete-compounds (gypsum, sulfur, dust etc) baked themselves together during impact and that the heat thereof caused the compounds to be released and fuse. This is not a mystery nor is it unheard of.

Concrete is a very complicated mixture of different metal oxides, hydroxides, and silicates (many of which form extensive, interpenetrating networks), mixed with a filler material such as gravel or rock. It does not maintain its chemical identity when heated. If concrete is heated to a high enough temperature, the hydroxides decompose to form oxides and water; the water is quickly lost as the vapor. The remaining metal oxides are quite refractory; they remain solid at very high temperatures. The rock components of concrete will decompose or melt at differing temperatures depending on their mineral composition.

So the short answer to your question is that concrete will decompose rather then melt when heated, and the clinker that remains after it cools back down will unmistakably not be concrete.

http://www.newton.dep.anl.gov/askasc.../mats05054.htm

And... if I am completely wrong on all accounts there, why would you put that kind of "damning evidence" up front for the whole world to see, especially when it is (according to you) so remarkably easy to spot the inaccuarcies? Also, if the concrete had the required 1800C+ and "melted", how would it (or the surrounding temperature even) not have melted the WTC-6 gun casing as well (which would've had a much, much lower melting point)???

 

[jaydeehess]

Tell me what you do believe then - were they hot enough to cause the rivers of molten steel as reported by the FDNY?

I dare-say that the debunkers here do not believe the accounts of 'rivers of molten steel" or the pools of molten concrete which would be a subject of this thread, and, it seems, neither do you. Yet for some reason you are arguing this point? Why?

 

[ozeco41]

Yet for some reason you are arguing this point?...

Your definition of "argument" is very generous. This could be a more appropriate description.

Why?

That is a topic of psychology which is probably unrelated to 9/11.

 

[yankee451]

I dare-say that the debunkers here do not believe the accounts of 'rivers of molten steel" or the pools of molten concrete which would be a subject of this thread, and, it seems, neither do you. Yet for some reason you are arguing this point? Why?

Since so many of you spend your time naysaying anything and everything that doesn't agree with the official story, I just wanted to see one of you state what exactly you do believe. But I notice you don't so much speak for yourself, as speak for "the debunkers here".

The point of this thread is to highlight the fact that such falsehoods were propigated by people in positions of authority. This doesn't stop you and the debunkers from believing the rest of the story told by the authorities though does it? They were wrong about molten concrete and steel, but that didn't stop them from building a museum exhibit to indoctrinate school children.

None of this bothers the "debunkers" though - they're just harmless mistakes that resulted in the murder of hundreds of thousands.

Fool me once...

 

[tsig]

Since so many of you spend your time naysaying anything and everything that doesn't agree with the official story, I just wanted to see one of you state what exactly you do believe. But I notice you don't so much speak for yourself, as speak for "the debunkers here".

The point of this thread is to highlight the fact that such falsehoods were propigated by people in positions of authority. This doesn't stop you and the debunkers from believing the rest of the story told by the authorities though does it? They were wrong about molten concrete and steel, but that didn't stop them from building a museum exhibit to indoctrinate school children.

None of this bothers the "debunkers" though - they're just harmless mistakes that resulted in the murder of hundreds of thousands.

Fool me once...

A museum curator mislabels an object so 911 is an inside job!!


The interesting thing about CTs is that you can get such a large output with such a small input of facts.

 

[yankee451]

And... if I am completely wrong on all accounts there, why would you put that kind of "damning evidence" up front for the whole world to see, especially when it is (according to you) so remarkably easy to spot the inaccuarcies? Also, if the concrete had the required 1800C+ and "melted", how would it (or the surrounding temperature even) not have melted the WTC-6 gun casing as well (which would've had a much, much lower melting point)???

Every average person I talk to about 9/11 (except the "debunkers" like you lot) believes the fires were so intense they collapsed the buildings, that "hot spots" existed for months after the attack.

I think it's obvious why they make such claims - because people believe authority by virtue of their authority, and nothing else (except debunkers who believe authority in spite of their proven lies)