Moderated The NYPD and Molten Concrete

[Spanx]

You can lead a human to knowledge but you can't male it think.

Why do you need a link for thermite melting concrete?
If you know these facts there is no need for a specific reference.
1) The thermite reaction produces molten iron at ~2482 ^oC
2) Above 1300°C to 1400°C concrete exists in the form of a melt.

Ok, so your telling me you are not going to provide a link because there is no need to

Oh, it's a shame your witty comment has a spelling mistake. Perhaps you should think a bit more often

 

[fess]

My experience with heating concrete is that it bursts into pieces - it breaks into its components before it becomes hot enough to melt, and that the "clinker" that is left when it cools down will unmistakenly not be concrete. Pumice is what comes to mind.

The police museum exhibit was built to spread the lie that not only did the concrete melt, but after it cooled, it turned back into concrete. So in addition to the fairy tale that fires fueled by office materials and human beings became so intense they melted the concrete in their path (without a blast furnace, figure THAT one out), the lava cooled back into concrete without melting the guns that were encased therein!

And now you come trotting out with the tired old thermite argument - surely the NY police museum exhibit that indoctrinated school children and adults alike into believing ridiculous imopossibilities wasn't wrong after all...no...the only thing that can melt both concrete and steel is thermite, so this is proof that not only were the police reports of molten concrete true, so were the FDNY reports of rivers of molten steel. The "hot spot" images, and the fires raging for months after the collapse are all true. The authorities are absolved. Huzza!

Snort.

I still love this line, like nothing else in the building could have melted before the “steel”. (Snort)

 

[jaydeehess]

Why would it flow away? The molten iron didn't flow away. It's there in a great glob to accept the concrete. Or was it in a 'receptacle' that was full to the brim so only the concrete lava would flow away?

(Actually this raises the point of what might manage to contain the molten iron in the first place, but I don't want to confuse you.)

It brings up the point as well as to what would be more dense, the molten steel or the molten consitituents of the concrete(various different minerals). The denser materials will sink.
There is also the possibility of some constituents of the concrete, such as calcium carbonate, that may dissolve in the liquid steel. Then there is the fact that no large resolidified globs of molten steel have ever been recovered from the debris.

 

[jaydeehess]

It also cools the molten iron on contact.. Does the iron stay molten?

In Chris' scenario it would have to. The concrete must flow away from the steel and no longer have contact with it, meaning the steel stays put while the concrete flows. One way for that to happen would be for the steel to harden, but then what was containing it in the first place that still allows the concrete to flow away?

Of course this all hinges on the caption on a 911 memorial display being completely scientifically accurate.

 

[Spanx]

To be honest or as c7 would say, in denial.

I have searched the net and all I can find is, a thermal lance melting concrete, a plasma patent and an image of molten concrete on the space shuttle launch pad.

I can't find anything about thermite melting concrete. If I could find a link to thermite melting concrete I would post it up.

What about you Chris, do you want to be honest and give a reason for not posting a link up ?

Can anyone find any information about thermite melting concrete ?

 

[DGM]

Can anyone find any information about thermite melting concrete ?

I would tend to doubt thermite would (without stupid quantities). Concrete is not a very good conductor of heat and the iron would likely solidify on contact protecting the concrete.

As far as the lance goes, I own one and I wouldn't cut concrete with it on a dare (I can do it though). Concrete does not react well to fast intense directed heat. The lance abrades the surface more than melts it. I'm not a big fan of hot stuff being blown back at me.

 

[Spanx]

In all fairness, who is to say that if it is molten concrete, it could have been created from a thermal lance during the clean up operation ?

Oh hang on, the ONLY explanation is thermite and lots of it.

 

[yankee451]

I still love this line, like nothing else in the building could have melted before the “steel”. (Snort)

I like how you guys believe anything as long as it comes from someone in authority, regardless how ridiculous. Americans suffer from a national Stockholm Syndrome.

 

[jaydeehess]

I like how you guys believe anything as long as it comes from someone in authority, regardless how ridiculous. Americans suffer from a national Stockholm Syndrome.

I like how you disbelieve everything that anyone says simply because it does not spring whole from your own imaginative mind.

I like how both of us used the word 'like' sarcastically.

BTW, I am not American.

 

[twinstead]

I like how you guys believe anything as long as it comes from someone in authority, regardless how ridiculous. Americans suffer from a national Stockholm Syndrome.

Nothing worse than being lectured about being a sheep by a sheep.

 

[Sunstealer]

I like how you guys believe anything as long as it comes from someone in authority, regardless how ridiculous. Americans suffer from a national Stockholm Syndrome.

Just like your fellow truther C7 believing that the concrete melted around the gun just because the museum has a plaque saying so.

Care to set C7 straight on the matter?

 

[beachnut]

Fantasy of missiles and no planes expert finds museum error...

I like how you guys believe anything

Not exactly what sketpics do; you got this one wrong. And you believe what you make up? You are the one who believes dumb stuff, the stuff you make up. You made a mistake, you have woo at a skeptic forum. Your fantasy of missiles, essentially claiming no one was killed on aircraft on 911. The big lie.
Have you told the ones who lost loved ones on the aircraft it was fake? Do you do anything other than fantasy?
You like movies?

... ; movies like Serpico, Internal Affairs, and the Godfather ...

You like fiction.

as long as it comes from someone in authority,

A false statement, you are at a skeptic forum and you posted a lie. This is a lie. Sorry, but you should ask before making up your answers using failed opinions.

regardless how ridiculous.

http://yankee451.com/2012/07/15/963/ Have you told the museum they made a mistake? Why do you post lies about police?
Ridiculous?
http://yankee451.com/ (ridiculous)² It is math... don't worry.
Extra credit ridiculous.
http://yankee451.com/2012/09/11/shanksville-crocodile-tears-for-the-fictional-dead/
Wow, American calling Americans murdered by terrorists, the fictional dead.

Americans suffer from a national Stockholm Syndrome.

Source? Evidence? No, you have this. http://yankee451.com/ , ridiculous.

When will you contact the museum and explain the error?

 

[leftysergeant]

My experience with heating concrete is that it bursts into pieces - it breaks into its components before it becomes hot enough to melt, and that the "clinker" that is left when it cools down will unmistakenly not be concrete. Pumice is what comes to mind.

Hogwash. It becomes vitrified like obsidian. At least that was my experience when I set off a thermite charge sitting on a concrete surface.

And now you come trotting out with the tired old thermite argument - surely the NY police museum exhibit that indoctrinated school children and adults alike into believing ridiculous imopossibilities wasn't wrong after all...no...the only thing that can melt both concrete and steel is thermite, so this is proof that not only were the police reports of molten concrete true, so were the FDNY reports of rivers of molten steel. The "hot spot" images, and the fires raging for months after the collapse are all true. The authorities are absolved. Huzza!

Snort.

All the exhibit proves is that some people whom you would expect to know better fail to do their proper research. The curator of that museum is very clearly not a member of their arson unit, nor even in communication with them.

Thermite also has sod all to do with fire that lasted for a month. It burns up RIGHT NOW or does not burn at all.

 

[OCaptain]

There has never been any evidence shown to indicate the presence of a large 'glob' molten iron, nor has there ever been any evidence shown that indicates the presence of enormous quantities of iron based thermite.

NOR has anyone demonstrated the amount of thermite required to produce a large chunk of molten concrete.

Because that requires WORK, and Truthers don't do work. Better to just keep throwing crap on the wall to see what sticks.

 

[OCaptain]

Of course this all hinges on the caption on a 911 memorial display being completely scientifically accurate.

Then, if so, one would expect a paper describing the process by which they came to this conclusion.

Has anyone on the Truthers' side asked the NYPD Museum if they commissioned such a study?

 

[yankee451]

Just like your fellow truther C7 believing that the concrete melted around the gun just because the museum has a plaque saying so.

Care to set C7 straight on the matter?

I don't understand what you mean.

Concrete didn't melt - the police lied. The FDNY lied about molten steel. NASA and the USGS lied about hotspots.

Care to set me straight on the matter?

 

[yankee451]

Then, if so, one would expect a paper describing the process by which they came to this conclusion.

Has anyone on the Truthers' side asked the NYPD Museum if they commissioned such a study?

You make it sound as if you can't make up your mind unless someone writes a "paper".

 

[beachnut]

NASA and USGS did not lie.

... NASA and the USGS lied about hotspots.

Care to set me straight on the matter?

You posted a lie. NASA found hot spots, but no hot enough to melt steel or concrete. So NASA did not lie, you did.
USGS did not say there were temperatures hot enough to melt steel or concrete. So you lied twice.

The police did not say steel melted, or concrete melted, you said they said it. Another lie.

The museum made an error, but the WTC site was hot; the pile was on fire for months, fire is hot. You failed to make a point, and have not corrected the museum. What do you do beside making up the silly missile fantasy, and hate police?

 

[HotRodDeluxe]

Molten concrete?

 

[leftysergeant]

So C7, How much Thermite does it take to melt a pound of concrete?

I once melted about half an ounce of concrete with a 6 ounce block of aluminum/calcium thermite. The vitrified concrete was about an eighth of an inch thick.