One Million Rupees Offer to prove "Homeopathy is Paranormal"

[Darat]

Whoa! I'm not sure I feel any better now that the link is working My heart really goes out to the people of Pakistan.

It is terrible that some people, like for instance Homeo Man use the fact that their country has relatively poor health coverage for the average person to cheat and swindle sick people.

When you think about it it is much worse then an equivalent quack (to use the articles word) in the UK or even the USA where good, proven effective medical treatment is readily available.

 

[MRC_Hans]

Whoa! I'm not sure I feel any better now that the link is working My heart really goes out to the people of Pakistan.

Yeah, it sort of puts the Pakistani government's interest for homeopath in perspective: Homeopathy may be ineffective, but at least it is not going to hurt anybody directly.

Hans

 

[Darat]

Yeah, it sort of puts the Pakistani government's interest for homeopath in perspective: Homeopathy may be ineffective, but at least it is not going to hurt anybody directly.

Hans

Yep it sounds as if they adopted the approach of "lesser of two evils" - they would rather people receive no treatment (i.e. the homeopathic way) then non-trained quacks dishing out potent drugs and even performing operations.

It does raise an unsettling thought. Consider all the apparent interest by the Pakistani homeopaths (who have recently posted here) in the effectiveness of low dilution (for homeopathic) remedies, I wonder are some of them using real medicines in their preparations?

(We know veterinary homeopaths in the UK have done this and then claimed the results were down to homeopathic remedies – isn’t that correct Rolfe?)

 

[Mojo]

Originally posted by Perpetual Notion
My heart really goes out to the people of Pakistan.

Their cricket team just got a good hiding as well.

And it seems that they may also be using bogus methods.

 

[Rolfe]

It does raise an unsettling thought. Consider all the apparent interest by the Pakistani homeopaths (who have recently posted here) in the effectiveness of low dilution (for homeopathic) remedies, I wonder are some of them using real medicines in their preparations?

(We know veterinary homeopaths in the UK have done this and then claimed the results were down to homeopathic remedies – isn’t that correct Rolfe?)

There is evidence to that effect. However, the situation is a little different. In that case the homoeopath wasn't claiming that the real drug was homoeopathic, he was treating with some content-free homoeopathic nonsense, and also slipping in a little injection of a powerful corticosteroid, then attributing the resulting improvement to the homoeopathy rather than to the corticosteroid - which the owner of the animal wasn't always even aware had been given.

In the EU, nothing is allowed to be sold as "homoeopathic" unless it is so dilute that it can be relied on to have no (adverse) effects. Usually 6X is the lowest dilution/potency allowed. So they can speculate all they like about 1X or 2X, the fact is that such preparations aren't allowed as "homoeopathy" in many countries, including Germany, the home of the discipline.

Also, "does it work at 1X or 2X?" Who knows? Define"it" (that is, what remedy are you talking about?), and define "works" (that is, are you talking about curing disease?) For the vast majority of homoeopathic plant-based nostrums, the simple answer is no, no active ingredient has ever been shown. And in general, no, because there is no evidence that like cures like.

Only if they're going to assert that 1X prednisolone is good for eczema, or 1X amoxycillin is good for an abscess, might we be in the territory of "works". However, we wouldn't be in the territory of homoeopathy.

Rolfe.

Why is it that someone has always quoted my bad spelling before I get round to fixing it?

 

[Darat]

...snip...

Only if they're going to assert that 1X prednisolone is good for excema, or 1X amoxycillin is good for an abscess, might we be in the territory of "works". However, we wouldn't be in the territory of homoeopathy.

Rolfe.

No but I am beginning to suspect more and more we would be in the territory of the Pakistani homeopaths that have been posting here or as Dr Aziz Khan Tank, Dr Shershah Syed and Malik Faisal call them "quacks".

(Isn't it refreshing to read Doctors and advisors to a Health Minister actually call a spade a spade? )

 

[wahrheit]

... In that case the homoeopath wasn't claiming that the real drug was homoeopathic, he was treating with some content-free homoeopathic nonsense, and also slipping in a little injection of a powerful corticosteroid, then attributing the resulting improvement to the homoeopathy rather than to the corticosteroid ...

Two days ago I saw a very pro-homeopathy "documentary" on TV. Their patients' anecdotal accounts, one by a med. doctor, went along the same lines: She said that she was prescribed a heavy dose of antibiotica, 3 times daily, by her "real" doctor. After taking the antibiotica for almost 2 weeks she was "disappointed" and went to a homeopathy quack. He gave her some of his stuff, and the same day she felt much better! (She had water in her lungs). And only one or two days later the water was completely gone. Not because she took antibiotica in large amounts over a pretty long period of time, of course, no no, the three or four sugar pills she took at the quacks' place healed her instantaneously. What a shame. She's a doctor at a hospital, incredible.

 

[MRC_Hans]

I have seen stories like that before, and actually, I suspect that overprescribing conventional doctors might be responsible for a number of homeopathic "cures". Some GPs (have met several myself) tend to put people on medication, and just leave it there. Then another problem comes along, and they just heap another midication on. In the end it is not unusual for a patient with a couple of more or less chronical ailments to take a dozen different meds, some of them not needed anymore, or in wrong doses.

The whole problem is often further confounded by some degree of self-medication.

Then along comes the homeopath and says: "Don't take all those poisonous things, take this instead!", and the patient actually gets better. The sad thing is that the same patient would fare even better if the medication had been revised regularly by the GP.

Hans

 

[Qureshi1_78]

No but I am beginning to suspect more and more we would be in the territory of the Pakistani homeopaths that have been posting here or as Dr Aziz Khan Tank, Dr Shershah Syed and Malik Faisal call them "quacks".

(Isn't it refreshing to read Doctors and advisors to a Health Minister actually call a spade a spade? )

Most of the time only allopaths create QUACKS. They allow (in each country including UK and USA etc) to assist them. At this stage they do not check their qualification due of paying low salary. When these un-professional get some experience they start their own practice under the auspices of the same or other allopaths. This is very common in European countries. Homeopaths do not practice like that. They are not quacks neither they creates quacks.

 

[Qureshi1_78]

Excellent! So you will be able to post LINKS to these pictures right here, right now?

So that Darat may put ban on him of violating rules.

This is also against the rules and ethics to force member to violate the rules.

 

[Darat]

Most of the time only allopaths create QUACKS. They allow (in each country including UK and USA etc) to assist them. At this stage they do not check their qualification due of paying low salary. When these un-professional get some experience they start their own practice under the auspices of the same or other allopaths. This is very common in European countries. Homeopaths do not practice like that. They are not quacks neither they creates quacks.

Well I’ll defer to the Pakistani authorities, after all they are the ones who should know best and they seem to think that at least some homeopaths are "quacks".

Perhaps if you object to that term you should contact the Pakistani Health Minister and ask him to discipline Dr Aziz Khan Tank, Dr Shershah Syed?

 

[Darat]

So that Darat may put ban on him of violating rules.

This is also against the rules and ethics to force member to violate the rules.

It is not against the rules here to post pictures. It is against the rules to post pictures if the content of the picture violates the rules.

 

[DrDave]

Just been browsing the nch forums, and have been interested to see what is coming out of the seminar-thingummy they had recently.

Now I don't assume to be an expert on all scientific fields, but whenever I've been to a conference, or read reports on conferences I couldn't attend, the main publications that come out of them are abstracts of what was discussed and presented, sometimes whole articles and papers, and these are published pretty quickly after the event.

What I have never learned from a seminar that I didn't attend, until now, is the type of soft-drinks attendees were served on day 1, the clocks presented to handsome attendees, the fact that all the attendees were "handsome" and the logistics of children setting up the hall - all with photographic 'evidence'.

Are we to assume that this is some form of smoke-screen to try and assure us that a gathering took place, while not actually letting us know what was discussed? When can we see the agenda for the meeting? Are abstracts, or full texts of what was discussed/presented available? Or are they that bad that you are ashamed of them and won't publish?

Dave

 

[Qureshi1_78]

You say you cannot take pictures of the women because of her beliefs. Yet you are willing to take a photograph without her knowledge.

Yes, in few cases, you can take photos without permission, just like journalist takes photos of the road demonstrations, when police force them not to take photos even then they take photos to fulfil their profession.

You then want to use her image, taken without her permission and knowing it is against her beliefs as your Avatar, which means it would appear on every single one of your posts.

If it was then may be he was showing you the exact face of allopaths work on each page what was wrong with that?

Your actions demonstrate that you are a dishonest and unethical person.

In what sense? in a sense that he showed you the real face of the allopathic work?

If you were a member of any real medical profession I would report your behaviour to them however since you belong to a group of charlatans who also lie to and cheat sick people of their money I doubt they would consider what you did was a breach of ethics since they must be as morally bankrupt as you are.

Yes, you can report your complaint at this office.

 

[Qureshi1_78]

Well I’ll defer to the Pakistani authorities, after all they are the ones who should know best and they seem to think that at least some homeopaths are "quacks".

Perhaps if you object to that term you should contact the Pakistani Health Minister and ask him to discipline Dr Aziz Khan Tank, Dr Shershah Syed?

When you say "Homeopath" then you can't say "quack". In a single sigh you are saying "homeopath" and in the same sigh you are calling them "quack". I think you need some rest after doing hard job of administration. How can you say that person is homeopath and quack too at the same time?

In Pakistan, one person can only do homeo practice when he gets four year of certification of DHMS or BHMS. Without DHMS he cannot do practice. It is in USA, UK and Other countries, non-qualified homeopaths are doing homeopathic practice but not in Pakistan.

About "Newspaper" articles? do you believe everything publishes in newspapers are correct? If "yes" then may i show few more articles on allopathy?

 

[Qureshi1_78]

It is not against the rules here to post pictures. It is against the rules to post pictures if the content of the picture violates the rules.

And that person is demanding that picture that violates the rules. That is why I said, you need some rest. Your mind is not fully on the job.

 

[Perpetual Notion]

Why don't you just post the rest of the pictures on the nch site? You've already posted the same ones you posted here over there, so obviously they don't have a problem with it. Some people from here go over there frequently enough to be able to know when they're posted and they can post the link to them. That way you don't have to worry about getting in trouble. Problem solved.

 

[Darat]

And that person is demanding that picture that violates the rules. That is why I said, you need some rest. Your mind is not fully on the job.

Your post was rather confusing so I may have misunderstood you.

Could you point out where Zep is asking a Member to break the rules?

 

[Badly Shaved Monkey]

When you say "Homeopath" then you can't say "quack".

Oh, yes we can. We do. Watch me do it.

Homeopaths are quacks. That is what they are. Some are amateur quacks. Some do it for money. Some have gone on pointless courses that hand out pretty certficates. The thing they have in common is that they are quacks.

I hope that has cleared up the confusion.

 

[Qureshi1_78]

Your post was rather confusing so I may have misunderstood you.

Could you point out where Zep is asking a Member to break the rules?

Yes, you misunderstand simple things so easily, being the reason you have some difficulty in understanding very fair contents of the posts.

First, You bound homeoman not to post such type of pictures again otherwise he will face more restriction and Zep is demanding to send more pictures of the same type again compeling him to violate that restriction rule.