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Gifford/Arizona shooter is a 9-11 Truther

BCR said:
Darn, and here I just thought I was searching for 'truth'. Turns out I'm paranoid and ignorant. Just when I was getting my self esteem back in line too :jaw-dropp
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John, I have to draw a distinction between you and other truthers. You're a truther in the most ideal sense of the world in that you actually do care for discovering the truth. But others... well, you know what Capt. Bob, Aldo, Lunchbox, and the rest are like. They have less regard for the truth than they do a used Kleenex. You earn the name, they soil it.

So don't take our disparaging takes on what truthers are to apply to you. If the rest of them were more like you, there'd be no need to disparage them.

:)

But I'll plead the fifth on your looks. If it helps any, though, AJM8125 only hits on the good looking Farmers. ;)
 
ElMondo, I was just teasing. I'm somewhat in a good mood watching the P4T implosion the past few days :)
 
BCR said:
ElMondo, I was just teasing. I'm somewhat in a good mood watching the P4T implosion the past few days :)
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Well I couldn't tell! Last guy I saw moaning about self esteem resurfaced a month afterwards with a two-tones mohawk playing the worst music you can imagine in a college band.

I wanted to tell him "Dude, you're nearly 50. Act your age". So for obvious reasons, I'm sensitive to plummeting self esteem. I don't want to see you devolve to playing second rate ska and grindcore in cheap college bars. ;):D:p
 
ElMondoHummus said:
Well I couldn't tell! Last guy I saw moaning about self esteem resurfaced a month afterwards with a two-tones mohawk playing the worst music you can imagine in a college band.
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No worries .... at my age, and after two divorces, I can safely say my self-esteem bottomed out long ago. But alas, this thread is about a wacko in AZ. I don't really think he was a 9/11 twoofer though. He seems smarter than that.
 
Thunder said:
And they say Truthers never do violent acts.
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I've not seen any evidence, other than off-hand association, "what the media is saying," and Glenn Beck's rantings, that Loughner was a "9/11 Truther." At least, it doesn't seem that he spent time on that subject in what's available online.
 
I wonder if JihadJane or INRM will condemn the shooting/shooter. Probably not.
 
tempesta29 said:
I don't see how atheism could be any less an influence on one's perception of the value of human life.
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Atheists, as a general rule, place ENORMOUS value on human life, because we know this is the only one you get. We don't have the luxury of rationalizing reckless violence by fantasizing that innocent victims will spend eternity in heaven, for example.

eta: Incidentally, I do not believe that his beliefs about 9/11 were a causal component of his behavior.
 
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tempesta29 said:
Would you like to discuss the topic of government officials, intelligence officers, high ranking military, foreign leaders et al who believe 9/11 was an inside job?
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Sure...we haven't beaten to death that appeal to authority already.
 
tempesta29 said:
Would you like to discuss the topic of government officials, intelligence officers, high ranking military, foreign leaders et al who believe 9/11 was an inside job?
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You mean people like Maj. Gen. Albert Stubblebine that thinks he can walk through walls? ie. The star of Men Who Stare At Goats. For some reason you guys give him as an example of a credible expert who believes in your conspiracy. Who'd have thought it, an insane person believes insane things!

Yes, we know you guys know how to pick em.
 
The only thing I am going to say on this topic is that this person was obviously disturbed and while 9/11 denying might have been a part of his beliefs it was likely only a part of what made him snap. While some deniers talk big with threats and such most of those people will not act out their threats. I don't like deniers but I am not going to blanket them as all potentially killers. IMO there is just as good a chance that someone who believes in the official 9/11 explanation might do something like this if they were disturbed enough.
 
The particular ideas someone this disturbed latches on to are far less important than the nature of their disturbance in predicting what types of behaviors they might be capable of.

However, their specific beliefs do point them in specific directions in terms of settling on targets of their behavior.

I also do believe that a disturbed person's mental environment can exacerbate the level of their disturbance.

A national environment of violent, paranoid, demonizing, hyperbolic rhetoric is a massive game of Russian roulette. I do believe those who engage in demagoguery have blood on their hands.
 
Somehow I knew that the shooting was caused by a lunatic from the 9/11 Truth Movement. :eye-poppi

Goes to show that Truthers are the real murderers, & they have the gull to call us a bunch of murderers.

The tables have turned, haven't they, Truthers?
 
BCR said:
Darn, and here I just thought I was searching for 'truth'. Turns out I'm paranoid and ignorant. Just when I was getting my self esteem back in line too :jaw-dropp
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No problem in seeking the Truth.........

The problem comes when you do not recognize it when you see it. Then you become a truther.
 
9/11 Chewy Defense said:
Somehow I knew that the shooting was caused by a lunatic from the 9/11 Truth Movement. :eye-poppi
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Again, there is no evidence to support that idea.

While his actions are heinous (in the least), there is nothing other than tenuous associations via the media to support he was active in the 9/11 topic.
 
SkepticGuy said:
Again, there is no evidence to support that idea.

While his actions are heinous (in the least), there is nothing other than tenuous associations via the media to support he was active in the 9/11 topic.
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why does he have to be active? If he acquired even a small part of his anti gov paranoia from the so called truth movement then they are partly to blame for his actions.
 
SkepticGuy said:
Again, there is no evidence to support that idea.

While his actions are heinous (in the least), there is nothing other than tenuous associations via the media to support he was active in the 9/11 topic.
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No evidence? Hmmm...........read the hilited section:

http://screwloosechange.blogspot.com/

"Tucson Shooter a Truther"

The Loughner they met when he was a freshman at Mountain View High School may have been socially awkward, but he was generally happy and fun to be around. The crew smoked marijuana everyday, and when they weren't going to concerts or watching movies they talked about the meaning of life and dabbled in conspiracy theories.

Mistrust of government was his defining conviction, the friends said. He believed the government was behind 9/11, and worried that governments were maneuvering to create a unified monetary system ("a New World Order currency" one friend said) so that social elites and bureaucrats could control the rest of the world.
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His friends said that, they know him!

No evidence to support my idea? Hell, it's not even my idea!

sheeplesnshills said:
why does he have to be active? If he acquired even a small part of his anti gov paranoia from the so called truth movement then they are partly to blame for his actions.
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Guilty by association!
 
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SkepticGuy said:
Again, there is no evidence to support that idea.

While his actions are heinous (in the least), there is nothing other than tenuous associations via the media to support he was active in the 9/11 topic.
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Not to be argumentative, but haven't his friends claimed that he thought 9/11 was an inside job, or something to that effect?
 
SkepticGuy said:
Again, there is no evidence to support that idea.

While his actions are heinous (in the least), there is nothing other than tenuous associations via the media to support he was active in the 9/11 topic.
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I have not even seen that yet, though I have not been watching the news today. For most truthers who post videos or comments, You can at least say "I can see where you are trying to go with that". But for what the shooter posts on the internet, The only thing you can say is.. Huh? what? It doesnt make a lick of sense. Its almost as if his right and left brain are disconnected.
 
sheeplesnshills said:
why does he have to be active? If he acquired even a small part of his anti gov paranoia from the so called truth movement then they are partly to blame for his actions.
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I can't agree. Although "truthers" do show a distrust of government there is no way you can blame one persons willingness to believe and to follow up with that group. It's like blaming violence on video games and sex on rock and roll.
 
"We" can ask him why he thinks the government is behind 911. Does that make him a 911 truther, a failure for 9 years and then proving it.
There is a greater possibility of evidence for this idiot being a 911 failed idea person, than there is for UFOs and Bigfoot.

He believed the government was behind 9/11 http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110110/ap_on_re_us/us_congresswoman_shot_gunman_11
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It is from the media, they get things right sometimes. At least this can be verified unlike UFOs, Bigfoot claims, and all 911 truth delusions.
 
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9/11 Chewy Defense said:
Goes to show that Truthers are the real murderers
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No it doesn't.

It shows one guy who held a stew of bizarre, irrational, paranoid beliefs likely fueled by a physiologically-based mental imbalance and possibly topped off with drug use is a murderer.

You cannot draw conclusions about people who share things in common with him based on his behavior, unless those things are particular forms of mental illness.
 
chipmunk stew said:
No it doesn't.

It shows one guy who held a stew of bizarre, irrational, paranoid beliefs likely fueled by a physiologically-based mental imbalance and possibly topped off with drug use is a murderer.

You cannot draw conclusions about people who share things in common with him based on his behavior, unless those things are particular forms of mental illness.
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A gun by itself doesn't pose a threat. A gun in the hand of a mentally deranged person on the other hand, is a threat. The U.S. Army isn't saying why he wasn't accepted into the branch, perhaps they felt he was a threat to them if he was issued a rifle or gun. Since he believed that the Government was "out to get him".
 
9/11 Chewy Defense said:
A gun by itself doesn't pose a threat. A gun in the hand of a mentally deranged person on the other hand, is a threat. The U.S. Army isn't saying why he wasn't accepted into the branch, perhaps they felt he was a threat to them if he was issued a rifle or gun. Since he believed that the Government was "out to get him".
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What does this have to do with him being a "truther".
 
9/11 Chewy Defense said:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110110/ap_on_re_us/us_congresswoman_shot_gunman_11
"He didn't want people to wake up and do the same thing every day. He wanted more chaos, he wanted less regularity," one friend said.

Sounds like a Truther!

"He appeared to be to me an emotional cripple or an emotional child," Coorough said. "He lacked compassion, he lacked understanding and he lacked an ability to connect."

Definantly a Truther trait!
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You sound exactly like Rush Limbaugh talking about liberals. You simply ascribe every trait you find weak or distasteful to the abstracted object of your scorn to turn it into a big straw-stuffed bogeyman. It's complete nonsense. Dehumanizing bunk.
 
DGM said:
What does this have to do with him being a "truther".
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If they snap, the result is this:

Sean Fitzgerald: Murdered his father after voices in his head told him Edward Fitzgerald was the devil.

Curtiss Maynard: Murdered his wife, Melissa Meza, 34, before killing himself.

James W. Von Brunn: Murdered Holocaust Museum security guard Stephen Tyrone Johns, 39.

Kurt Sonnenfeld: Allegedly murdered his wife, Nancy Sonnenfeld, 36.
 
chipmunk stew said:
You sound exactly like Rush Limbaugh talking about liberals. You simply ascribe every trait you find weak or distasteful to the abstracted object of your scorn to turn it into a big straw-stuffed bogeyman. It's complete nonsense. Dehumanizing bunk.
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Hey, I'm only an American Citizen, so sue me! :p

His friends are talking about him to the Media. Are you saying I'm Loughner's friend?

I'm not the 1 that pointed a gun & shot people & killed a 9 yr. old child.
 
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9/11 Chewy Defense said:
A gun by itself doesn't pose a threat. A gun in the hand of a mentally deranged person on the other hand, is a threat.
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Yeah, no kidding.
9/11 Chewy Defense said:
The U.S. Army isn't saying why he wasn't accepted into the branch, perhaps they felt he was a threat to them if he was issued a rifle or gun. Since he believed that the Government was "out to get him".
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The vast majority of "Truthers" are not paranoid schizophrenics with a penchant for violence, as this guy apparently is.

Your statement "Goes to show that Truthers are the real murderers" is broad brush bunk.
 
chipmunk stew said:
.Your statement "Goes to show that Truthers are the real murderers" is broad brush bunk.
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Care to tell that to the peoples' families these loons killed?:

Sean Fitzgerald: Murdered his father after voices in his head told him Edward Fitzgerald was the devil.

Curtiss Maynard: Murdered his wife, Melissa Meza, 34, before killing himself.

James W. Von Brunn: Murdered Holocaust Museum security guard Stephen Tyrone Johns, 39.

Kurt Sonnenfeld: Allegedly murdered his wife, Nancy Sonnenfeld, 36.

For the record: I'm not the one going around, pointing a gun & shooting these people. I have an opinion saying: "Goes to show that Truthers are the real murderers", is my opinion of them.
 
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9/11 Chewy Defense said:
If they snap, the result is this:

Sean Fitzgerald: Murdered his father after voices in his head told him Edward Fitzgerald was the devil.

Curtiss Maynard: Murdered his wife, Melissa Meza, 34, before killing himself.

James W. Von Brunn: Murdered Holocaust Museum security guard Stephen Tyrone Johns, 39.

Kurt Sonnenfeld: Allegedly murdered his wife, Nancy Sonnenfeld, 36.
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And this was because they were "truthers"?


Do you own guns?
 
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