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The biggest straw man

logger said:
Hah? Hilarious!

So what, they're just higher taxed.
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You don't know the meaning of high taxes. You're like someone that thinks that they know about hunger because they had to skip lunch.
 
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logger said:
Wouldn't you be happier with big daddy government wiping your ass?
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I'd rather live in a 'we' society than a 'me' society. I would rather our society be more concerned that we all prosper as opposed to only what each can do for themselves.

I'd rather my neighbors be healthy and happy than have an extra digit in my bank account.

I would rather not see so many people living in tents and automobiles.

I'd rather that we wage war against poverty, not on the poor.
I'd rather people be able to see a doctor before they get sick. And be able to not have to choose between buying medicine or pay their rent.
 
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acbytesla said:
I'd rather live in a 'we' society than a 'me' society. I would rather our society be more concerned that we all prosper as opposed to only what each can do for themselves.

I'd rather my neighbors be healthy and happy than have an extra digit in my bank account.

I would rather not see so many people living in tents and automobiles.

I'd rather that we wage war against poverty, not on the poor.
I'd rather people be able to see a doctor before they get sick. And be able to not have to choose between buying medicine or pay their rent.
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I'd rather see people enjoying and taking pride in helping themselves. That is the only way to be successful. I suppose it makes you "feel" like a wonderful caring person because you "say" things like this, but it doesn't get people out of poverty. its the typical liberal feel good BS.

You're espousing liberal 101, but your feelings don't get it done!;)
 
PhantomWolf said:
You don't know the meaning of high taxes. You're like someone that thinks that they know about hunger because they had to skip lunch.
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Ahh, your first clue might be my disgust for them?

Just the same as my disgust for hunger. ;)
 
logger said:
I'd rather see people enjoying and taking pride in helping themselves. That is the only way to be successful. I suppose it makes you "feel" like a wonderful caring person because you "say" things like this, but it doesn't get people out of poverty. its the typical liberal feel good BS.

You're espousing liberal 101, but your feelings don't get it done!;)
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And neither does 'sink or swim'. It just causes a lot of people to drown.
 
logger said:
Not in reality again? We have quite the safety net!

There isn't any sinking in this country.
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No we don't. I'm retired Logger and I have been doing volunteer work with the homeless and poor for the last 20 years. We provide food stamps and some housing assistance for some. Mostly women with children. Because of the Affordable Care Act, healthcare has improved but now that looks like it might be going away. All your rhetoric is we should eliminate all of it. If you're for anything that helps the poor I must have missed it. If I'm wrong, tell me. I see the way they do things in the Scandinavian countries. They manage to provide healthcare for everyone. It doesn't make them lazy good for nothings.
 
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logger said:
Actually it was a ridiculous question as I have no idea what country you're from.
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There might just be a bit of a clue in the New Zealand flag that's in their avatar.
 
acbytesla said:
No we don't. I'm retired Logger and I have been doing volunteer work with the homeless and poor for the last 20 years. We provide food stamps and some housing assistance for some. Mostly women with children. Because of the Affordable Care Act, healthcare has improved but now that looks like it might be going away. All your rhetoric is we should eliminate all of it. If you're for anything that helps the poor I must have missed it. If I'm wrong, tell me. I see the way they do things in the Scandinavian countries. They manage to provide healthcare for everyone. It doesn't make them lazy good for nothings.
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I've never advocated getting rid of the safety net nor has any conservative. I do think we should get rid of the ACA simply because it's going to fail on its own but mostly because it's cause healthcare to be unaffordable.
 
logger said:
I didn't know it was the New Zealand flag and really didn't care to find out.
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It's a pretty poor excuse for claiming it was a ridiculous question because you didn't know what PhantomWolf's country was.

What freedoms do you have that PhantomWolf's country doesn't?
 
logger said:
I've never advocated getting rid of the safety net nor has any conservative. I do think we should get rid of the ACA simply because it's going to fail on its own but mostly because it's cause healthcare to be unaffordable.
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You're right. The way we manage healthcare, it is expensive. But that because Congress is looking out for Big Pharma, the insurance industry and for profit healthcare.We pay twice as much and get less because of it. And it's not me saying it. Warren Buffett calls it the tapeworm of the American economy.

We can afford the ACA. We don't have to give a Trillion dollars tax cut. But what it really is time for is a total overhaul. It's time for single payer and let government negotiate pharmaceuticals.
 
What did Ducky do wrong, apart from getting ill?

Ducky said:
In 2003 I worked for a bank. I had insurance through a major provider here in the midwest in the US. I began having back pain. I went to see doctors I picked from that insurer's list of approved/in-plan list and they never once took imaging. I went back and went back until the pain was so severe one day I went to the emergency room twice in a 48 hour period. They gave me pain meds and said I needed physical therapy. I did the physical therapy and wound up back in the emergency room with severe back pain and numbness beginning in my legs. They took a CT of my lumbar spine (the problem was in the thoracic) determined I was having either some sort of muscular pain or was trying to scam for drugs and sent me on my way.

Then I lost my job and found myself doing temp work and the insurance ran out. I had to go to a sliding scale pay clinic here in the twin cities that made a deal to get an MRI for me at very low cost. This was now a year after initial back pain symptoms started. They found that t-9 had been completely obliterated (you can see pictures of this in the Swift article I wrote for Randi.) I was then instructed to go to MinnCare, a government sponsored program to get health care to the poor. I was told that I could not make more than 500 dollars a month to qualify for the coverage to have my operation, thereby effectively forcing me to not file for unemployment when I told my temp agency I had cancer and they let me go.

I had my surgery. It was done by some of the best doctors in the US, and cost an absolute fortune (most of which was covered my minncare.) After the surgery I had to have radiation and regular checks with bone marrow biopsies and imaging and blood work. Each visit costs literally thousands of dollars. On Jan 1, 2005 MinnCare handed my coverage off to a private insurer, the same one I had when working for the bank. Since the doctors I had now were not the doctors I had on file with the private insurance company 2 years prior they refused to pay for any of my radiation treatments or follow up exams. I could not afford to have a physical therapist help me learn to walk again, I did that on my own. All this time I had gone deeply into debt and was living off kindness of others and what little credit I still had.

The reason they stopped coverage? The original doctor had not referred me to any of those that actually did their job.

I am still fighting debt collectors over medical costs they refused to cover. I am still in a monstrous amount of debt despite earning a decent living now as an IT professional. I make a decent living and can't afford to fix or replace my ailing and trashed 10 year old jeep.

By the time I learned these things might be actionable by attorney, it was too late per Minnesota law to do anything about it (or so I was told by the attorneys I saw.)

Anyone who thinks Private insurance doesn't pull shenanigans is simply wrong. I have been all but bankrupted by this BS, all to live through cancer and a major operation on my spine.

To top it off, I have to sneak in through work group insurance policies because I have a pre-existing condition. So much for choice. The events of the last 5 years have cost me enough to consider bankruptcy.

So it's piss off and die or go bankrupt for the non-rich in this country. And the insurance company does not have the insured's best interests at heart. I am now also limited in amounts of meds per 90 days I can have for pain, etc. This is to keep me from being addicted to not having pain, apparently. If I shop around to other doctors, I break the law. If I tell people I have back pain they look at me as though I am trying to score drugs like some common street addict.

It's broken. The whole system is broken and costs way too much. I don't know what the answer is but it sure as hell is not the status quo.
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jimbob said:
What did Ducky do wrong, apart from getting ill?
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Not go bankrupt.

"The events of the last 5 years have cost me enough to consider bankruptcy."
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Only a loser 'considers' bankruptcy. Real Americans just do it, again and again. And when the banks refuse to loan them money, they go to the Russians.

Do it right and you will be a winner, perhaps even become president!
 
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