Why don't you believe in Hell?

[RebeccaBradley]

I've come into this thread late, and missed all the fun. But has anyone pointed out yet to 1inC that "Hell" in the KJV has been used indiscriminately to translate gehenna, tartarus, sheol and hades, all of which meant very different things? Which is how you can get an interesting situation like Rev. 20:14, where apparently hell itself gets cast into the lake of fire.

Here's a nice link: http://hector3000.future.easyspace.com/sheol.htm

 

[lylfyl]

1inChrist's position is that the KJV is the ONLY correct version of the Bible. I don't know if he has said it explicitly, but the implication is that the KJV is inerrant, and supercedes the original hebrew and greek writings... go figure.

That is a interesting link.
I'm always awed by the complexities of translation and balancing literal words with intended meaning.

 

[Jellby]

1inChrist's position is that the KJV is the ONLY correct version of the Bible. I don't know if he has said it explicitly, but the implication is that the KJV is inerrant, and supercedes the original hebrew and greek writings... go figure.

He has, more or less, in this thread: http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=46618 (around mid-thread)

 

[RebeccaBradley]

1inChrist's position is that the KJV is the ONLY correct version of the Bible. I don't know if he has said it explicitly, but the implication is that the KJV is inerrant, and supercedes the original hebrew and greek writings... go figure.

Yeah, weird, eh? My uncle the fundamentalist minister preached both that the original writings were directly inspired by God, and that the KJV was inerrant because its translators were also directly inspired by God. Any apparent inconsistencies were the result of Satan using our intellectual pride to deceive us, and if we humbly believed like little children, He'd explain it all to us in heaven. In other words, shut up, sit right back down in that pew, and turn your brain off.

 

[RamblingOnwards]

Actualy, I'm a little confused by it all. 1inChrist provides as support for KJV only a pamphlet 'by Dr Reagan'

http://jesus-is-lord.com/best.htm

The King James Version we have today has not been revised but purified. We still have no reason to doubt that the Bible we hold in our hands is the very word of God preserved for us in the English language.

but as far as I knew Dr. Reagan thought the premise that the KJV was the only authentic one was absurd:
http://www.lamblion.com/articles/doctrinal/Bible/Bible-02.php

The only thing sillier than the controversy is the book that sparked it. Remember the old joke? — "If the King James Version was good enough for the Apostle Paul, then it's good enough for me!" Well, Riplinger tries to convert the joke into gospel.

Two Dr. Reagen's, or am I misreading one?

 

[Lisa Simpson]

The first Dr. Reagan is listed as David F. Reagan, the second as David R. Reagan. The first one is listed as pastor of Trinity Baptist Temple, in Knoxville, but I couldn't find anything stating the second Dr. Reagan's affliation.

 

[1inChrist]

The King James Version is the only one that can be trusted. Did you know the new translation actually refer to Jesus as Lucifer!?

 

[Yaotl]

The King James Version is the only one that can be trusted. Did you know the new translation actually refer to Jesus as Lucifer!?

Show me.

 

[Jellby]

The King James Version is the only one that can be trusted. Did you know the new translation actually refer to Jesus as Lucifer!?

So only people who know ancient English can be saved?

Well, of course, you could trust someone who says (s)he understands the KJV, has read it and it says this and that... but how can you be sure it's not a Satan's trick? You have to read it by yourself... if you can. And how can you trust the English teachers you've had?

Millions of people in so-called 3rd world countries are being damned only because they live in non-English speaking countries?

 

[Jellby]

The King James Version is the only one that can be trusted. Did you know the new translation actually refer to Jesus as Lucifer!?

Well, Lucifer is a beautiful name, it means "light bearer" or something similar.

[edit] Sorry for the double reply, I thought they were two different messages

 

[Marquis de Carabas]

After much consideration, it has struck me that the real question is not why don't I believe in Hell, but why does Hell not believe in me?

 

[RamblingOnwards]

The King James Version is the only one that can be trusted. Did you know the new translation actually refer to Jesus as Lucifer!?

You reveal your ignorance of the bible.

The modern translations translate the noun that was in the original hebrew 'morning star' as is into English, rather than using the latin name for Venus - Lucifer. It's a poetic description of a fallen angel (a star falling from heaven).

Rev 26:16 simply happens to use a similar poetic phrase to describe Jesus -

16 I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.

(and this is the King James, I might add)

 

[RamblingOnwards]

The first Dr. Reagan is listed as David F. Reagan, the second as David R. Reagan.

Ah, thank you. I didn't look closely enough. What an unfortunate coincidence of names!

 

[Zamzara]

The King James Version is the only one that can be trusted. Did you know the new translation actually refer to Jesus as Lucifer!?

So the people who actually wrote the bible (not in English, and certainly not in King James's time) can't be trusted. Only after it was translated into English by a breakaway faction of Christianity did it become true. Interesting.

 

[RamblingOnwards]

Originally posted by Jellby So only people who know ancient English can be saved?

It is technically modern English, but... yes, horrifyingly that is what they are saying. The OT was only offered to Hebrew speaking people, the NT to Greek speaking people (they dodge the whole Aramaic complication), and the bible in it's entirety to English speaking people.

 

[Nyarlathotep]

So the people who actually wrote the bible (not in English, and certainly not in King James's time) can't be trusted. Only after it was translated into English by a breakaway faction of Christianity did it become true. Interesting.

And a version that was written as part of a greater effort to solidify and unite the Church of England. By that logic, 1inChrist should be an Anglican (but since he claims to meet in a church in a garage with only 10 members, I doubt it, plus even from what little I know of the Anglican church, his doctrine doesn't match theirs)

 

[control_zape]

Originally posted by Jellby
Millions of people in so-called 3rd world countries are being damned only because they live in non-English speaking countries?

Estamos fregados...

 

[1inChrist]

You can try as hard as you want to deny the Hellfire but when God lays His Judgement upon you, you will be horrified of the terrors you will face in Hell.

Consider yourself warned.

 

[Operaider]

You can try as hard as you want to deny the Hellfire but when God lays His Judgement upon you, you will be horrified of the terrors you will face in Hell.

Consider yourself warned.

You really need to get some new material

 

[1inChrist]

You really need to get some new material

You people have obviously yet to understand what I am saying. Do you not realize that right now as we speak BILLIONS of people are being TORTURED in HELL!????

Do you not care that one day you will be in Hell wondering why you didn't listen to me?