Why church is so dangerous !!!

[JonnyFive]

NO, Its amazing what is being taught in our schools.

I was approached by the teacher who was being forced to teach suicide to her students from this book of essays. It was required reading. And she came to me, because I started writing letters to the editor about the school system and what was being taught and how parents could have more input etc..

DJJ, the only name you ever gave us for this nonexistent book only showed one unrelated result on record.

Unless you're going to give us the author, title, or ISBN # along with the specific essay, then I think you're just a liar. You'll say anything to try to prove some warped point, even if it's a total fabrication.

Doesn't the Bible admonish you to not bear false witness?

 

[JimBenArm]

DJJ, the only name you ever gave us for this nonexistent book only showed one unrelated result on record.

Unless you're going to give us the author, title, or ISBN # along with the specific essay, then I think you're just a liar. You'll say anything to try to prove some warped point, even if it's a total fabrication.

Doesn't the Bible admonish you to not bear false witness?

Yeah, but it doesn't apply to prophets ministering to false skeptics. Then you can lie all you want, and The Big Guy will understand.

 

[JonnyFive]

Yeah, but it doesn't apply to prophets ministering to false skeptics. Then you can lie all you want, and The Big Guy will understand.

So you're not a damn liar if you lie to the damned?

 

[joobz]

So you're not a damn liar if you lie to the damned?

that's a keeper!

 

[Foster Zygote]

So you're not a damn liar if you lie to the damned?

What if you just gob on them?

 

[bruto]

On the forum David himself runs, he would never accept a statement like his own without corroboration. He accuses us of all sorts of prying when we ask for evidence of his personal claims, but when he's the administrator he wants photographs!

How about it, David? Actual title of book, actual name of author. If you remember the iincident well enough to discuss it here, and if you really did pursue this matter for two years, surely you can't credibly claim now that you've forgotten the name of the book or the author!

You go on and on about false skeptics not wanting the truth. But here is a claim that can easily, quickly and unequivocally be backed up in a way that no honest person could challenge. All you have to do is NAME THE BOOK AND ITS AUTHOR! If the book exists and can be found, I will read it. If it contains the material you say it contains, and if there is some reliable evidence that it was ever required reading in a school, I will say in big bold letters in this very thread that David Jay Jorodan is right. I'll put it in a big font, and color the letters red. I'll even start a new thread if you'd prefer. You've criticized me and others for not starting our own threads; well, here's your chance. NAME THE BOOK and if your claim is true, I'll start a new thread, detailing the manner in which you are right. I'll title it something like "David Jay Jordan told the truth about this." It's as simple as that. If this incident is true, it's an issue of great importance. If somewhere in a school system there's truly a required text that actually promotes or advocates suicide, this is a very bad thing, which requires pursuit. If you really cared about this issue for its own sake and that of the students, you'd spread the word, and you'd look for allies outside your own circle. TRUE skeptics want to know where this is happening, and what that book is. Tell me. I want to see that book, and judge for myself, like any TRUE skeptic, because if your claim is true and your comprehension of the content of the book is correct, it's something that should be publicized and stopped. If you are not a delusional liar, and if you actually care about truth, now is the time to do something. Tell us the name of this harmful book, so that we TRUE skeptics can make an informed judgment. Unless you can do this, your claims are worthless and irresponsible.

 

[dglas]

DJJ, the only name you ever gave us for this nonexistent book only showed one unrelated result on record.

Unless you're going to give us the author, title, or ISBN # along with the specific essay, then I think you're just a liar. You'll say anything to try to prove some warped point, even if it's a total fabrication.

Poor, David-It's-not-a-sin-if'n-I-like-it-JayJordan. For him, mere force of will is sufficient for proof. For him, his private, direct hotline to Gawd is all that's required. For him, everything he says is immediately obvious. For him, his private little fantasy world is the "real" measure of "Truth." For him, reality is subordinate to his whims. For him, the wholesale slaughter of all humanity is a good thing.

For the rest of the world, the standards are just a little bit higher...

Doesn't the Bible admonish you to not bear false witness?

This is David-It's-not-a-sin-if'n-I-like-it-JayJordan. For him, Biblical authority is a mere matter of convenience. We cannot expect him to be consistent - consistency is a dirty little logical trick people play to try to make the free-from-all-constraints prophet-wannabes make sense. Where's the fun in that?

And this is why the Church is so dangerous for Djj. It dares to tell him he must ground his thinking in something outside himself, even if it is a incoherent mass of self-contradictory ramblings. Imagine the audacity, the sheer gall! How dare they!

Then, poor Djj comes here and discovers that skeptics insist upon external empirical verification. Damn us realists, religious and non-religious alike, for daring to suggest there's a real world that must be referred to. Real worlds are so limiting...

 

[Foster Zygote]

Poor, David-It's-not-a-sin-if'n-I-like-it-JayJordan. For him, mere force of will is sufficient for proof. For him, his private, direct hotline to Gawd is all that's required. For him, everything he says is immediately obvious. For him, his private little fantasy world is the "real" measure of "Truth." For him, reality is subordinate to his whims. For him, the wholesale slaughter of all humanity is a good thing.

For the rest of the world, the standards are just a little bit higher...



This is David-It's-not-a-sin-if'n-I-like-it-JayJordan. For him, Biblical authority is a mere matter of convenience. We cannot expect him to be consistent - consistency is a dirty little logical trick people play to try to make the free-from-all-constraints prophet-wannabes make sense. Where's the fun in that?

And this is why the Church is so dangerous for Djj. It dares to tell him he must ground his thinking in something outside himself, even if it is a incoherent mass of self-contradictory ramblings. Imagine the audacity, the sheer gall! How dare they!

Then, poor Djj comes here and discovers that skeptics insist upon external empirical verification. Damn us realists, religious and non-religious alike, for daring to suggest there's a real world that must be referred to. Real worlds are so limiting...

That's quite a good summary. I must confess that I have a bit of a morbid fascination with DJJ's psychology. I have no delusions about actually getting through to him. I'm convinced that he's too far gone for that. But I am a bit mesmerized by his ability to construct a fantasy world that insulates him from reality.

 

[jsfisher]

...But I am a bit mesmerized by his ability to construct a fantasy world that insulates him from reality.

...and he is so open to sharing. He keeps inviting us to join his church/mob of satanic practices.

Sometimes, it all sounds pretty good, doesn't it? A world with sex, sex, and more sex and without consequence for any moral transgressions ('cept for crucifixion jokes; Sky Daddy doesn't take kindly to crucifixion jokes).

 

[Foster Zygote]

...and he is so open to sharing. He keeps inviting us to join his church/mob of satanic practices.

Sometimes, it all sounds pretty good, doesn't it? A world with sex, sex, and more sex and without consequence for any moral transgressions ('cept for crucifixion jokes; Sky Daddy doesn't take kindly to crucifixion jokes).

Well, another huge part of his psyche is his need for attention and praise. He needs others to join him in la la land not so much for their sake as for his. It's been my experience that most pathological liars have poor self-esteem issues.

 

[calebprime]

the book:

I'd actually like to do a little investi-Googling and see if I can find it.

Of course, as SlingBlade--I think--pointed out, the story doesn't ring true as a story about the way school systems act, either.

The most any teacher would do would be to invite discussion of different attitudes about suicide. I've never heard of a teacher advocating suicide.

But, can someone point me to whatever info we have about the book?
The post or thread where it was mentioned?

(In any case, wasn't it a book about the future?--which matters, for obvious reasons.)

 

[JonnyFive]

the book:

I'd actually like to do a little investi-Googling and see if I can find it.

Of course, as SlingBlade--I think--pointed out, the story doesn't ring true as a story about the way school systems act, either.

The most any teacher would do would be to invite discussion of different attitudes about suicide. I've never heard of a teacher advocating suicide.

But, can someone point me to whatever info we have about the book?
The post or thread where it was mentioned?

(In any case, wasn't it a book about the future?--which matters, for obvious reasons.)

DJJ claimed the book was titled "Essays of the Future."

That is all the info we have on it. Also, I think DJJ is in California. So far I've been able to find nothing verifying the existence of the book he claims or the veracity of the story at all.

Interestingly enough, if you search Google for "Essays of the Future," one of the DJJ threads here is result four.

 

[bruto]

DJJ claimed the book was titled "Essays of the Future."

That is all the info we have on it. Also, I think DJJ is in California. So far I've been able to find nothing verifying the existence of the book he claims or the veracity of the story at all.

Interestingly enough, if you search Google for "Essays of the Future," one of the DJJ threads here is result four.

I think the alleged controversy occurred in Canada, and that DJJ is somewhere around Vancouver BC.

Of course even if the book exists it's distinctly possible that DJJ's interpretation of advocacy of suicide is as ludicrously inappropriate and uncomprehending as his suggestion that "you don't want to kill Jesus" is an incitement to murder that violates forum rules. We'll never know unless he acts contrary to his usual form and actually provides truthful information.

 

[calebprime]

some possible candidates:

A Sense of the Future: Essays in Natural Philosophy by J. Bronowski

Tempest, Flute and Oz: Essays on the Future by Frederick Turner

Which Way to the Future?: Selected Essays From Analog (R) by Stanley Schmidt

The Future: An Essay on God, Temporality, and Truth by John Randolph Lucas

60.

Earth and the Human Future: Essays in Honor of Harrison Brown by Fereidun Fesharaki (Hardcover - May 1986)

65.

Man's Great Future (Essay Index Reprint Series) by Erwin D. Canham and Rod Nordell (Hardcover - Jun 1959)


America and the future;: An essay by Aldous Huxley (Unknown Binding - 1970)

94.

American philosophy and the future;: Essays for a new generation by Michael Novak (Unknown Binding - 1968)
6 Used & new from $3.00



Faith and the Future: Essays on Theology, Solidarity, and Modernity ("Concilium") by Johannes Baptist Metz and Jurgen Moltmann (Hardcover - Oct 1995)

128.

The World of Ideas: Essays on the Past and Future by George L., intro Cross (Hardcover - 1968)

 

[calebprime]

a few more possibles:

7.

Essays on the Future: In Honor of Nick Metropolis by Siegfried Hecker and Gian-Carlo Rota (Hardcover - Sep 29, 2000)

15.

Progress and Survival: An Essay on the Future of Mankind by Emile Benoit and Jack Benoit Gohn (Hardcover - Aug 15, 1980)

Ethics for a Finite World: an Essay Concerning a Sustainable Future by Herschel Elliott (Paperback - Aug 15, 2005)

28.

Preparing for the Future: An Essay on the Rights of Future Generations (Studies in Social Philosophy & Policy ; No. 2) by John Ahrens (Paperback - Jan 1, 1985)


Looking Back to the Future: 1990-1970 (Critical Voices in Art, Theory & Culture) by Griseld Pollock (Paperback - Jun 1, 2000)

Man's Future Birthright: Essays on Science and Humanity by Hermann J. Muller

 

[calebprime]

books about suicide, pro and con plus other essays by famous thinkers

Opposing Viewpoints Series - Suicide (paperback edition) (Opposing Viewpoints Series) (Board book)

Essays On Suicide And The Immortality Of The Soul by David Hume (Paperback - Jun 17, 2004)

The Myth of Sisyphus: And Other Essays by Albert Camus

A Collection of Essays by George Orwell

***** this one has both future and suicide in it !!!! maybe this one?
Science and a Future Life: With Other Essays by Frederic William Henry Myers

*************

 

[calebprime]

http://www.amazon.com/Science-Future-Life-Other-Essays/dp/142123548X


was this it?

 

[jsfisher]

The most any teacher would do would be to invite discussion of different attitudes about suicide. I've never heard of a teacher advocating suicide.

The story morphed somewhat, even as DJJ was telling it. Probably the sanest interpretation of the shifting sands that are Davidjayjordan is that a book of short stories may have been required reading, and it may have had a story with teenage suicide as a theme.

Suicide being a DJJ Forbidden Subject^TM--much like crucifixion jokes--it is from here the history line departs reality. Everyone associated with this satanic reading recommendation was accused guilty of complicity in advocating suicide. Fortunately(?!), the Big Guy in the Sky intervened some time thereafter to inflict pain, pestilence, and death on all of the involved sinners in the school district.

Amen

 

[calebprime]

maybe something by J.D. Salinger?

Another of Salinger's major short stories is "A Perfect Day for Bananafish," which he wrote just two years after returning from Army service. The tale tells of a man not unlike Salinger, a cheerful yet eccentric and somewhat depressive young war veteran, who commits suicide while on vacation.

 

[Foster Zygote]

Fortunately(?!), the Big Guy in the Sky intervened some time thereafter to inflict pain, pestilence, and death on all of the involved sinners in the school district.

Amen

Including the poor woman who helped DJJ by giving him a copy of the book.