What if Nazism wasn't anti-Semitic?

Self-defense seems to me like motive enough. A Germany which started annex left and right, and use military threat, would make a lot of people jumpy even today.
 
bigjelmapro said:
Speculation. Same goes with the alleged tests in Italy around the same period. The Nazi nuclear program was nascent at best which was all but confirmed with the detained German scientists detained during Operation Paperclip.
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Not speculation. Eyewitnesses of a mushroom cloud and the blast at night bringing light that you could read a paper by.
 
parky76 said:
The Jews, were not a state. Hence they could not declare war on anyone.

All they did was try to organize a boycott of German goods. Big deal. The world continued to buy lots of German goods up until 1938.

Here is the Nazi Hindenburg in NJ

http://thm-a01.yimg.com/nimage/9e42ae71ab351f68

here it is flying over NYC

http://www.myconfinedspace.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/07/nazi-aircraft-over-usa-500x362.jpg

some boycott, huh?
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Some Jews bought Nazi goods for Palestine in exchange for the right to immigrate.
 
MaGZ said:
Not speculation. Eyewitnesses of a mushroom cloud and the blast at night bringing light that you could read a paper by.
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Insufficient evidence. You need far more, such as the statements of the scientists and others involved in that purported test; documention of some kind detailing the design of the bomb, where it was assembled, how it was transported to the test site, and how the test was being managed; films and/or photographs of the detonation, along with other scientific measurements; documentation of what happened after the test, such as reactions of the engineers and scientists involved in the test, and reactions by the military and governmental authorities. And that is far from a complete list.

Then you need all that evidence, painstakingly and exhaustively researched, thoroughly documented and referenced, packaged all together into a hefty book. Or books.

Feel free to cite such detailed historical works which unequivocally prove a German atomic bomb detonation.
 
Corsair 115 said:
Insufficient evidence. You need far more, such as the statements of the scientists and others involved in that purported test; documention of some kind detailing the design of the bomb, where it was assembled, how it was transported to the test site, and how the test was being managed; films and/or photographs of the detonation, along with other scientific measurements; documentation of what happened after the test, such as reactions of the engineers and scientists involved in the test, and reactions by the military and governmental authorities. And that is far from a complete list.

Then you need all that evidence, painstakingly and exhaustively researched, thoroughly documented and referenced, packaged all together into a hefty book. Or books.

Feel free to cite such detailed historical works which unequivocally prove a German atomic bomb detonation.
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Don´t worry. In no time, he´ll present us with a link to a bunch of crap some conspiracy moron has published on a neo-nazi website - as usual.
 
barrymore said:
I really was not getting at anything. I was just trying to understand the influence, if any, the bigotry (and the actions resulting from it) of the Nazi party had on the motivations of other countries to engage them in war.

I have had discussions with experts on the EU, who generally believed that the formation of the EU (starting with the ECSC in 1950) was due to the tensions between Germany and France. And by tensions, I mean squabbling over political and economic resources. The EU essentially was setup to prevent another continental war. So, I was just trying to gauge whether how this fit in with factors non-political and economic, from a historical perspective.
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Well, basically, before the Kristalnacht a few other countries were luke-warm about Nazism, sometime considering him a good protection against the threat of communism or just liking his overly conservative agenda: 'Hitler rather than Blum' (referencing the French -Jewish- lefty head of state at the time) was for a time a mantra of some French conservatives.
After the night of crystal revealed the rabid anti-semitism of Hitler, this support started to falter in most of the West.

Still, it wasn't enough to raise enough outrage to start the war, there had been a pro-war faction for a long time -Churchill was quite vocal about it and the French and Soviet governments had been helping the Spanish Republican army to fight in the Spanish civil war- but people were recovering from the atrocities of WWI and the suffering of the great depression. The prospect of a war was very unpopular.

As people mentioned, France and the UK only decided to go to war after the repeated violations of treaties by Hitler made it clear that his expansionism had to be stopped and would not stop on his own.
This happened after the invasion of Tchekoslovakia and Poland.
 
Chaos said:
Don´t worry. In no time, he´ll present us with a link to a bunch of crap some conspiracy moron has published on a neo-nazi website - as usual.
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No, not this time. Eventually you will all acknowledge Germany had the bomb.
 
MaGZ said:
No, not this time. Eventually you will all acknowledge Germany had the bomb.
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Because you did not even present the usual ridiculous bullflop to prove your claims? Hardly.

I know you are not familiar with the concept, so I suggest you spend some time familiarizing yourself with the word "evidence" and its meaning before you continue.
 
Another thing is the whole anti-semitism is part and parcel of the concepts of uber/untermensch with it itself the argument for the lebensraum which is the ideological reason for the expansionism of the Nazis that lead to the invasion of Poland and the Soviet Union.

Racism was the core tenet of National Socialism and ideology was the ultimate drive behind their policies.
It's hard to pinpoint which specific aspect of the Nazi policy would have changed for, without their racism and anti-semitism, there entire worldview would have been different...
 
MaGZ said:
No, not this time. Eventually you will all acknowledge Germany had the bomb.
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I believe you have gathered this "gem" of informaton from holocaust denier, Ernst Zundel's Nazi UFO website. Zundel uses the name "Christof Friedrich", his middle names, as a pseudonym in his NAZI UFO rants.

Here is an overview of how "nutty" Zundel actually is
http://www.nizkor.org/hweb/people/z/zundel-ernst/flying-saucers/expedition.html

He also published a book.."The Hitler we loved and why"
http://www.infibeam.com/Books/info/Christof-Friedrich/The-Hitler-We-Loved-Why/1593640234.html

The Holocaust Denial industry has people like Zundel and Irving sell books to complete idiots for profit. That's why holocaust denial exists....to sell books to a captive audience of low brows.
 
Chaos said:
Because you did not even present the usual ridiculous bullflop to prove your claims? Hardly.

I know you are not familiar with the concept, so I suggest you spend some time familiarizing yourself with the word "evidence" and its meaning before you continue.
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Evidence for you and others on this forum is something that is agreed upon consensus. This standard is not always the truth.
 
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