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Trouble Ahead on the High Seas (ISM)

Dictator Cheney said:
they (UN) helped Israel getting a own state, they also can help Palestina to get a own state.
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I don't think so.


*snip* ... now we need 2 states there, and both have to be treated equal.
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I disagree. We do not 'need' 2-States. To be totally honest --- in my view, the Palestinians are demonstrating their incapability of even forming a proper State.
http://haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1015084.html
I do not expect a breakthrough in the current round of (HAMAS-FATAH) talks. I believe the conditions are not ripe and the situation in Gaza and the West Bank does not point to the parties being prepared to reconcile," one of the officials said.

Furthermore, the "Palestina" entity would require being a protectorate of Israel. No other opton is within the realm of possibilities.
(See: Hezbollah)
 
webfusion said:
I don't think so.





I disagree. We do not 'need' 2-States. To be totally honest --- in my view, the Palestinians are demonstrating their incapability of even forming a proper State.
http://haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1015084.html
I do not expect a breakthrough in the current round of (HAMAS-FATAH) talks. I believe the conditions are not ripe and the situation in Gaza and the West Bank does not point to the parties being prepared to reconcile," one of the officials said.

Furthermore, the "Palestina" entity would require being a protectorate of Israel. No other opton is within the realm of possibilities.
(See: Hezbollah)
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after all those years i am not supriced that the Palestinians have huge troubles creating theyr state.

what would you do with Palestina?

and to seriuosly thinking about Palestina becoming a protectorate of Israel is totaly nonsence. this way there will never be a solution there.
just like the Israelis would not accpet beeing a protectorate of Palestina the Palestinians would never accept theyr state to be a protectorate of Israel.

i think this would be the worng way.
 
Dictator Cheney said:
after all those years i am not supriced that the Palestinians have huge troubles creating theyr state.

what would you do with Palestina?
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You're not surprised that they have had troubles with creating a State? Me neither.
The Palestinians are dysfunctional.

What would I do with a State of Palestine?
Can you explain what you intend with that question?

and to seriuosly thinking about Palestina becoming a protectorate of Israel is totaly nonsence. this way there will never be a solution there.
just like the Israelis would not accpet beeing a protectorate of Palestina the Palestinians would never accept theyr state to be a protectorate of Israel.
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Stop making the mistake of placing the two on equal footing.
Israel and the Palestinians are not equal.

300px-FA22_Raptors_Oct2005_yfb_edit.jpg

Palestine State will not be deploying F-22 Raptors or any other fighter-jets -- ever!

I think this (a protectorate) would be the wrong way.
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That is the only way that Israel would agree to a Palestinian State.
You must think the Israelis are idiots to permit a Hezbollah-type arrangement in Gaza or the West Bank?
 
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Wow. I just listened to one of the morons, being all proud of 'breaking' the siege, with her bloated ego on the edge of bursting telling us how 'nothing will be the same again now' and how people will finally realize how 1,5 million people have the right to live in freedom and not in an 'open air prison'.

albara1.jpg


:boggled:
 
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FireGarden said:
The only reason I condemn the Holocaust Cartoon competition is that it was a childish tit-for-tat in response to the Danish Cartoons -- to denounce what Iran called 'Western hypocrisy on freedom of speech'.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Holocaust_Cartoon_Competition
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How can it be tit-for-tat to attack Israel and the Jews for something that occurred in a Danish newspaper? This says a lot about your view of the world as does the fact that this was your only problem with the competition.
 
gtc said:
How can it be tit-for-tat to attack Israel and the Jews for something that occurred in a Danish newspaper? This says a lot about your view of the world as does the fact that this was your only problem with the competition.
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Beautiful, isn't it. ;)
 
gtc said:
How can it be tit-for-tat to attack Israel and the Jews for something that occurred in a Danish newspaper?
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The target wasn't Israel and Jews. The target was Western hypocrisy.

All the talk in the west of "freedom of speech, freedom of speech" sounded hollow to the Iranians. Which topic would you have chosen to illustrate their claim?

Would the Danish paper have published cartoons about Denmark? I think they would. Would they have published cartoons about cartoonists? I think they would.

The Danish newspaper which printed the Mohammed cartoons said they would publish all the Holocaust cartoons. Then they said they wouldn't. Then they published only 3.

Case proven.
Not that it needed proving in such a childish way.

This says a lot about your view of the world as does the fact that this was your only problem with the competition.
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I think it cheapens the arguments of people like Avraham Burg:
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/pages/ShArt.jhtml?itemNo=868385&contrassID=2&subContrassID=14

Put Latuff's cartoon in the above interview and I have no problem with it at all. (The winning entry is the same motif, but it's too cold. Still, it would fit better in the above interview than in a silly game with Denmark.)

Put Latuff's cartoon in the Uri Avnery article I linked earlier about Yosef Lapid. Again I would have no problem with it.

So, yes, I find myself having no reason to condemn the competition except that it was a cheap and childish way to poke the west. There were individual cartoons I didn't like. But that's not the point. The idea of Holocaust cartoons isn't bad in itself.
 
FireGarden said:
So, yes, I find myself having no reason to condemn the competition except that it was a cheap and childish way to poke the west. There were individual cartoons I didn't like. But that's not the point. The idea of Holocaust cartoons isn't bad in itself.
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And again. Ah well, not really surprising.
 
Breaking News:

Israeli Police have detained Jeff Halper as he attempted to cross from Gaza back to Israel at EREZ Checkpoint. (Halper is an Israeli citizen)
http://haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1015457.html

Apparently, he violated the military decree which prohibits Israelis from entering Gaza at all.
Be interesting to see if the Israeli authorities arrest him and bring him to trial. Halper says he is not concerned.

We now return to your regularly-scheduled thread.
 
FireGarden said:
The target wasn't Israel and Jews. The target was Western hypocrisy.

All the talk in the west of "freedom of speech, freedom of speech" sounded hollow to the Iranians. Which topic would you have chosen to illustrate their claim?

Would the Danish paper have published cartoons about Denmark? I think they would. Would they have published cartoons about cartoonists? I think they would.

The Danish newspaper which printed the Mohammed cartoons said they would publish all the Holocaust cartoons. Then they said they wouldn't. Then they published only 3.

Case proven.
Not that it needed proving in such a childish way.


I think it cheapens the arguments of people like Avraham Burg:
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/pages/ShArt.jhtml?itemNo=868385&contrassID=2&subContrassID=14

Put Latuff's cartoon in the above interview and I have no problem with it at all. (The winning entry is the same motif, but it's too cold. Still, it would fit better in the above interview than in a silly game with Denmark.)

Put Latuff's cartoon in the Uri Avnery article I linked earlier about Yosef Lapid. Again I would have no problem with it.

So, yes, I find myself having no reason to condemn the competition except that it was a cheap and childish way to poke the west. There were individual cartoons I didn't like. But that's not the point. The idea of Holocaust cartoons isn't bad in itself.
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Wow.
 
gtc said:
Wow.
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So you have no argument.
I am wrong, but you can't explain why?

Do you need more time to fault the context in which I would have found the cartoons acceptable? Or do you merely disapprove of Holocaust cartoons on principle?
 
Tailgater said:
Sometimes it's a downhill war.

"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."

Your post just made me think of that quote. One of the best lines ever.
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What's it from?
 
I just came across an article and some time ago here I thought: There was something about the ISM.

I would have wished to have some more information coming from you about them, webfusion. I'm waaay too lazy to spend time on documenting those creeps. :D
 
FireGarden said:
So you have no argument.
I am wrong, but you can't explain why?

Do you need more time to fault the context in which I would have found the cartoons acceptable?

Or do you merely disapprove of Holocaust cartoons on principle?
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I have told you what issues I have with your views. I am undecided as to whether you just hate Jews and/or Israelis or whether you have such an extreme hatred of the West that you have been blinded to the immorality of your position. Either that, or you are down right ignorant. Perhjaps you are just extremely anti-social - I can't see how someone can discuss the artistic merits of such cartoons with such detachment.

Out of interest, do you actually accept that the Holocaust occurred? Are you capable of feeling sympathy for its victims?

mrbaracuda, why do you think he holds such extreme views?
 
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