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Trouble Ahead on the High Seas (ISM)

mrbaracuda said:
What a great guy they got among them! I mean, look at his masterpiece that came 2nd place in the Iranian Holocaust Cartoon Contest! Not only that, he's also revered by the Islamic Front for the Iraqi Resistance who honoured him in their PDF magazine!
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The only reason I condemn the Holocaust Cartoon competition is that it was a childish tit-for-tat in response to the Danish Cartoons -- to denounce what Iran called 'Western hypocrisy on freedom of speech'.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Holocaust_Cartoon_Competition

Latuff's contribution depicts the "security fence" as a prison wall. I like it.

Check out more of Latuff on Finklestein's site:
http://www.normanfinkelstein.com/article.php?pg=11&ar=176

This one will piss you off:
http://www.normanfinkelstein.com/img/features/latuff/show.php?nam=153

You'll also hate his "I am Palestinian" series. This one caused a stink:
http://www.sinkers.org/latuff/waap7.gif
Apparently it's anti-semitic to depict a Jewish child in Warsaw comparing himself to Palestinians. 2 years later, real life events reminded Yosef Lapid of his grandmother and drove him to talk of trials at the Hague:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/3740649.stm

The Israeli justice minister has infuriated cabinet colleagues by saying the army offensive in Gaza reminded him of his family's woes in World War II.

[...] Referring to the TV picture, Mr Lapid said he was "talking about an old woman crouching on all fours, searching for her medicines in the ruins of her house and that she made me think of my grandmother".

"I said that if we carry on like this, we will be expelled from the United Nations and those responsible will stand trial at The Hague," Mr Lapid told Israel radio, describing his argument in cabinet.

Mr Lapid, leader of the centrist Shinui party, spent part of World War II in a Budapest ghetto and lost many members of his family in the Holocaust, including a grandmother who died at Auschwitz.

He stressed that in his comment on the Rafah offensive, he was "not talking about Germany or the Nazis".
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So I like Latuff's cartoon of a Jewish child in Warsaw saying "I am Palestinian".

Uri Avnery wrote an article about Lapid's recollections:
http://www.gush-shalom.org/archives/article305.html

As could be expected, rightists attacked Lapid violently. How dare he offend the memory of the Holocaust victims? How can one make such a comparison? This is a vile manipulation by Lapid of his being a Holocaust survivor! (In Israel, it is customary that only rightists have the right to warn of a Second Holocaust, so they can compare Arafat to Hitler and the Palestinians to the Nazis.)

Lapid tried desperately to defend himself. He had no intention of making a comparison, God forbid. He had not mentioned the Holocaust at all. Besides, his second grandmother did survive the Holocaust.
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Here's another, perhaps not suitable for work:
http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image:Alan_dershowitz_by_Latuff.jpg

Not what I would call art -- it's certainly not subtle. But I don't think that's the point. In any case, I don't like that one.
 
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The Fool said:
well web....you can chant slogans and post pictures of ships but unless the blockade intercepts ships it is not a blockade. Are you saying that all future boats will be intercepted?
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I'm saying that future attempts to smuggle, or to otherwise circumvent the legal entry of goods and people into the Gaza Strip, will be thwarted.

Israel has security interests to protect, and will do so. These two dories presented no threat, and were thus allowed to proceed. Each vessel that tries this needs to be evaluated on a case-by-case basis. The blockade is not 'broken' despite these two minor examples.

See: Karine-A

See: 6 Mar 1975 Tel Aviv beachfront attack:
(terrorists land by two boats on a Tel Aviv beach, fire at passing cars, kill IDF troops and then seize a hotel).
 
Israel has security interests to protect, and will do so.
Palestinians can say the same.
While Israel has to fear import of Kalashnikovs and explosives.
Palestina has to fear import of Tanks, Ships, Submarines, Fighterjets, rockets, ....... and so on.
 
Dictator Cheney said:
Israel has security interests to protect, and will do so.
Palestinians can say the same.
While Israel has to fear import of Kalashnikovs and explosives.
Palestina has to fear import of Tanks, Ships, Submarines, Fighterjets, rockets, ....... and so on.
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Aw, the poor poor Pallies! Can't play with the big toys! Boo-hoo.
 
Dictator Cheney said:
Israel has security interests to protect, and will do so.
Palestinians can say the same.
While Israel has to fear import of Kalashnikovs and explosives.
Palestina has to fear import of Tanks, Ships, Submarines, Fighterjets, rockets, ....... and so on.
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Nope, it doesn't work like that.

"Palestina" is not a State. And even if it were to become one, the Palestina State would need to be de-militarized, and a 'protectorate' of Israel.
 
T-F declares: "The Israelis simply have not got the capacity to stop large numbers of small ships plying trade..."

That is incorrect. Israel apparently does have the capacity. For instance, right now, the Gaza fishermen are restricted. How is that accomplished if "Israel has not got the capacity"?

Also, the job of interdicting and preventing smuggling or infiltrations towards Israel (a few kilometers up the coast) is really a task best done by a Coast Guard entity. Since Israel doesn't have a Coast Guard, the function ends up being done by the IDF, and it is hard for a military command using ships armed with cannon and missiles to deal with civilian matters such as wayward fishermen or balloon-runners.
 
webfusion said:
Nope, it doesn't work like that.

"Palestina" is not a State. And even if it were to become one, the Palestina State would need to be de-militarized, and a 'protectorate' of Israel.
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why?
Palestina is not yet a regognised state indeed.
and it can not be de.militarized, sure not aslong Israel is full with WMD and other hightec killing toys.

i would agree on a "protectorate" but not of Israel, that is not realisitc.
the hate between the 2 is far to big.

both Israel and Palestina should be de militarized and a protectorate of the UN.
 
Dictator Cheney said:
no, why should israel have all the rights and palestina has no rights atall?
i see them both as equal.
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Do you understand the concept of "protectorate" ?
Here ya go -- (you're welcome)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protectorate

Gaza is not going to become a military power, that is not in the cards.
The West Bank, by virtue of its strategic hills, also cannot develop into a military power, which would threaten Israel (the distance from Tulkarm to Netanya is less than 10 miles).

Israel is NOT equal to the Palestinians.
Israel is an economic and military superpower.
The Palestinians have deteriorated into an economic basket-case because of their love for islamic terrorism and for that same reason, will never be allowed to evolve into a military superpower.

If you want the Palestinians to move forward, you have to agree that they can do so only in the context of a demilitarized and non-islamic-terrorist-based society.

The UN cannot help in that.
 
webfusion said:
Do you understand the concept of "protectorate" ?
Here ya go -- (you're welcome)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protectorate

Gaza is not going to become a military power, that is not in the cards.
The West Bank, by virtue of its strategic hills, also cannot develop into a military power, which would threaten Israel (the distance from Tulkarm to Netanya is less than 10 miles).

Israel is NOT equal to the Palestinians.
Israel is an economic and military superpower.
The Palestinians have deteriorated into an economic basket-case because of their love for islamic terrorism and for that same reason, will never be allowed to evolve into a military superpower.

If you want the Palestinians to move forward, you have to agree that they can do so only in the context of a demilitarized and non-islamic-terrorist-based society.

The UN cannot help in that.
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the religion used to justify ones terror is not important at all. Terrorism is wrong, if it is Islamic Christian or jewish terrorism.

when Palestina is a threat to Israel the is Israel to Palestina.
while i oc anti violence, i would welcome a de-militarisatio of those 2 states.
but alsong noe of them still has huge amounts of military power the other side will not settle back.
i agree that Israel is a Economic power and a military power. but does that make em better than the paliestinians? doubt it. the Palestinians have the same rights. Israel got its state also Palestina needs its state.

there was a time when Arab Israelis and Jewish Israelis lived together, but that is a long long time ago.
now we need 2 states there, and both have to be threated equal.
 
Dictator Cheney said:
they hepled Israel geting a own state, they also can help Palestina to get a own state.
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And if the "Palestina" get their own state, what do you think should happen if (oh, who am I kidding... when) the attacks don't stop? Should Israel just take their lumps and trust that the Palestinian government will take care of everything? Or should they then violate the sovereign borders of a neighboring nation and defend themselves?
 
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