Moderated The NYPD and Molten Concrete

threadworm said:
My name is Paul White, I work for local government in the UK looking after their computers. I have a first class honours degree in a science subject, and a PhD, also in a science subject. I taught at degree level for a while until the money ran out. I have two children by my first marriage, none by my second. I am 49. I am fond of cats. I play guitar and banjo. I try my best not to insult the memory of dead people or call people liars who quite clearly aren't. I have made a detailed study of the Apollo landings, see my signature. I find people who claim there were no planes involved in 9/11 contemptible and stupid. I do not take money from an employer who has benefited from an event I claim didn't happen. In that respect I am not a two faced hypocrite.

OK?

E2A - you wanted my face? fair enough, have a facebook profile picture. Try not to get too excited - not all of it is me.

[qimg]http://img543.imageshack.us/img543/9311/36288400057153740150069.jpg[/qimg]
Click to expand...

Well shrivel me timber.
 
yankee451 said:
If he exaggerated his injuries, what else did he exaggerate.
Click to expand...

Let's hold you to the same standard.

If you will exaggerate his injuries, what else have you exaggerated.
If you will lie about there being no planes, what else have you lied about.
If you will lie about missiles, what else have you lied about.
If you will lie about the jumpers, what else have you lied about.
 
Last edited:
threadworm said:
My name is Paul White, I work for local government in the UK looking after their computers. I have a first class honours degree in a science subject, and a PhD, also in a science subject. I taught at degree level for a while until the money ran out. I have two children by my first marriage, none by my second. I am 49. I am fond of cats. I play guitar and banjo. I try my best not to insult the memory of dead people or call people liars who quite clearly aren't. I have made a detailed study of the Apollo landings, see my signature. I find people who claim there were no planes involved in 9/11 contemptible and stupid. I do not take money from an employer who has benefited from an event I claim didn't happen. In that respect I am not a two faced hypocrite.

OK?

E2A - you wanted my face? fair enough, have a facebook profile picture. Try not to get too excited - not all of it is me.

[qimg]http://img543.imageshack.us/img543/9311/36288400057153740150069.jpg[/qimg]
Click to expand...


Paul,

Although I appreciate your need to show the "real you", your PhD in a science subject may impress the boys, but it doesn't address the molten concrete, does it?

Big kiss - not -

Steve
 
and your qualifications to adress any of the stuff you've, for lack of a better term, argued?
 
Wolrab said:
and your qualifications to adress any of the stuff you've, for lack of a better term, argued?
Click to expand...

What qualifications are required to recognize the fires could not have been so intense the concrete melted in its path?
 
Wolrab said:
You still basing the melted concrete on a caption at an exhibit?
Click to expand...

Even after It was shown that The Smithsonian, was capable of mistakes!
Is fifth-grader Kenton Stufflebeam smarter than the Smithsonian? The 11-year-old boy, who lives in Allegan but attends Alamo Elementary School near Kalamazoo, went with his family during winter break to the Smithsonian Institution's National Museum of Natural History in Washington.

Since it opened in 1981, millions of people have paraded past the museum's Tower of Time, a display involving prehistoric time. Not one visitor had reported anything amiss with the exhibit until Kenton noticed that a notation, in bold lettering, identified the Precambrian as an era.

Kenton knew that was wrong. His fifth-grade teacher, John Chapman, had nearly made the same mistake in a classroom earth-science lesson before catching himself.

"I knew Mr. Chapman wouldn't tell all these students" bad information, the boy told the Kalamazoo Gazette for a story published Wednesday.

So Kevin Stufflebeam took his son to the museum's information desk to report Kenton's concern on a comment form. Last week, the boy received a letter from the museum acknowledging that his observation was "spot on."

"The Precambrian is a dimensionless unit of time, which embraces all the time between the origin of Earth and the beginning of the Cambrian Period of geologic time," the letter says.

The solution to the problem would not involve advanced science but rather simply painting over the word "era," the note says.

"We did forward a copy of the comment and our paleobiology department's response to the head of the exhibits department," said Lorraine Ramsdell, educational technician for the museum.

While no previous visitors to the museum had brought up the error, it has long rankled the paleobiology department's staff, who noticed it even before the Tower of Time was erected 27 years ago, she said.

"The question is, why was it put up with that on it in the first place?" Ramsdell said.

Excited as he was to receive the correspondence from museum officials, he couldn't help but point out that it was addressed to Kenton Slufflebeam.
Click to expand...
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1995795/posts
 
@ Dog Town: Sweet! I wonder if there are any lessons that yankee451 could draw from that account? ... nah, prolly' not.
 
yankee451 said:
Paul,

Although I appreciate your need to show the "real you", your PhD in a science subject may impress the boys, but it doesn't address the molten concrete, does it?

Big kiss - not -

Steve
Click to expand...

I outed you as a two-faced hypocrite, you played the "You are hiding behind the keyboard" card. You asked for the information, thinking I wouldn't give it. You were wrong about that too.

Now, do the decent thing and resign from your job, so that you aren't taking a salary from 9/11 blood money and funding your nice house on what you claim is a lie.
 
Christopher7 said:
Some people just can't accept anything that proves temperatures far in excess of what carbon based fires can attain.

There is no reason to doubt that the plaque is correct.
Click to expand...

There is every reason to doubt it, as concrete doesn't melt in any way that resembles a phase-change that would allow it to return to its original form on cooling. It's held together and attains its hardness through chemical bonds. 'Melted' concrete, on cooling, would more resemble a pile of loose mineral material with a different chemical identity than the original.

Crushed concrete exposed to moisture, on the other hand, does a fair job of re-setting (in bulk and rolled flat it resets very well). This is probably all that happened to that exhibit.
 
GlennB said:
There is every reason to doubt it, as concrete doesn't melt in any way that resembles a phase-change that would allow it to return to its original form on cooling. It's held together and attains its hardness through chemical bonds. 'Melted' concrete, on cooling, would more resemble a pile of loose mineral material with a different chemical identity than the original.

Crushed concrete exposed to moisture, on the other hand, does a fair job of re-setting (in bulk and rolled flat it resets very well). This is probably all that happened to that exhibit.
Click to expand...
I know from experience that you cannot reconstitute concrete. The cement does not act as a bonding agent once the concrete has been broken up.

Please show your source that concrete, which is mostly sand and rock, would not melt, flow and re-harden like lava?
 
Last edited:
Just browsing through this thread and I had to LOL when I saw yankee451 post a picture of a hole in the exact shape of a jet in the side of the building, as evidence that no plane hit! (like road runner hitting the canyon floor - it would be funny if the whole thing wasn't so tragic). Talk about the elephant in the room.

unbelievable. its like talking to a four year old.
 
Christopher7 said:
I know from experience that you cannot reconstitute concrete. The cement does not act as a bonding agent once the concrete has been broken up.

Please show your source that concrete, which is mostly sand and rock, would not melt, flow and re-harden like lava?
Click to expand...

You will also know from experience that if you smash a hammer on concrete and look at the end of the hammer you will find concrete impacted on the end of the hammer. Not molten just compressed.

I look forward to Seeing your source for thermite melting concrete.

If you do provide a source? Please make sure it's not 911 related.
 
Spanx said:
You will also know from experience that if you smash a hammer on concrete and look at the end of the hammer you will find concrete impacted on the end of the hammer. Not molten just compressed.

I look forward to Seeing your source for thermite melting concrete.

If you do provide a source? Please make sure it's not 911 related.
Click to expand...
The molten concrete is one of the sources, the "meteorite" is another and the iron spheres that RJ Lee said were created from molten iron during the WTC event are yet another. The numerous professionals who saw molten steel, the "fires" that lasted for months despite a million gallons of water being poured on them, all add to the preponderance of evidence.

Thermite can explain all this evidence. There is no other known possibility.

You can recite possible alternate explanations for some of these things from the deniers playbook but you will not acknowledge that the NYPD Museum, Bart Voorsanger, RJ Lee, Mark Loizeaux and many others could be correct because you cannot accept the consequences.

Everyone is wrong except the experts at the JREF forum. You all say so, so it must be so.
 
Last edited:
Christopher7 said:
I know from experience that you cannot reconstitute concrete. The cement does not act as a bonding agent once the concrete has been broken up.
Click to expand...

Break it into simple 3" lumps and I'm sure you're right. Crush it so there are enough fines and it can reset. This is a worry for those who would use crushed concrete for railway ballast, as the crushed concrete needs washing to prevent any risk of setting.

".... in the real world not all the cement grains get exposed to water and become fully hydrated"

Meanwhile you can get a mix of limestone dust and gravel to set pretty well with no cement whatsoever being present, something I learned in 12 years working in the quarry industry.

"This study developed flowable fill mixtures containing only quarry fines, fly ash, synthetic gypsum and water, for different applications without any cement or good quality aggregates, to reduce costs significantly"

source
 
GlennB said:
Break it into simple 3" lumps and I'm sure you're right. Crush it so there are enough fines and it can reset. This is a worry for those who would use crushed concrete for railway ballast, as the crushed concrete needs washing to prevent any risk of setting.

".... in the real world not all the cement grains get exposed to water and become fully hydrated"

Meanwhile you can get a mix of limestone dust and gravel to set pretty well with no cement whatsoever being present, something I learned in 12 years working in the quarry industry.

"This study developed flowable fill mixtures containing only quarry fines, fly ash, synthetic gypsum and water, for different applications without any cement or good quality aggregates, to reduce costs significantly"

source
Click to expand...
The article talks about cement, not ground up concrete - big difference. Concrete is about 20 to 25% cement, the rest is sand and rock. Once the cement has coated the sand and rock it cannot be removed. There cannot be enough free cement to bind everything again. Furthermore, the WTC dust was not just concrete, it was everything in the buildings.

The NYPD Museum didn't just guess that this was molten concrete, they no doubt had a qualified person make the determination. They would not have put it on the plaque if they were not sure. You would like to think they are incompetent because you don't want to believe that concrete melted, but that is not a valid reason.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Share this page

ISF - Join now!

Every member here is approved by hand. No bots, no spam, just people who care about evidence and honest debate.

Membership is free!

Create your free account

Back
Top Bottom