Mueller Investigation pt4

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BadBoy said:
I disagree here I think. Probably much of the stuff is completely falsifiable (unlike Alien abductions and bigfoot), and I would be very surprised if journalists and Trump people haven't already been trying to falsify the accusations. (though if the Trump people know it's all true, I guess they wouldn't be searching for evidence to show it wasn't)

I mean for example, the pp tape story, all he needs is a concrete alibi - some evidence to show he wasn't at the place they said he was (assuming there are dates). In this case it's not the same as proving fairies don't exist.
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It's not. You're right. It's not perfectly equivalent. It may be possible to falsify certain details of the Steele Dossier. But the failure to prove something as false is not evidence it is true.
 
BadBoy said:
I mean for example, the pp tape story, all he needs is a concrete alibi - some evidence to show he wasn't at the place they said he was (assuming there are dates).
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I think Trump declared at one point he'd never spent the night in Moscow, then records surfaced indicating he had probably spent at least one night in Moscow.
 
Captain_Swoop said:
Tweet from Adam Schiff

‏Verified account
@RepAdamSchiff

The collusion evolution, by Rudy Giuliani:

- There was no collusion.

- Even if there was collusion, it‘s not a crime.

- Truth isn’t truth.

- It happened a long time ago.

- I never said there was no collusion.

- I said no collusion...with the President of the United States.
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By next week it'll be:

- I never said no collusion by the POTUS. No collusion that he ever put in writing.

By Valentine's Day:

- One signed letter isn't really "in writing". It's not an official document because it doesn't have the Presidential Seal on it. Donald Trump, private citizen is allowed to promise Chinese territory to Russia.

By Tax Day:

- They were soon to be revised launch codes, anyway. It's just locker room talk. A couple of guys showing off how much stuff they know. You can't really call that collusion.
 
acbytesla said:
It's not. You're right. It's not perfectly equivalent. It may be possible to falsify certain details of the Steele Dossier. But the failure to prove something as false is not evidence it is true.
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true.. :)
 
The Great Zaganza said:
What makes the story credible to me is that it is exactly the kind of thing Russian Putin-backed Oligarchs would do: send girls to the room of a guy they want to do business with - it's very probable that Trump (with no clue of Moscow) would not have ordered or paid for them.
It's a way to hook Trump on the lifestyle as well as create something to hold over him.
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acbytesla said:
WOW.! I absolutely disagree. According to Comey, Trump almost freaked out about the Pee Pee story. It doesn't really matter that his supporters wouldn't abandon him. It's about being a laughing stock in way that mortifies him.

I don't believe the story is likely to be true. But that doesn't mean that Trump wouldn't be extremely embarrassed about it. That's great blackmail ammo.
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Is it worth mentioning that the last I heard, Trump's bodyguard testified that he had directly turned away some ladies like that at the time in question (contradicting the previous alibi that was along the lines of "didn't even stay there for the night") and later did go to bed after some indeterminate amount of time, which, even if he was being truthful, leaves plenty of wiggle room where it could easily have happened. A real pee tape may or may not exist, and frankly, I honestly wouldn't care much either way personally, but the fact is that it's still quite plausible. I'm not sure about whether Trump would actually be embarrassed about the action, either way, so much as he would be unhappy about all the ridicule he knows that he would receive.
 
If the pee tape existed and was found, you think it’ll go into the Trump Presidential Library? I can’t think of anything else that would go in there besides printouts of thousands of poorly-spelled and barely-comprehensible tweets.
 
jnelso99 said:
If the pee tape existed and was found, you think it’ll go into the Trump Presidential Library? I can’t think of anything else that would go in there besides printouts of thousands of poorly-spelled and barely-comprehensible tweets.
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Is Trump Tweetledee or Tweetledum?
 
acbytesla said:
No, but that isn't the same thing as proving it to be true. I can't also disprove Big Foot, alien abductions, Santa or God.
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If something in dossier says someone is at a particular location at on a certain day and you have proof they were in fact somewhere else on that day, then you will have proven it to be false.

Your analogy is deeply flawed.
 
Pixel42 said:
The pee tape seems like pure spite to me. I know it was prostitutes he supposedly got to pee on the bed the Obamas had slept in whilst he watched, but that doesn't make it a "sexual matter".
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It's been characterised as such. The point is that it's salacious.

I don't think his supporters would be bothered by the pee tape, given all the other evidence of how disgusting a human being he is they've already seen and ignored, and Trump is probably proud of it. Unsure enough of how it would be generally received not to particularly want it released, but not concerned enough for it to be usable as blackmail material.
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It's not about his supporters, it's about him. You only have to look at the reception to his various boasts on places like Howard Stern, or "grab 'em by the pussy" to know his supporters would see him being a sexual assailant as either neutral or positive. Yet he still paid out a bunch of hush money to women he had affairs with and then denied, denied, denied, no matter the evidence.

Do I think it would be enough by itself to explain everything we have seen? No. I imagine that the majority of Putin's leverage comes in the form of evidence of money laundering. But do I think it's something that Trump would not want to see the light of day and which he could be blackmailed over? Yes.
 
Trump tweets

Gregg Jarrett: “Mueller’s prosecutors knew the “Dossier” was the product of bias and deception.” It was a Fake, just like so much news coverage in our Country. Nothing but a Witch Hunt, from beginning to end!
 
Molinaro said:
If something in dossier says someone is at a particular location at on a certain day and you have proof they were in fact somewhere else on that day, then you will have proven it to be false.

Your analogy is deeply flawed.
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I never said it was a perfect analogy. And who knows? It might just have happened exactly as told. But let's face it. It's a bit over the top story. It sounds made up. And from my perspective saying it's probably true because it hasn't been disproved is even more flawed.
 
fagin said:
Do you have an opinion on why they might not?
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Yes. The answer is I have no way to verify the article's claims about how much these person's would know (or of they even exist). It doesn't meet the standards for making a claim. Therefore I reject claims that these person's do or do not know what they are talking about.
 
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