Michael Brown Shooting

[Skeptic Ginger]

Only the latter is correct, and I'm curious as to where you would guess he could have obtained an ice pack if he had wanted one?

EMTs that had already arrived carry cold packs. It's a standard basic trauma supply. I keep them in my first aid kit in my car. You squeeze them, pop the inner seal, mix the chemicals and voila, instant cold pack.

Can we count you in with the rest then, doubling down on the credibility of the Breitbart GatewayPundit story?

 

[The Central Scrutinizer]

So Wilson fired two fatal shots at a man after he had tripped?

Ummm...yeah. If that's what your "analysis" tells you.

 

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Stumbling, surrendering, tripping, diving (like a football player lunges for an opponents chest to make a tackle), there could be a lot of reasons. The cop probably fired as fast as he could pull the trigger; once he started firing the muscle memory probably kept him firing until there was no more movement - witnesses described all six shots occurring in less than two seconds.

Exactly. It's amazing that people struggle with this.

 

[shuize]

So now you are conflating shoplifting some cigars with coerced sexual assault?

Michael Brown did not "shoplift" those Swisher Sweets. He just asked if he could hold them for a while. The pushing and shoving was the friendly negotiation with the shopkeeper about how long.

 

[newyorkguy]

Wait, you mean "skeptics" on this board are buying the word of Jim freaking Hoft? The same ones who've spent the week glad-handing each other about how robust their critical thinking skills are?



Critical thinking, my ass. I've dropped out of this thread for a bit since it's turned into one loud primal scream from the supporters of the cop, but for gawds sake, Jim Hoft is actually being taken at face value? He posted an X-RAY that's from a text book. No one is corroborating him. The video of the cop disputes the idea. The police chief described his injury as "swelling". Hoft lies, like all the time, and even uses white supremacist sites as sources. I know, let's see what Alex Jones has to say! I bet he's got some news too!

^^^ QFT

 

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Gee, I wonder why anyone would refuse to trust the local police?

My computer doesn't have the "UTube" program. Can you post a transcript?

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

I have asked you before about your personal experience with levels of violence, and received no response. That is okay, it is your prerogative to not reply and I am not entitled to make estimations of naïveté based upon a non response.

I would have more faith in your evaluation of the violence level, however, if I could shake the feeling that you wouldn't be making lots of noise about the brutality of officer Wilson if there had arisen a recording of him behaving exactly that way.

Are you asking about my personal experience with violence? I've been a nurse and a nurse practitioner for years. I've seen many victims of violence. I've seen many violent patients.

If Wilson shoved a person once? It would be a very minor contributing factor. But you are comparing apples and oranges. Brown was not in a position of power where public trust came into the picture.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

Wait, you mean "skeptics" on this board are buying the word of Jim freaking Hoft? The same ones who've spent the week glad-handing each other about how robust their critical thinking skills are?



Critical thinking, my ass. I've dropped out of this thread for a bit since it's turned into one loud primal scream from the supporters of the cop, but for gawds sake, Jim Hoft is actually being taken at face value? He posted an X-RAY that's from a text book. No one is corroborating him. The video of the cop disputes the idea. The police chief described his injury as "swelling". Hoft lies, like all the time, and even uses white supremacist sites as sources. I know, let's see what Alex Jones has to say! I bet he's got some news too!

Apparently they aren't even embarrassed about it.

 

[332nd]

Possible reasons that confirmation of "orbital blowout" thing haven't come out yet include:

- Darren Wilson is still alive, and HIPAA may be a consideration for him where it wouldn't be for an autopsy of the deceased Brown. Bear in mind, HIPAA might stop a government official from coming out and officially releasing this information, but it might not stop a leak of same.

- Major news outlets may have been exposed to the information but aren't coming out in a big way with it because firstly they don't want to support Wilson, and secondly may be paranoid about violating the aforementioned HIPAA thing due to the way in which the information has come to them.

- Again and again, it must be pointed out that it's an ongoing investigation and that adds a lot of red tape to release of certain info. This may be compounded by who is largely controlling the investigation now. As it has gotten more prominent, those in charge are probably bickering internally about whether anything that seems to support Wilson coming out is going to inflame tensions, etc. They may not be particularly motivated to jump through whatever hoops are necessary to get Wilson to sign a release on the information or whatever might be required... when they've already informed the public that he had a facial injury. The powers that be might right now be looking for any excuse to throw Wilson to the wolves, and making him look innocent may be a goal which is rapidly being abandoned.

Lots and lots of possibilities.

Also, it might not be true.

 

[Distracted1]

No, actually. We already know Wilson likely did something like that ordering two teens off of a tiny residential street.

Now if Wilson was laying into a mentally ill woman with his fists because she was walking on to the freeway, that would be relevant.

If the misconduct was charges of excessive force or had he been involved in the beating of the wrongly identified and wrongly arrested guy in the Ferguson jail, it would be. If he propositioned a prostitute, probably not relevant.

No, not at all. Pot might have mellowed Wilson out. Alcohol, on the other hand would have been relevant.


So now you are conflating shoplifting some cigars with coerced sexual assault? Seriously? That's bad even for you.

Do you not feel that it damages your credibility to call the pointing out that the very same level of violence followed by sex can carry a forty year sentence a " conflation " of robbery and rape, then in the same post conflate stopping people who are walking in the street from walking in the street with committing a felonious strong arm robbery. ( only the robbery has evidence BTW, there is nothing credible to prove the officer was anything less than cordial when initially stopping the two men )

 

[MattusMaximus]

I'm not one either but we can still talk about it and we can speculate.

Without evidence, speculation is worse than useless in this situation, in my opinion.

 

[Unabogie]

Apparently they aren't even embarrassed about it.

Yeah, and on that note I'm dropping out again. Not one of them is interested in actual discussion.

 

[The Central Scrutinizer]

I think this is a still of Wilson at the scene.

I see Paris, I see France,
I see Michael's underpants!

 

[MattusMaximus]

Understandable. If you had to pick a degree where MLK's recipe fails, Journalism would be right up there.

The phrase "if it bleeds, it leads" comes to mind.

And, I will point out, that both the conservative and liberal media are just as guilty on this one. It seems that most in the media are content to fan the flames.

 

[MattusMaximus]

If you keep questioning The Gospel of St. Michael, you will be labeled a racist or an apologist for dirty cops.

On the flip side, if I don't automatically label Brown as a thuggish gang-banger, there are plenty who would also label me as a "race-baiter" and "cop-hater". I've already seen plenty of such arguments.

It's b.s. all the way around.

 

[Cylinder]

EMTs that had already arrived carry cold packs. It's a standard basic trauma supply. I keep them in my first aid kit in my car. You squeeze them, pop the inner seal, mix the chemicals and voila, instant cold pack.

Can we count you in with the rest then, doubling down on the credibility of the Breitbart GatewayPundit story?

So, relying on your training and experience, if a patient presented with no icepack you would rule out orbital fracture as a potential diagnosis? It that what you're saying?

Also, no-one to my knowledge is saying the story is truth. We are saying it cannot be dismissed as fraud as earlier asserted.

 

[Skeptical Greg]

Yeah, and on that note I'm dropping out again. Not one of them is interested in actual discussion.

Again?

You were gone?

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

So, relying on your training and experience, if a patient presented with no icepack you would rule out orbital fracture as a potential diagnosis? It that what you're saying?

Still cherry picking one piece of cummulative evidence I see.

Also, no-one to my knowledge is saying the story is truth. We are saying it cannot be dismissed as fraud as earlier asserted.

Which is why I waited until there was cumulative evidence the story was fraudulent.

How much more evidence do you need?

 

[MattusMaximus]

By the way, for someone with an orbital blowout fracture, Wilson looks uninjured in the video of his pacing around at the scene.

CNN showed a close up of Wilson pacing around at the crime scene.

It's Piaget Crenshaw's: Interview and video clip

I think this is a still of Wilson at the scene.

CNN zoomed in, identified Wilson, and he was seen pacing near the body in the clip.

Between the single less than credible source, the fact no mainstream news outlets have picked up the story, and the fact Wilson is at the crime scene in videos without any obvious serious facial injury I think it's time to call the orbital fracture claim a fraud.

To be fair, I zoomed in on the photo you provided of Wilson, and it seems pretty clear to me that he's got a streak of red something going down the left side of his face. I'm guessing blood, but I don't know if it's his blood or Brown's blood; I'm also guessing that if you shoot somebody multiple times at nearly point-blank range, it's not beyond the realm of possibility that their blood might splatter on you.

However, I'm not a trained photo-analyst nor am I a trained blood-spatter technician. I'll leave this to the experts.

 

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Are you saying that cops should stop knife wielding criminals who refuse to release the weapon with "martial arts", or shoot them in the legs or something?

If he was Yoda, he could have disarmed him with The Force.