Loose Change - Part III

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On the Friday after 9/11 I received a phone call, as horrific as the attacks were I did not realize how personal the loss would be. We lost Dan, was the message. http://www.legacy.com/Sept11.asp?Page=TributeStory&PersonId=96329.

And now these CT Mother FXXking low life scum of the earth are finding ways to excuse the hijackers. They are taking the tragedy away from the victims and trying to make it about themselves. "look at me" they shout, I am the truth, I know what really happened. Don't let your government lead you around, we have the truth and if you do not believe us you are a shill,,,neo con and a lier.

Dan died because a group of Islamic terrorists wanted to make a statement and hit America hard. They succeeded, and now these anti-semitic, or anti-government or anti-corporate, agenda driven slime balls want to make a name for themselves.

Yes there is no doubt in my mind that my government failed Dan, but it was through incompetence, institutionalized incompetence not some grand conspiracy, and even if it were a conspiracy how could anyone believe these losers could uncover anything. I am surprised if they figure out how to get their zippers down before peeing themselves.

I do not know how but slime balls need to pay for what they are doing. If you know who they are Email their employers, modified versions of this letter will be going to certain University boards of Directors. Do what ever you can to make the paranoia these pricks feel justified.

Steve
 
Class said:
One of the more outrageous claims I have seen anyone make on LC.

We did not catch Saddam Hussein.
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I love the next post by nesNYC, "but I heard that the real Saddam died of natural causes in the late 90's." He heard this? What? Does he have connections in Saddam's inner circle?

What he really means is that he read it on the internet and accepts it as the gospel truth because, hey, it's on the internet, it must be true. What he doesn't realize is that it was posted by a 17-year-old punk living in his mother's basement who doesn't have a clue. And these are the same guys who claim were gullible for believing what the MSM reports. :rolleyes:

Steve S.
 
Abbyas said:
Going back downtown on Saturday.

I'd love to build my own catchy pamphlets to combat the CTers catchy pamphlets, maybe even with suggestions on how to fight problems with government without becoming a conspiracy theorist.

Any suggestions?
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Brainster's suggestions seem excellent to me. Perhaps also add some links to 9/11Myths.com and Gravy's Critique of LC and they'll be well on their way to freedom from conspiracydom. (I'm unaware of any good links to sites detailing ways of activism for good government - perhaps others could help.)

Abbyas said:
Awesome!
...
I'm gonna make me a poster saying "9/11 was NOT an inside job. But Manipulating Evidence Can Still Be Fun!"
...
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I don't get it. Perhaps just have "9/11 was NOT an inside job" and hand out pamphlets to people being targeted by Troofers.

If I wasn't so terribly far away I would come and help. I appreciate your efforts, Abby, thankyou.
 
Kent1 said:
Im not done researching this yet, but I thought I would post some interesting links on melted/molten steel and reports from various OTHER fires.


OK so lets start looking at claims of "molten" or "melted steel".

http://www.muskogeephoenix.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20051130/NEWS01/511300303/1002
The house where Ingle said she grew up has burned into a rubble of broken bricks and pools of melted aluminum, plastic and steel.

http://godetia.com/dirt/closet/005012.html
Fire temperatures exceeded 2000 degrees. The flames melted steel and turned brick to ashes.

http://www.kthv.com/news/news.aspx?storyid=15436
He says the fire was so hot, the melted steel beams look like pieces of bent licorice.


http://www.coverall.net/customers/rocky_mountain_log_homes_print.html
The steel walls contained the fire, it became like a 'blast furnace' inside. The heat literally bent and melted one inch thick steel.


http://dailybulletin.com/entertainment/ci_3982478
Melted plastic, paint, steel and electrical components from the refrigerator, stove and microwave mixed together to create an unbearably rancid stench.



http://66.218.69.11/search/cache?p=...teel+house+fire&d=ED93WzmtNBh2&icp=1&.intl=us
A study of the 1991 Oakland fire that burned 3,000 homes
revealed the presence of melted copper in over 80% of the burned structures, and
what appeared to be melted steel in over 90% of the burned structures. With respect
to steel, looks can be deceiving. What appears to be melted may be merely oxidized.

http://www.wcpo.com/news/2005/local/10/11/fire.html
The fire reached temperatures of 2,000 degrees, which melted steel beams, investigators said.

http://www.ajchomefinder.com/newsinclude/c.../4quarters.html
The slate roof had collapsed into the shell of the building, the north wing where the fire began wasdestroyed, and steel beams were twisted and melted.

http://www.interfire.org/res_file/fseab_cb.asp
The most obvious reason for the presence of melted copper is that the fire temperature exceeded the copper's melting temperature. There are many documented examples of such melting and brazing to solid steel walls.

http://abclocal.go.com/wpvi/story?section=local&id=4232623
Lightning struck the Starbound Gymnastics Center in Bridgeton and destroyed the center's electrical system.

The center literally glowed with heat that melted steel beams and made trophies look more like abstract pieces of sculpture.

http://www.urbanplanet.org/forums/lofiversion/index.php/t3161.html
State police said a car apparently forced a tanker truck carrying 12,000 gallons of home heating oil into a concrete barrier on the southbound side of the highway, sparking a huge fire that burned for a couple of hours and damaged both sides of the interstate Thursday night.
Authorities said the fire damaged the steel support beams that carry both sides of the highway over Howard Avenue.

"It was such an intense heat that it melted the bridge," said Wallace Thomas, Bridgeport's deputy fire chief. "Once it sagged, it made a pool of it made a pool of burning fuel oil


http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/03/24/earlyshow/main1435439_page2.shtml
Cruise Fire Left All Blackened, Melted
"It's hard to explain how things that appeared to be solid steel columns and railings and everything else were melted away. The fire was obviously very hot."
I'll add more later
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More great work from you, Kent1. Well done.

(Perhaps you could also post that in the Molten Steel in WTC thread, as it might be easier to find.)
 
60hzxtl said:
I love the ct'ers on the building explosion in NYC yesterday.
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Hummm:

headcold at LC said:
I thought it would be interesting to compare the two buildings and see if there are any glaring differences that would make WTC 7 look even more rigged. I couldn't find a very good picture.
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"Hey, we really should manufacture more 'evidence' in favour of our pet theory!"
 
I got suspended again. No clue as to why. I was polite and not confrontational.

Hey jenabell - can you use you contacts to point me to exactly what got me thrown out this time. Thanks

eta:

Perhaps it was when I chimed in on a great exchange between c0rbin and killtown

http://s15.invisionfree.com/Loose_Change_Forum/index.php?showtopic=6509&st=60

c0rbin: The internet has been a boon to every looney cursed with loggorhea.
killtown: You calling me a loon?
c0rbin: You saying I'm calling you a loon?
killtown: It sounded like it. Were you calling me a loon?
C0rbin: Maybe I was and maybe I wasn't. Are you a loon?

Good stuff c0rbin. :D

I asked this:

I'm Just Asking Questions said:
Is calling someone a loon worse then accusing someone or a group of people of murdering over 3000 people on 9/11?

I believe the 19 already accused are guilty. But a lot of people are saying it's an "inside job" and one might argue either explicitly or implicitly accusing the Bush administration, Larry Silversteen, etc. I'm not saying anyone has, mind you.

Your thoughts.
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DavidJames said:
I got suspended again. No clue as to why. I was polite and not confrontational.

Hey jenabell - can you use you contacts to point me to exactly what got me thrown out this time. Thanks

eta:

Perhaps it was when I chimed in on a great exchange between c0rbin and killtown

http://s15.invisionfree.com/Loose_Change_Forum/index.php?showtopic=6509&st=60

c0rbin: The internet has been a boon to every looney cursed with loggorhea.
killtown: You calling me a loon?
c0rbin: You saying I'm calling you a loon?
killtown: It sounded like it. Were you calling me a loon?
C0rbin: Maybe I was and maybe I wasn't. Are you a loon?

Good stuff c0rbin. :D

I asked this:
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Maybe you put him on the spot by asking for his thoughts, when there is no evidence that such thoughts exist.
 
Abbyas said:
Going back downtown on Saturday.

I'd love to build my own catchy pamphlets to combat the CTers catchy pamphlets, maybe even with suggestions on how to fight problems with government without becoming a conspiracy theorist.

Any suggestions?
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I may be there to join you, finally!

You're welcome to use my flyer the way it is or as a suggestion for your own. It's 1/2 sheet (letter) printed front and back. It's more of a pain to print that way, but I think the half-sheet format is easier to handle, and it will fit inside the pamphlet that they hand out at Ground Zero. I have a paper cutter, so it's easy for me to make these. I use colored paper to make it stand out. By the way, the "9-11 Truth Movement" critique that's linked in my sig, and on the flyer, is specific to the pamphlets they hand out at GZ.

Here's a link to download the doc file of my flyer: http://www.yourfilelink.com/get.php?fid=134596
 
aggle-rithm said:
Maybe you put him on the spot by asking for his thoughts, when there is no evidence that such thoughts exist.
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He responded it was okay if there was evidence. I avoided the obvious response that it would be okay then to call him a loon, as the evidence was overwhelming.

But the LC people have a different definition of evidence which can be quickly described in 2 bullets.

Evidence:
- Whatever CTers use to support their theory.
- Evidence and Opposition to CT are mutual exclusive terms.
 
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DavidJames said:
I got suspended again. No clue as to why. I was polite and not confrontational.
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Don't take it personally. The LC mods have a weekly quota to meet.

I noticed on the Screw Loose Change blog that Killtown was basically run out of town by someone repeatedly asking a simple question: "What did the first responders and investigators who were at the crash scenes say when you interviewed them?"

I think this is a devastatingly effective question to ask of the no-plane CTs like Avery, Fetzer, Killtown, Jeff King, Morgan Reynolds, Woody Box, etc.
Have any of them spoken with a single person who was at the crash sites and collected plane and body parts? Have they spoken to a single one of the thousands of people who investigated the attacks? Or do these no-planers simply assume that all these people are part of the conspiracy?

What cowards.
 
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Gravy said:
Don't take it personally. The LC mods have a weekly quota to meet.

I noticed on the Screw Loose Change blog that Killtown was basically run out of town by someone repeatedly asking a simple question: "What did the first responders and investigators who were at the crash scenes say when you interviewed them?"

I think this is a devastatingly effective question to ask of the no-plane CTs like Avery, Fetzer, Killtown, Jeff King, Morgan Reynolds, Woody Box, etc.
Have any of them spoken with a single person who was at the crash sites and collected plane and body parts? Have they spoken to a single one of the thousands of people who investigated the attacks? Or do these no-planers simply assume that all these people are part of the conspiracy?

What cowards.
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Although we have had some really stupid and annoying posters, we have never had to ban anyone, unlikr the daily purging at the LC forum. If you want to make a conspiracy theorist go away, just force them to have to make a logical argument.
 
Abbyas,


You might also round up some of the images the idiots use as illustrations, and their quotes that contradict themselves within minutes.

e.g. On the poster board they have the image of the upright beam cut at an angle (to facilitate removal) with an acetylene torch, a common demolition tool. They use this as "evidence" of "thermite, thermate, and/or nanothermate" Find out when that photo was taken, (research I don't have time to assist with - sorry) and in their tradition, just ask the question, 'What tools would you have used to clean up the site?' A hacksaw? A big broom? Don't let them get away with reading what isn't there. Molton metal is not molton steel. Freefall speed is not terminal velocity. Near freefall speed is meaningless.

One photo tells us that explosive charges jettisoned debris out from the WTC, and then seconds later they tell us 'it fell in it's own footprint' (Only if the WTC was wearing snow shoes.)

CT only makes sense if you ignore all other context. No planes at the Pentagon? Because the attention was on the burning hole - why look at the plane parts?

WTC7 fell down? If it fell spontaneously on a Sunday afternoon, they might have a point, but when you add a raging fire, a chunk out of the building and the concussion of the collapse of 1 & 2, well, it makes sense of a chaotic day.
 
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Hutch said:
I'll probalby go down for this, but chucksheen was just begging for it..


http://s15.invisionfree.com/Loose_Change_Forum/index.php?showtopic=7915&st=0&#entry6005594

And ed help me, I had to deliver.

Bonus points if you guys get the reference before the Loosers do..
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This guy cracks me up, you have to undergo his political indoctrination before you can post on the forum.

The best disciplinary action for you that I can think of is to restrict your posting ability for reviewal until you PM a mod/admin, informing them of the film you watched. We'll pick it up from there.
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The next thing you know it will be like Scientology, and you will have to pay fees for every level of knowledge.
 
60hzxtl said:
You might also round up some of the images the idiots use as illustrations, and their quotes that contradict themselves within minutes.
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I'm getting tired of seeing the cropped photo of that poor lady in one of the towers clinging to a beam in the hole created by a plane with the CT caption about how this proves there weren't any raging fires hot enough to weaken the steel.

It's disingenuous crap like this that makes me tilt towards the losers as being punk a22holes rather then simply pathetic and deluded.
 
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