Haig and his Sun caused earthquakes

[Ziggurat]

Uh, actually, they just use the electricity to power magnets. The particles are accelerated by magnetic fields, not electric potential.

We must rely on electric fields for particle
acceleration

You're both wrong. CERN uses magnets to accelerate particles sideways, when they're making turns (that is indeed an acceleration). It uses electric fields to accelerate them along the path of motion, increasing their energy.

None of it has anything to do with EU nonsense, of course.

 

[Haig]

You're both wrong. CERN uses magnets to accelerate particles sideways, when they're making turns (that is indeed an acceleration). It uses electric fields to accelerate them along the path of motion, increasing their energy.

No you are wrong - Cern has to use electromagnets

Pulling together: Superconducting electromagnets

All the magnets on the LHC are electromagnets. The main dipoles generate powerful 8.4 tesla magnetic fields – more than 100,000 times more powerful than the Earth’s magnetic field. The electromagnets use a current of 11,850 amperes to produce the field, and a superconducting coil allows the high currents to flow without losing any energy to electrical resistance.

They need electricity or the LHC won't accelerate nowt Anyone got a euro for the Electricity meter maybe quite a few euros

None of it has anything to do with EU nonsense, of course.

Oh yes it has The Electric Universe

 

[Ziggurat]

No you are wrong - Cern has to use electromagnets

Electromagnets are still magnets. So you haven't contradicted anything I said. Really, that was pathetically weak.

They need electricity or the LHC won't accelerate nowt

Well, duh. And?

Oh yes it has The Electric Universe

No. The operation of CERN has quite a bit to do with standard electromagnetism. It's got nothing to do with Electric Universe fantasies, which require its adherents to not actually understand electromagnetism.

 

[Belz...]

No you are wrong - Cern has to use electromagnets

But who cares ? Why is that interesting or funny or important ? You continually dodging that question undermines your point. It seems to me like you are simply pointing at everything electrical and saying "electric universe, yo !" without connecting the two.

 

[Haig]

Electromagnets are still magnets. So you haven't contradicted anything I said. Really, that was pathetically weak.



Well, duh. And?



No. The operation of CERN has quite a bit to do with standard electromagnetism. It's got nothing to do with Electric Universe fantasies, which require its adherents to not actually understand electromagnetism.

WoW ! you want to separate standard electromagnetism from EU electromagnetism.

Hannes Alfvén understood it and he said this ...
Source

"In order to understand the phenomena in a certain plasma region, it is necessary to map not only the magnetic but also the electric field and the electric currents. Space is filled with a network of currents which transfer energy and momentum over large or very large distances. The currents often pinch to filamentary or surface currents. The latter are likely to give space, as also interstellar and intergalactic space, a cellular structure"[4]

And others knew he was right too ...
Source

In 1939 Alfven advanced a remarkable theory of magnetic storms and auroras that has widely influenced contemporary theories of plasma dynamics in the earth's magnetosphere. He used the notion of electric charges spiraling in magnetic fields to calculate the motions of electrons and ions. This method came to be universally adopted by plasma physicists and remained in use until the tedious task was assigned to computers in the mid-1970s. Yet in 1939, when Alfven submitted the paper to the leading American journal Terrestrial Magnetism and Atmospheric Electricity, the paper was rejected on the ground that it did not agree with the theoretical calculations of Chapman and his colleagues. Alfven was forced to publish this seminal paper in a Swedish-language journal not readily accessible to the worldwide scientific community. Restrictions such as this were imposed on several of Alfven's other key articles as well.

It is usual in science that one or two major discoveries place their author in the rank of leading authorities with great influence and continuing funding commonly following. This was certainly not the case with Alfven. At no time during his scientific career prior to winning the Nobel Prize was Alfven generally recognized as a leading innovator by those in the scientific communities who were using his work.

Dessler has written of his own realization that Alfven's contributions were being overlooked.

"When I entered the field of space physics in 1956, I recall that I fell in with the crowd believing, for example, that electric fields could not exist in the highly conducting plasma of space. It was three years later that I was shamed by S.Chandrasekhar into investigating Alfven's work objectively. My degree of shock and surprise in finding Alfven right and his critics wrong can hardly be described. I learned that a cosmic ray acceleration mechanism basically identical to the famous mechanism suggested by Fermi in 1949 had [previously] been put forth by Alfven."

Ah! a mechanism for solar events triggering earthquakes

 

[Trakar]

Ah! a mechanism for solar events triggering earthquakes

until you can demonstrate how electromagnetism from the sun causes earthquakes, you have demonstrated no mechanism for solar events triggering earthquakes.

 

[Ziggurat]

WoW ! you want to separate standard electromagnetism from EU electromagnetism.

Well, yeah. Because you believe all sorts of stupid-*** stuff that nobody who actually understands electromagnetism would ever believe.

Hannes Alfvén understood it

And it comes as no surprise that Alfven never believed in the EU nonsense that you believe in.

and he said this ...
Source

Yeah, well, he was wrong. We have much better observational data now than we did back then. Argument from authority holds no weight.

Ah! a mechanism for solar events triggering earthquakes

Nope, that's not a mechanism. That's you flailing your arms about, because you can't actually do real physics. Nothing in your link has anything to do with earthquakes. There's nothing that even suggests it has anything to do with earthquakes.

 

[Belz...]

WoW ! you want to separate standard electromagnetism from EU electromagnetism.

You're aware that electromagnetism is actually part of standard physics, right ?

 

[Reality Check]

duplicate

 

[Reality Check]

All you have is ad homs RC !

Wrong: Calling Ben Davidson deluded and a crank is not an ad hom!
* Someone who selects a flare and says that it caused a specific earthquake to do so is deluded especially without any viable mechanism.
* Someone who takes a stance that is not supported by mainstream science, presents no evidence for it and is not confident enough to debate in the scientific literature is by definition a crank.
I have actual science, Haig: Insignificant solar-terrestrial triggering of earthquakes (2013)[/URL

All you have is your repeated display of an mindless obsession with cranks (not just Ben Davidson), Haig:
[URL="http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=10699269#post10699269"]9 June 2015 Haig: Why Ben Davidson's Sun -> earthquake videos are evidence of his delusions (not science!)
5 June 2015 Haig: Some of the ignorance, fantasies, delusions and even lies that you have believes in since 2010.
The nearly total ignorance of science that you are displaying by falling for the delusions of Ben Davidson is also not good.

You cannot understand the idiocy of citing an obviously bad paper and then the paper that debunks it, Haig !
4th March 2015 Haig: Tavares, M. and Azevedo, A. (2011) was debunked by Carlos A. Vargas, Emanuel D. Kästle (2012)

Any connection was debunked by Insignificant solar-terrestrial triggering of earthquakes (2013) as in:
4 May 2015 Haig: The scientific evidence is that there is no connection between solar activity and earthquakes.

 

[Reality Check]

Oh the irony
...
Sure, haven't you been paying attention ? my hilite

Oh the mindless repeating of Ben Davidson delusions and even highlighting them, Haig!
Davidson lies about a "perfect match" because he fakes the data to create the match !
Select a solar flare. The chances of finding any earthquake matching the time of that flare is 100% (they happen all of the time!).
Frequency of Occurrence of Earthquakes (data as of 1012)

The USGS estimates that several million earthquakes occur in the world each year. Many go undetected because they hit remote areas or have very small magnitudes. The NEIC now locates about 50 earthquakes each day, or about 20,000 a year.

 

[Reality Check]

They happily cite magnetic fields being detected ALL across the Universe but forget to mention that magnetism and electricity are intrinsically linked in electromagnetism.

Which is a lie, Haig.
Every physicist in the world takes undergraduate and postgraduate courses about electromagnetism. For example I did Advanced Electrodynamics in my Honors year. We all know that magnetism and electricity are intrinsically linked in electromagnetism and that even high school students know that.

What we learn is that "electricity" can be ignored in certain situations because of electromagnetism !
This is basic electromagnetism - if you know the magnetic field (and charges) then you can calculate the electric field and vice versa. Since it is easier to detect magnetic fields, astronomers usually start with magnetic fields.

There is also the idiocy of thinking that a science article about magnetic fields needs to mention electric fields .
The idiocy is doubled by misinterpreting the contents of the article
* no primordial, intergalactic magnetic field has been detected. The existence of a primordial, intergalactic magnetic field is postulated as the explanation of the "fuzziness" of jets from supermassive black holes. If correct this is evidence for the mainstream cosmological model and yet another failure of the PC/EU fantasies.
* this discovery dates from 2010 and was waiting confirmation. Where is Haig not cherry picking old discoveries and looking for confirmation? No where!

PC/EC cranks have the delusion that astronomers never look at "electricity". You have stated this delusion before in relation to Velikovsky's Worlds in Collision book, Haig which was answered by Tom Bridgman and expanded on in his blog:
The Real Electric Universe: Inspired by Velikovsky?

In response to my noting that astronomers and space physicists DO consider electric fields in space (see 365 Days of Astronomy: The Electric Universe) there was one of the claims by the participant Haig which I had not seen before: ...

Ending with a long subset of electric field papers before 1950 !

 

[Reality Check]

Hannes Alfvén understood it ...

Oh dear - the stupidity that
* Hannes Alfvén had anything to do with the design of the LHC
* there is plasma in the LHC - it is bunches of protons (a current)
Haig !

Ending with the highlighted delusion that Hannes Alfvén proposed a mechanism for solar activity to trigger earthquakes.

 

[Haig]

until you can demonstrate how electromagnetism from the sun causes earthquakes, you have demonstrated no mechanism for solar events triggering earthquakes.

You surprise me Trakar

Of course electromagnetism is a potential mechanism for triggering / causing earthquakes here on Earth from Solar events.

The Earth is an electromagnet as is the Sun !

Two students in Norway confer with science expert Dr. D. as they learn the structure of Earth that causes it to act as an electromagnet,

Hold your horses RC I know this is aimed at 11 yrs olds

Some facts about E/M

The electromagnetic force is approximately 10^36 times stronger than the earth's gravitational field! That is (to put it in perspective) 1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 times stronger than gravity

Electromagnetism is much stronger, but comes in two opposing signs of charge

Electromagnetic fields are generated by slight imbalances caused by small (often microscopic) separations of charge.

Electromagnetic waves, meanwhile, are typically generated by small movements of charge pairs within objects, and have wavelengths much smaller than the objects themselves.

Electromagnetic waves are strongly interacting with normal matter, making them easy to detect; but they are readily absorbed or scattered by intervening matter.

The fundamental field in electromagnetism is an electric force field.

Looking good for the mechanism for Solar events triggering earthquakes, volcanoes & major storms here on Earth don't you think Trakar ?

 

[Haig]

All you have is ad homs RC !

You say it's not science but these papers took the hypothesis seriously !

Tavares, M. and Azevedo, A. (2011) Influences of solar cycles on earthquakes. Natural Science, 3, 436-443. doi:10.4236/ns.2011.36060

While this second paper Does the sun trigger earthquakes? doubts the results of Tavares, M. and Azevedo, A. (2011) It makes this suggestion in the comments :- (my bold)

future studies could come to more significant conclusions, by, for example, correlating directly CME events with earthquakes.

That is what Ben Davidson has been doing for the last couple of years
Think again RC

You could learn from this !

Sun Eruptions Begin, Earthquake Watch | S0 News June 10, 2015

Let me repeat

That is what Ben Davidson has been doing for the last couple of years
Think again RC

You could learn from this !

 

[Reality Check]

Let me repeat

Let me repeat in highlight so that you might understand - mindlessly repeating the delusions of Ben Davidson is bad, Haig.
Think at all, Haig:
9 June 2015 Haig: Why Ben Davidson's Sun -> earthquake videos are evidence of his delusions (not science!)
5 June 2015 Haig: Some of the ignorance, fantasies, delusions and even lies that you have believed in since 2010.

You should learn from reading science not crank videos:
4 May 2015 Haig: The scientific evidence is that there is no connection between solar activity and earthquakes.

 

[Reality Check]

...snipped delusions...
Some facts about E/M

Basic facts about electromagnetism in the real world, Haig:
On large scales gravity dominates electromagnetism because it cannot be shielded and electromagnetism can be shielded. For example only the deluded would think that the Earth is held in orbit by electromagnetism .

The fundamental fields (plural) in electromagnetism are the electric field and magnetic field! The scientifically emphasized field is the more easily detected magnetic field. But there is plenty of research into electric fields.

It is idiotic to cite a video of Earth's Role as an Electromagnet and the Creation of Auroras in a thread about the Sun and earthquakes !
That the video is an explanation for 13 year olds (K-8) is just slightly idiotic.

 

[Haig]

Basic facts about electromagnetism in the real world, Haig:
On large scales gravity dominates electromagnetism because it cannot be shielded and electromagnetism can be shielded. For example only the deluded would think that the Earth is held in orbit by electromagnetism .

The fundamental fields (plural) in electromagnetism are the electric field and magnetic field! The scientifically emphasized field is the more easily detected magnetic field. But there is plenty of research into electric fields.

It is idiotic to cite a video of Earth's Role as an Electromagnet and the Creation of Auroras in a thread about the Sun and earthquakes !
That the video is an explanation for 13 year olds (K-8) is just slightly idiotic.

So you're not disputing that the Earth is an electromagnet (as NASA says) just that it was intended for 13 year old not 11 year old as I said, Right ? That's great

 

[Trakar]

You surprise me Trakar

Of course electromagnetism is a potential mechanism for triggering / causing earthquakes here on Earth from Solar events.

The Earth is an electromagnet as is the Sun !

what is missing is the demonstrable mechanism that links electromagnetism and earthquakes

 

[Reality Check]

So you're not disputing that ...

I am not disputing that post contains an idiotic citation, Haig:
11 June 2015: Haig: It is idiotic to cite a video of Earth's Role as an Electromagnet and the Creation of Auroras in a thread about the Sun and earthquakes

Not a surprise since we have 5 June 2015 Haig: Some of the ignorance, fantasies, delusions and even lies that you have believed in since 2010.

The latest unaddressed ignorance, fantasies and delusions are beginning to mount up, Haig:

1. 27 May 2015 Haig: Can you understand that Schnepf et. al is not about the Sun or earthquakes (no matter what delusions Ben Davidson may have about it!) ?
2. 2 June 2015 Haig: Can you understand that ignorant comments on a crank web site are not scientific evidence.
3. 2 June 2015 Haig: Four points of delusion in your 30 May 2015 post
4. 4 June 2015 Haig: Your ignorance about Scott, et. al. and a fantasy about its results does not mean that the Sun causes earthquakes when the scientific evidence is that it does not!.
5. 4 June 2015 Haig: Another abysmal mistake about science (plasma tubes in this case)
6. 4 June 2015 Haig: A fantasy that Mostl et. al. has anything to do with earthquakes.

A week later it looks like more ignorance, fantasies and delusions are ready to be added to that list - real soon now!