Gravy's "Loose Change" Critique, part deux

[Orphia Nay]

Welcome to the forum, JimboWHO. Great first post.

Dylan talks a big game, but doesn't do anything about 9/11 besides trying to profit from it. Well, and pith on the graves of the heroes and victims, plagiarise other people's work, and JAQ off. How many of the eyewitnesses or authorities in his video did he contact?

 

[JimboWHO]

Avery

I have no idea why I just have a hunch that he's not gonna be a 'lifer' - you know, an Alex Jones or Jimmy Walter-type 50 year old CTist. He's just gonna come under more and more criticism and when the $$ dries up he may become a bit more, say, introspective. Of course I could be completely wrong.

You can see this ending very badly for Dylan Avery and the other clowns. I want very badly to seem them utterly discredited, disowned and exposed as the calous charlatans that they are. I can't empahsize enough the joy I get from the results of the small cottage industry that exists solely to take down these opportunists.

Again, I applaud Mark Roberts and everybody else that plays a role in this.

Jim

 

[JimboWHO]

AVERY - The Last Exchange

Dylan,

You know this ends badly. It's already begun to unravel. What are you gonna do when the money dries up? What will you say to your kids 15 years from now when they learn dad was a crack-pot who hurt a lot of people...will you say "I was an internet star at one time" or "We had a good run - Dad was just having fun" ?

You can't put out enough editions of LC to correct everything. You can't say enough "I'm sorry's" to all the people you've smeared, politicians you've slandered and victims you've mocked. And you can't get back what you've lost: the good name we are all born with.

You rationalize it all with the many people who buy your story - people who believe in Bigfoot. People who believe in Martians. And people who YOU HOPE NEVER EVER GET EDUCATED ON YOUR ERRORS because then the Emperor will be found to have had no clothes. The fact is though you've become comic relief for the level-headed masses who will now enjoy the next act in this play.

Here's to hoping you get what's coming to you.

Jim Malmstrom

AVERY's Reply:

Once again, none of the things you bring up are true. You seem to be
speaking out of emotion instead of logic.
-Dylan

MY Reply:

As if you know logic. The 'FORCES' behind the most horrific STATE SPONSORED TERROR act against it's OWN people allow those that have 'uncovered' their plot to live! All of 'em! Avery! Bermas! Rowe! and Jones! and supporters Bowman, Walters, etc. ALL FREE TO SPEAK AS THEY WISH ...TO THE WORLD....FOR AS LONG AS THEY WISH!

You're a riot.

Jim Malmstrom

I guess that's the end of that.

 

[chippy]

The guy who wrote the Loose Change Guide is here? Damn! I want to shake your hand sir!

 

[Free Thinkr]

The guy who wrote the Loose Change Guide is here? Damn! I want to shake your hand sir!

Yeah, cool, aint it? I saw the loose change guide when Maddox linked to it; I found it to be quite the useful resource for debunking people who cite loose change. All the info in one easy-to-use area. Apparently this forum is a 911 conspiracy debunking hotspot. Which is why I'm here!

 

[OMGturt1es]

i just want to give a quick thanks to all that have been involved with the constant debunking of 9/11 CT crap. i've been reading here for quite a while, and while i rarely post, i've sure enjoyed the randi forums-- especially these conspiracy theory forums! oh, the pleasure i've had sitting with a nice cup of coffee, watching the arguments of dylan and others being completely eviscerated! the evidences produced and compiled here have come in great use when i've had the urge to bang my head against a wall...

gravy and others, it's time for you to expand to a fresh target: jones! destroy him! i'm far too busy at this point to do much of anything, but i've got some "internet friends" that are starting to being CT nuts, and i'd love to just have a single link that i could send 'em to, where alex's cray claims are torn to shreds.

thanks all for the awesome work! it's been greatly appreciated!

 

[~enigma~]

gravy and others, it's time for you to expand to a fresh target: jones! destroy him!

Already been done in another thread and in another forum that ultimately ended with the twoofer woowoos banning the guy for informing them about spontaneous thermite/thermate generation. Besides, Jones admits himself that his work is nothing more than a HYPOTHESIS.

 

[delphi_ote]

Besides, Jones admits himself that his work is nothing more than a HYPOTHESIS.

It's not a hypothesis. A hypothesis should account for all current evidence and make falsifiable predictions. Jones' ravings do neither.

 

[MikeW]

Already been done in another thread and in another forum that ultimately ended with the twoofer woowoos banning the guy for informing them about spontaneous thermite/thermate generation. Besides, Jones admits himself that his work is nothing more than a HYPOTHESIS.

I think you're talking about Jones (Steve), but ^varg meant Jones (Alex).

 

[~enigma~]

I think you're talking about Jones (Steve), but ^varg meant Jones (Alex).

Oops

Well Steven Jones has been debunked already and Alex Jones is no more than a loudmouthed Michelin Tireman (note the resemblance).

 

[OMGturt1es]

yes, i'm referring to that whack job alex jones. unfortunantly, a number of my online "friends" have bought into his crap. i don't have time to go around gathering enough evidence to prove to these folk that alex just makes **** up. it'd be great to set up a website that simply documented everyone of his lies...

i've been utterly shocked by the amount of folk who seem to buy alex's crap. i guess many just don't think he'd... uh, just lie.

 

[Gravy]

I just joined (after lurking for a day or two) and found out what is well-known around here - that GRAVY is Mark Roberts. My hat is off to you on your Loose Change Guide - a very impressive job and an important service to the families of the victims. I loved reading every word of it!

Just catching up with this thread. Welcome to the forums, Jimbo, and thanks! Happy birthday!

 

[Gravy]

Dylan,

You know this ends badly. It's already begun to unravel. What are you gonna do when the money dries up? What will you say to your kids 15 years from now when they learn dad was a crack-pot who hurt a lot of people...will you say "I was an internet star at one time" or "We had a good run - Dad was just having fun" ?

You can't put out enough editions of LC to correct everything. You can't say enough "I'm sorry's" to all the people you've smeared, politicians you've slandered and victims you've mocked. And you can't get back what you've lost: the good name we are all born with.

You rationalize it all with the many people who buy your story - people who believe in Bigfoot. People who believe in Martians. And people who YOU HOPE NEVER EVER GET EDUCATED ON YOUR ERRORS because then the Emperor will be found to have had no clothes. The fact is though you've become comic relief for the level-headed masses who will now enjoy the next act in this play.

Here's to hoping you get what's coming to you.

Jim Malmstrom

Damn.

What Avery didn't say in reply, but wanted to:

What will I tell my kids? I'll say, "Like hey, man, life's one big do-over."

 

[Gravy]

gravy and others, it's time for you to expand to a fresh target: jones! destroy him!

Hey, I've done my part. There's a section of my WTC 7 paper devoted to him: (download) http://www.911myths.com/WTC7_Lies.pdf or here: http://www.911myths.com/WTC7_Lies.doc

yes, i'm referring to that whack job alex jones. unfortunantly, a number of my online "friends" have bought into his crap. i don't have time to go around gathering enough evidence to prove to these folk that alex just makes **** up. it'd be great to set up a website that simply documented everyone of his lies...

Perry Logan has just the site for you (caution: it's a bumpy ride if you're a right-winger!) http://perrylogan.org/

 

[OMGturt1es]

Hey, I've done my part. There's a section of my WTC 7 paper devoted to him: (download) http://www.911myths.com/WTC7_Lies.pdf or here: http://www.911myths.com/WTC7_Lies.doc

oh yeah! i've actually already read your WTC 7 paper (most of it, that is), and i've certainly enjoyed it! i do appreciate all the work you've done, and i loved the inclusion on alex jones in your latest work.

but what i'd love, if you are taking requests, heheh, is a "terrorstorm guide", and some other major alex jones video guides. of course, it's easy for me to be demanding of YOUR time, hahah, especially when i don't have the time to even offer any sort of help.

but yeah, regardless, i've certainly appreciated all your work. i've noticed a number of posters in these CT forums citing your work as reason for ditching the CT sites, and i've referenced your LC guide many times in the past to prove my case. it's wonderful to have all that evidence so organized!

Perry Logan has just the site for you (caution: it's a bumpy ride if you're a right-winger!) http://perrylogan.org/

thanks for the link! i've breifly gone through that site before, but i'll try to give it a better look.

 

[Gravy]

but what i'd love, if you are taking requests, heheh, is a "terrorstorm guide", and some other major alex jones video guides. of course, it's easy for me to be demanding of YOUR time, hahah, especially when i don't have the time to even offer any sort of help.

Heh. I'd like to formally announce that I am absolutely, positively not taking requests, especially when they involve anything related to Alex Jones!

Hell, I never even finished my revision of the LC Guide. I only had about 3 weeks of 9/11 conspiracy experience when I wrote the current version. I have so much more info now, that a revision is a daunting task. For instance, LC only briefly discusses WTC 7, but when I started writing about it for my LC Guide revision, I wound up with over 100 pages. So I made a separate paper out of it. It's that way with many of the subjects that LC touches on.

I hate doing this stuff. It's so unpleasant, and as I've said before, I don't find most of the conspiracy claims interesting at all. They're so absurd that they shouldn't merit a response. But since a lot of people seem to accept those absurdities, I guess it's somewhat necessary to respond. The most interesting thing to me in all this is the psychology of the conspiracy believers, and I despair of ever fully understanding that.

thanks for the link! i've breifly gone through that site before, but i'll try to give it a better look.

I should have mentioned that you have to scroll way down on the first page to get to the long list of AJ's claims.

 

[~enigma~]

I should have mentioned that you have to scroll way down on the first page to get to the long list of AJ's claims.

I knew AJ was a loon but after reading some of that I will say that somebody should lock him (AJ) in a padded cell for a few decades.

 

[Garb]

Perry Logan has just the site for you (caution: it's a bumpy ride if you're a right-winger!) http://perrylogan.org/

Does he really think that all republicans are bigots and nobody likes them?


That isn't very nice...

 

[Kiwiwriter]

Good point...

Holocaust Deniers bother me much, much more. They have a vested interest in perpetuating fascism, racism, genocide. It's not just a Conspiracy Theory, it's "denial" in the deepest sense of the word.

The Loosers are just a bunch of paranoiacs who need help.

Loosers: Thousands of people at the highest levels of fifteen governments. Explosives lying in wait for over three decades. Holograms and anti-gravity devices. Planes from secret bases. The prize, hundreds of billions in gold, wars in foreign lands, the Patriot Act, world domination. I mean, it was the perfect plan...
... and you would have gotten away with it too, except three punk kids just happened to overhear Rumsfeld mumble the wrong word at a press conference!! I mean, you can't explain that, now can you? I mean, it all just unraveled, like ripples across a pond.

Make-Believe Cabal: I'd have gotten away with it too, if it weren't for you meddling kids!

They both upset me, but for different reasons. The Holocaust deniers' real goal is to rehabilitate Nazism and make it a viable political movement again. Then they hope to take power and make Hitler look like a nice guy.

The Loosers' political theories are a little more diffuse, but they come down to the same thing...the government is lying and it's run by a shadowy cabal, and only putting the Loosers in power can bring down the cabal and make a perfect world. They aren't as certain about what this world is going to be and how they're going to run it, whereas the neo-Nazis do...even if their ideas are so wacko, like shipping all the Jews to Israel and blacks to Africa in leaky boats, or putting up a big wall in the middle of the country to separate the races.

What the Loosers succeed in is fraying the already strained fabric of civic discourse and give legs to conspiracy theories and ideas that, when spouted by neo-Nazis, would get shot down simply because of who bears them.

They both bother me, for different reasons. Which is worse? Hard to say. They both offend me viscerally.

But I do agree with the above comment about the Loosers being mostly paranoids who need help.

 

[Kiwiwriter]

That's classic!

Well, just like asking a real, live woman out on a date is difficult, but clicking around the 'net for pics of naked models is not...

And the best part its...the girls on the web don't know that the guy at the computer has never bathed, doesn't have a job, never left his parents' basement since graduating from high school, and his entire life revolves around his internet discussion groups on:

1. Conspiracy theories
2. Who's cooler? Jim Kirk or Jean-luc Picard? Prove it.

And aren't the girls lucky for not knowing that!