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Another sincere question for theists...

Marquis de Carabas said:
Elaborate.
Nature. Probably should have many categories.

That he will resurrect us from the dead at his second coming. Whether you believe in him or not, you will be brought back to life. Of course, some will hang around longer than others.

Our ability to procreate.

Strip clubs.
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Another sincere question for theists...

RussDill said:
I mean, if I exist because god loves me, does it mean that all the people that god has chosen not to allow to exist, he does not love? This huge potential population of individuals that god does not love.
Humans play a role in this. So we've basically throttled God's ability.

I should probably redefine "you exist because God loves you" to mean that God provides the mechanism for the living being.
 
Riddick,

You have pointed out that god loves us after we're dead by keeping us on file, and loves us before we live by providing a human mechanism for procreation.

Jimmygun is looking for a more tangible and today and apparent example of god's love. Is there some unmistakable example of the way God loves you that perhaps doesn't involve strip clubs which can be argued are not necessarily from god.
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Another sincere question for theists...

Riddick said:
Humans play a role in this. So we've basically throttled God's ability.

Hey, you "throttle God's 'ability' " all you want, I don't swing that way. I want no role in your pervert God's sex games.
 
Atlas said:
Riddick,

You have pointed out that god loves us after we're dead by keeping us on file, and loves us before we live by providing a human mechanism for procreation.

Jimmygun is looking for a more tangible and today and apparent example of god's love. Is there some unmistakable example of the way God loves you that perhaps doesn't involve strip clubs which can be argued are not necessarily from god.
I dunno, that just has a hint of argument for the sake of argument. It's like, you don't like the answer, so you're searching for another answer you can refute without rhyme or reason.

Be that as it may....

You're dead without God dictating how cell's interact with eachother.

You can't pull another breath of air.

You can't absorb nutrients from food in your digestive system without God.

The sun doesn't burn out.

The earth doesn't go careening off into space.

There must be something tangible there somewhere. You can feel the heat of the sun - isn't that tangible?

The tangible examples are all around you. Now, what you have to ask yourself is: "Do I want to accept the tangible evidence of God's love?" Or "Do I simply dismiss all tangible evidence given in the name of ultimate skepticism?" "Ultimate skepticism: the denial of any offered explanation." Might be too much of a good thing?
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Another sincere question for theists...

Piscivore said:
Hey, you "throttle God's 'ability' " all you want, I don't swing that way. I want no role in your pervert God's sex games.
Don't suck.
 
Riddick said:
I dunno, that just has a hint of argument for the sake of argument. It's like, you don't like the answer, so you're searching for another answer you can refute without rhyme or reason.

Be that as it may....

You're dead without God dictating how cell's interact with eachother.

You can't pull another breath of air.

You can't absorb nutrients from food in your digestive system without God.

The sun doesn't burn out.

The earth doesn't go careening off into space.

There must be something tangible there somewhere. You can feel the heat of the sun - isn't that tangible?

The tangible examples are all around you. Now, what you have to ask yourself is: "Do I want to accept the tangible evidence of God's love?" Or "Do I simply dismiss all tangible evidence given in the name of ultimate skepticism?" "Ultimate skepticism: the denial of any offered explanation." Might be too much of a good thing?
In my philosophy Love is a very positive thing. In yours it is expressed in the negative. Are we even talking about the same thing?

You seem in agreement with what the nonbelievers say. You know god loves you because he is not smiting you today.
 
Atlas said:
In my philosophy Love is a very positive thing. In yours it is expressed in the negative. Are we even talking about the same thing?

You seem in agreement with what the nonbelievers say. You know god loves you because he is not smiting you today.
Love, in my (Riddick) philosophy, is a very positive thing.

You must have a pessimistic outlook if you think my philosophy of love is negative.
 
Does "love" include going to skeptic message boards and telling people they'll die and go to Hell if they don't believe in God?
 
Riddick said:
Love, in my (Riddick) philosophy, is a very positive thing.

You must have a pessimistic outlook if you think my philosophy of love is negative.
Really? - This is what you said...

You're dead without God dictating how cell's interact with eachother.

You can't pull another breath of air.

You can't absorb nutrients from food in your digestive system without God.

The sun doesn't burn out.

The earth doesn't go careening off into space.


Dead... Can't... Doesn't... Not "very positive" expressions at all. I'm not surprised you missed that though. Although the Christian god is love, many times it is expressed in terms of Hell. (Expanding on C4ts observation.)

What is the implicit message in the most positive message in the new testament... "God so loved the world" ?

It's this... God so loved the world that he tortured and killed his son so that not everyone would suffer the eternal torment He has planned for them. It sounds better when it is read out in the Bible translation but this is what it means I believe.

Is deciding that you're not going to burn them all truly love?
 
You're dead without God dictating how cell's interact with eachother.

God doesn't. That would be biochemistry

You can't pull another breath of air.

God doesn't breathe for me. My lungs do

You can't absorb nutrients from food in your digestive system without God.

God doesn't digest my food. My gut does.

The sun doesn't burn out.

God doesn't keep the sun burning. That would be nuclear fusion.

The earth doesn't go careening off into space.

And while the thing which keeps it in orbit begins with a G, it is not God

There must be something tangible there somewhere.

There are lots of tangible things. None of them appears to be God.

You can feel the heat of the sun - isn't that tangible?

Yes. And it is caused by nuclear fission.

The tangible examples are all around you. Now, what you have to ask yourself is: "Do I want to accept the tangible evidence of God's love?"

No, what I have to ask myself is: "Is this tangible evidence of God's love?

Or "Do I simply dismiss all tangible evidence given in the name of ultimate skepticism?"

Why do they all drivel out the same witless nonsense? The Christians, the alien abductees, the aura healers? They all spam out exactly the same gibble. They are all desperate not to argue with real opinions of real people but imaginary, made-up opinions of imaginary people. In this case, "ultimate scepticism". Why do they all have to take refuge from reality in this way? Oh yes, I remember...

"Ultimate skepticism: the denial of any offered explanation." Might be too much of a good thing?

This describes the position of precisely no-one in the entire world. Well, I suppose people with toy swords are obliged to fight only against straw men. But have you any idea how stupid it makes you look? No, silly question, of course you don't.
 
Dr. A, you said:

"Yes. And it is caused by nuclear fission."


You were careful to say "fusion" the first time. Sorry to point this out but I am a science guy.

Everything else is cool though. Forgive me
:D
 
c4ts said:
Does "love" include going to skeptic message boards and telling people they'll die and go to Hell if they don't believe in God?
I don't recall using any such statement at any of you here at jref or elsewhere. Maybe someone else did, in which case, all I can do is apologize on their behalf.

Everyone please notice my new avatar - attention whoring, yes. Bonus points for guessing where it came from.
 
Atlas said:
Really? - This is what you said...

You're dead without God dictating how cell's interact with eachother.

You can't pull another breath of air.

You can't absorb nutrients from food in your digestive system without God.

The sun doesn't burn out.

The earth doesn't go careening off into space.


Dead... Can't... Doesn't... Not "very positive" expressions at all. I'm not surprised you missed that though. Although the Christian god is love, many times it is expressed in terms of Hell. (Expanding on C4ts observation.)

What is the implicit message in the most positive message in the new testament... "God so loved the world" ?

It's this... God so loved the world that he tortured and killed his son so that not everyone would suffer the eternal torment He has planned for them. It sounds better when it is read out in the Bible translation but this is what it means I believe.

Is deciding that you're not going to burn them all truly love?
I see. So when I say "My love for you is neverending," it is seen as negative love?
 
Dr Adequate said:
You're dead without God dictating how cell's interact with eachother.

God doesn't. That would be biochemistry

You can't pull another breath of air.

God doesn't breathe for me. My lungs do

You can't absorb nutrients from food in your digestive system without God.

God doesn't digest my food. My gut does.

The sun doesn't burn out.

God doesn't keep the sun burning. That would be nuclear fusion.

The earth doesn't go careening off into space.

And while the thing which keeps it in orbit begins with a G, it is not God

There must be something tangible there somewhere.

There are lots of tangible things. None of them appears to be God.

You can feel the heat of the sun - isn't that tangible?

Yes. And it is caused by nuclear fission.

The tangible examples are all around you. Now, what you have to ask yourself is: "Do I want to accept the tangible evidence of God's love?"

No, what I have to ask myself is: "Is this tangible evidence of God's love?

Or "Do I simply dismiss all tangible evidence given in the name of ultimate skepticism?"

Why do they all drivel out the same witless nonsense? The Christians, the alien abductees, the aura healers? They all spam out exactly the same gibble. They are all desperate not to argue with real opinions of real people but imaginary, made-up opinions of imaginary people. In this case, "ultimate scepticism". Why do they all have to take refuge from reality in this way? Oh yes, I remember...

"Ultimate skepticism: the denial of any offered explanation." Might be too much of a good thing?

This describes the position of precisely no-one in the entire world. Well, I suppose people with toy swords are obliged to fight only against straw men. But have you any idea how stupid it makes you look? No, silly question, of course you don't.
Please continue pesky personal attack, if it suits your needs.
 
Riddick said:
I see. So when I say "My love for you is neverending," it is seen as negative love?
:D :D

All I know is that it would make me feel a little uncomfortable if you said that to me. Let's keep the conversation about god.

It's not you. It's me. :p
 
Riddick
You're dead without God dictating how cell's interact with eachother.

You can't pull another breath of air.

You can't absorb nutrients from food in your digestive system without God.

The sun doesn't burn out.

The earth doesn't go careening off into space.

There must be something tangible there somewhere. You can feel the heat of the sun - isn't that tangible?
All very good reasons to worship Makonaima and all the others. Good thing that pesky Christian god is nothing more than a Johnny come lately and all the really important bits had already been created.

The tangible examples are all around you. Now, what you have to ask yourself is: "Do I want to accept the tangible evidence of God's love?" Or "Do I simply dismiss all tangible evidence given in the name of ultimate skepticism?" "Ultimate skepticism: the denial of any offered explanation." Might be too much of a good thing?
The supernatural is a needless addition.
If you have evidence that a given function does indeed require a supernatural ‘entity/power/etc’ present some evidence.

Ossai
 
Ossai said:
Riddick

All very good reasons to worship Makonaima and all the others. Good thing that pesky Christian god is nothing more than a Johnny come lately and all the really important bits had already been created.

The supernatural is a needless addition.
If you have evidence that a given function does indeed require a supernatural ‘entity/power/etc’ present some evidence.

Ossai
Huh-Oh. You used the word "indeed." I always struggle when it makes an appearance.

"The supernatural is a needless addition." Ah, I see, very well. You'll permit me to play 'The universe without the supernatural is a needless reduction.' Touche`.

There is evidence that a given function/action requires a supernatural 'entity/power/etc.' But, it seems that the passage of time has deemed it lacking in merit. And I certainly won't insult you by bring up the specific examples in the bible. You've heard them many times before.

I suggest we try playing chess. There you can beat me senseless.
 
Atlas said:
...God so loved the world that he tortured and killed his son so that not everyone would suffer the eternal torment He has planned for them. It sounds better when it is read out in the Bible translation but this is what it means I believe.
What principles of Bible interpretation, which verses and what theology did you use to form this meaning?
 
Riddick said:
Please continue pesky personal attack, if it suits your needs.
Please continue to avoid the substance of my posts if it suits your needs. Please continue to think that attacking a home-made straw man isn't stupid, if that suits your needs. Please continue thinking that pointing out the stupidity of this line of argument constitutes a "personal attack", if this suits your needs. Please continue to live in a fantasy world undisturbed by criticism of your thinking, if that suits your needs. But if that is what you need, why are you on these forums?
 

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