Maurice Ledifficile
Lost in translation
- Joined
- Sep 21, 2010
- Messages
- 2,964
This is complicated enough; To Throw Row vs. Wade into it is a Reach.
Angelika Graswald
- Thread starter anglolawyer
- Start date
This is complicated enough; To Throw Row vs. Wade into it is a Reach.
anglolawyer
Banned
RWVBWL
Master Poster
I wrote this over on IA,
but I know that some folks here on The ISF do not read over there,
so ah, allow me to re-post here too, cool?
That said,
let's ah reverse this accident/murder story,
ya know look at it in a different light,
ok?
If she dies, he gets $250,000.00 dollars.
He really does not have a real job, nor much $$$$,
just volunteers to work on that island once a week.
He takes off her drainage plug, because the cat was playing with it.
Or is he trying to subtly sabotage her yak?
He also apparently unscrews and removes 1 of the locks on her paddle,
a potential problem, you can not paddle a yak without a paddle.
More subtle sabotage?
He is wearing a lifejacket. She is not though.
Where was her lifejacket at? It's MIA.
Lost at home so she could not bring it?
Forgotten in the car?
She falls into the water, he watches, and takes her paddle.
Finally calls for 911 for help after what, 20 minutes?
Some personal thoughts that he wrote before she died are found by police,
he'd like her dead.
He is seen slapping her in public, by her friends.
She wants sex with 3 pep's, he doesn't.
She wants to break it off...
She is missing, presumed dead.
He seems to be celebrating his freedom,
not really grieving like the dude whose 3rd Fiancee is missing in the water still,
right?
The story he tells the cops gives them enough suspicion to ah, ask him to come in for further question,
he does so, makes many incriminating statements in the video'd interrogation.
The cops were not even yelling at him though...
You would not be suspicious of the dude if the scenario was reversed???
Yep, I surf, paddle, I also like to date and drink alcohol.
So I'm interestd in this and have an opinion on this story.
Who knows, maybe I am wrong,
who knows maybe you innocentisti are wrong...
I think that she wanted him dead,
that $$$ was the incentive,
yakin' was the opportunity...
My 2¢,
RW
but I know that some folks here on The ISF do not read over there,
so ah, allow me to re-post here too, cool?
That said,
let's ah reverse this accident/murder story,
ya know look at it in a different light,
ok?
If she dies, he gets $250,000.00 dollars.
He really does not have a real job, nor much $$$$,
just volunteers to work on that island once a week.
He takes off her drainage plug, because the cat was playing with it.
Or is he trying to subtly sabotage her yak?
He also apparently unscrews and removes 1 of the locks on her paddle,
a potential problem, you can not paddle a yak without a paddle.
More subtle sabotage?
He is wearing a lifejacket. She is not though.
Where was her lifejacket at? It's MIA.
Lost at home so she could not bring it?
Forgotten in the car?
She falls into the water, he watches, and takes her paddle.
Finally calls for 911 for help after what, 20 minutes?
Some personal thoughts that he wrote before she died are found by police,
he'd like her dead.
He is seen slapping her in public, by her friends.
She wants sex with 3 pep's, he doesn't.
She wants to break it off...
She is missing, presumed dead.
He seems to be celebrating his freedom,
not really grieving like the dude whose 3rd Fiancee is missing in the water still,
right?
The story he tells the cops gives them enough suspicion to ah, ask him to come in for further question,
he does so, makes many incriminating statements in the video'd interrogation.
The cops were not even yelling at him though...
You would not be suspicious of the dude if the scenario was reversed???
Yep, I surf, paddle, I also like to date and drink alcohol.
So I'm interestd in this and have an opinion on this story.
Who knows, maybe I am wrong,
who knows maybe you innocentisti are wrong...
I think that she wanted him dead,
that $$$ was the incentive,
yakin' was the opportunity...
My 2¢,
RW
Last edited:
RWVBWL
Master Poster
The Paddle Swim
Quadraginta + Catsmate,
Good points + Good - Reach, Throw, Wade, Row video,
they might help someone someday.
But check this out,
it's something that many folks who kayak probably do not know of.
The Paddle Swim.
Scenerio:
You're knocked off your kayak,
gusty, strong winds, it might blow away faster that you can swim to it sometimes.
I've seen it happen before with a fisherman near shore,
he caught a fish, got yanked out, spent about 15-20 minutes following, err swimmin' to his yak
in light winds and finally got it back again. I talked about it with him afterwards...
If you are by yourself, yikes, you might be outta luck.
Unless you know of this tip...
You are knocked out of kayak
but you still have your paddle or it's nearby,
you can use your kayak paddle to swim to your kayak or back to land.
Heck, years ago I've seen a pic of someone even being towed to shore using a kayak paddle to swim with.
ETA: Cool, the article is still online, read and learn if interested, might save your life:
http://www.useakayak.org/recoveries_rescues/paddle_swim.html
Most people can swim much faster with a kayak paddle in hand then by their arms, especially if clothed.
Even without wearing a life jacket.
Below are some video links,
watch and learn if interested in this safety tip:
8 year old boy Paddle Swims after capsize:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DpqZJu7DgiI
Swim to Shore:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hI5P77HtIgs
Fall out, Swim back:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2y203mHR-E8
Self Rescue Safety Lesson:
This clip is very informative, even for people who really do not kayak:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bp7PGMsQqbk
If Vinny knew of this safety technique,
it puts Angelika's retrieval of his paddle in a different perspective.
He can not swim too far very fast, in cold 46° water.
His paddle could have helped save his life...
Not to float, but to swim!
Here's link from the local newspapers, the press conference is interesting:
http://www.poughkeepsiejournal.com/.../25/da-tuesday-viafore-graswald/27938257/ink:
She "moved the paddle away from him as he was struggling to stay afloat with water temperatures in the 40 degree range, and failed to render him assistance including timely calls for help," the DA's office said in a statement.
* * *
By the way,
I've read that Angelika gave differing stories from when she was 1st rescued and then later,
when the cops asked her questions again, trying to help pinpoint the location of Vincent's body,
as she visited The Island about a week later.
Before her video'd interrogation...
Quadraginta + Catsmate,
Good points + Good - Reach, Throw, Wade, Row video,
they might help someone someday.
But check this out,
it's something that many folks who kayak probably do not know of.
The Paddle Swim.
Scenerio:
You're knocked off your kayak,
gusty, strong winds, it might blow away faster that you can swim to it sometimes.
I've seen it happen before with a fisherman near shore,
he caught a fish, got yanked out, spent about 15-20 minutes following, err swimmin' to his yak
in light winds and finally got it back again. I talked about it with him afterwards...
If you are by yourself, yikes, you might be outta luck.
Unless you know of this tip...
You are knocked out of kayak
but you still have your paddle or it's nearby,
you can use your kayak paddle to swim to your kayak or back to land.
Heck, years ago I've seen a pic of someone even being towed to shore using a kayak paddle to swim with.
ETA: Cool, the article is still online, read and learn if interested, might save your life:
http://www.useakayak.org/recoveries_rescues/paddle_swim.html
Most people can swim much faster with a kayak paddle in hand then by their arms, especially if clothed.
Even without wearing a life jacket.
Below are some video links,
watch and learn if interested in this safety tip:
8 year old boy Paddle Swims after capsize:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DpqZJu7DgiI
Swim to Shore:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hI5P77HtIgs
Fall out, Swim back:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2y203mHR-E8
Self Rescue Safety Lesson:
This clip is very informative, even for people who really do not kayak:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bp7PGMsQqbk
If Vinny knew of this safety technique,
it puts Angelika's retrieval of his paddle in a different perspective.
He can not swim too far very fast, in cold 46° water.
His paddle could have helped save his life...
Not to float, but to swim!
Here's link from the local newspapers, the press conference is interesting:
http://www.poughkeepsiejournal.com/.../25/da-tuesday-viafore-graswald/27938257/ink:
She "moved the paddle away from him as he was struggling to stay afloat with water temperatures in the 40 degree range, and failed to render him assistance including timely calls for help," the DA's office said in a statement.
* * *
By the way,
I've read that Angelika gave differing stories from when she was 1st rescued and then later,
when the cops asked her questions again, trying to help pinpoint the location of Vincent's body,
as she visited The Island about a week later.
Before her video'd interrogation...
Last edited:
RWVBWL
Master Poster
Timely Call for Help?
About those Timely Calls for Help,
this, from The New York Times:
"And though Mr. Viafore, 46, capsized around 7:15 p.m., it was not until about 7:40 that she summoned help."(*)
How long does a girl need to wait to call 911 as your Fiance
struggles in 46° water to get back into a kayak or wait for help?
Long enough for him to say I don't think I am gonna make it?
* * *
I'm also curious about these supposedly differing stories told by Miss Graswald
from when she was rescued vs the later convo with the cops.
Might 1 potential problem be this here:
"Graswald told police she tried to help her fiance but she fell out of her own kayak. She was later picked up by a boater and treated for hypothermia".(**)
But here:
"Prosecutors have also said that Ms. Graswald intentionally capsized her own kayak to make it look as though she had tried to save him. Someone with firsthand knowledge of the rescue said that members of a local boat club were alerted to the couple’s distress, and that as they approached in their work boat, they saw her throw herself into the water".(*)
Links:
(*) - The New York Times
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/05/27/n...ddle-away-as-fiance-died-prosecutors-say.html
(**) - CBS News
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/report-...g-kayaker-wrote-in-diary-she-wanted-him-dead/
RWVBWL said:
About those Timely Calls for Help,
this, from The New York Times:
"And though Mr. Viafore, 46, capsized around 7:15 p.m., it was not until about 7:40 that she summoned help."(*)
How long does a girl need to wait to call 911 as your Fiance
struggles in 46° water to get back into a kayak or wait for help?
Long enough for him to say I don't think I am gonna make it?
* * *
I'm also curious about these supposedly differing stories told by Miss Graswald
from when she was rescued vs the later convo with the cops.
Might 1 potential problem be this here:
"Graswald told police she tried to help her fiance but she fell out of her own kayak. She was later picked up by a boater and treated for hypothermia".(**)
But here:
"Prosecutors have also said that Ms. Graswald intentionally capsized her own kayak to make it look as though she had tried to save him. Someone with firsthand knowledge of the rescue said that members of a local boat club were alerted to the couple’s distress, and that as they approached in their work boat, they saw her throw herself into the water".(*)
Links:
(*) - The New York Times
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/05/27/n...ddle-away-as-fiance-died-prosecutors-say.html
(**) - CBS News
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/report-...g-kayaker-wrote-in-diary-she-wanted-him-dead/
Last edited:
anglolawyer
Banned
Ah, now you've found those eyewitnesses I was thinking of. They can prove (assuming the press report is accurate, which remains to be seen) that she threw herself in just as help arrived. That's pretty good if it stands up.
There may be a grey area in this case. He may have gone in as a genuine accident and she may then have decided, what with one thing and another, not only not to help him but also to make things a little more difficult for him. Murder 2 rather than murder 1.
There may be a grey area in this case. He may have gone in as a genuine accident and she may then have decided, what with one thing and another, not only not to help him but also to make things a little more difficult for him. Murder 2 rather than murder 1.
Desert Fox
Philosopher
- Joined
- Feb 4, 2014
- Messages
- 6,147
The trouble is that we know the reliability of eye witness testimony
anglolawyer
Banned
Well, it all depends. You can't write it all off.
Desert Fox
Philosopher
- Joined
- Feb 4, 2014
- Messages
- 6,147
I am unwilling to convict based on that. . . . .Need something far more than what we seem to have.
RWVBWL
Master Poster
About that cell phone call to 911.
By now you'all know that I kayak abit, right?
I'd wondered how she managed to make the call in such strong winds, big waves, and strong river currents?
All of these made Vinny flip his yak and fall into the river.
But Angelika?
Well she can stop paddling, losing her speed, put aside her paddle for a minute or so,
always fun to do for any amount of time when in strong winds or big waves, dig her phone out of her dry bag, turn it on and then make a call all without getting tossed into the river herself! Without the phone getting wet and phizzzlin' out.
Man,
the girl has skill!
Here,
read how Angelika,
in a snippet of an interview with People Magazine,
describes the conditions that evening:
In another conversation, Graswald discussed for this week's issue of PEOPLE what happened on the water that Sunday evening of April 19, when, she says, the water was really choppy, with waves "as high as a person" and strong tides. "It was scary," she says. (*)
I also wondered how, after connecting with 911,
was she able to maintain her balance with the cell phone in her hand?
I mean, anyone with kayak experience, who has bobbed up+down in strong winds and big waves
knows that it would be hard to hold a kayak paddle with 1 hand and use it for stability or paddling
whilst 1st making and then talking on a call, right?
A moment ago I read that Angelika placed her cell phone between her legs!
From Angelika and People Magazine:
Crying, she recalled how, after Viafore's kayak capsized, he told her to call 911, which she says she did – trying to keep the phone dry by bracing it between her legs inside her own kayak. (*)
So ah,
it's time for some more personal experience observations, ok?
The waves are sooo big that they filled up Vinny's cockpit and sent him tumbling into the water, but Angelika, she can stop paddling, stop using her paddle for bracing and balancing herself against the wind, surf, and currents, lash her paddle down so she does not lose it, dig thru her belongings, find her phone, maybe have even had to turn it on, make the call, place it down between her surely wet legs in her own open cockpit seating area, and then grab her paddle again, to use it, at the least, to brace herself so she does not get broached by a wave and capsize herself as she converses with 911?
OK,
sure...
And how windy, rough and dangerous was it out there again?
My 2¢,
RW
(*) - Link Info:
PEOPLE reporter Diane Herbst interviewed Angelika on three separate occasions since her April 29 arrest:
http://www.people.com/article/kayak...d-maintains-innocence-in-jailhouse-interviews
By now you'all know that I kayak abit, right?
I'd wondered how she managed to make the call in such strong winds, big waves, and strong river currents?
All of these made Vinny flip his yak and fall into the river.
But Angelika?
Well she can stop paddling, losing her speed, put aside her paddle for a minute or so,
always fun to do for any amount of time when in strong winds or big waves, dig her phone out of her dry bag, turn it on and then make a call all without getting tossed into the river herself! Without the phone getting wet and phizzzlin' out.
Man,
the girl has skill!
Here,
read how Angelika,
in a snippet of an interview with People Magazine,
describes the conditions that evening:
In another conversation, Graswald discussed for this week's issue of PEOPLE what happened on the water that Sunday evening of April 19, when, she says, the water was really choppy, with waves "as high as a person" and strong tides. "It was scary," she says. (*)
I also wondered how, after connecting with 911,
was she able to maintain her balance with the cell phone in her hand?
I mean, anyone with kayak experience, who has bobbed up+down in strong winds and big waves
knows that it would be hard to hold a kayak paddle with 1 hand and use it for stability or paddling
whilst 1st making and then talking on a call, right?
A moment ago I read that Angelika placed her cell phone between her legs!
From Angelika and People Magazine:
Crying, she recalled how, after Viafore's kayak capsized, he told her to call 911, which she says she did – trying to keep the phone dry by bracing it between her legs inside her own kayak. (*)
So ah,
it's time for some more personal experience observations, ok?
The waves are sooo big that they filled up Vinny's cockpit and sent him tumbling into the water, but Angelika, she can stop paddling, stop using her paddle for bracing and balancing herself against the wind, surf, and currents, lash her paddle down so she does not lose it, dig thru her belongings, find her phone, maybe have even had to turn it on, make the call, place it down between her surely wet legs in her own open cockpit seating area, and then grab her paddle again, to use it, at the least, to brace herself so she does not get broached by a wave and capsize herself as she converses with 911?
OK,
sure...
And how windy, rough and dangerous was it out there again?
My 2¢,
RW
(*) - Link Info:
PEOPLE reporter Diane Herbst interviewed Angelika on three separate occasions since her April 29 arrest:
http://www.people.com/article/kayak...d-maintains-innocence-in-jailhouse-interviews
Last edited:
quadraginta
Becoming Beth
And if she hadn't tried to call the refrain would be "You had a cell phone but didn't try to call for help?! What??!! Your phone might have gotten wet???!!!
So you were more worried about your phone than your fiancé. I see."
Sounds guilty to me.
So you were more worried about your phone than your fiancé. I see."
Sounds guilty to me.
RWVBWL
Master Poster
Hi Quadraginta,
My point was that she shoulda had her cockpit filled with water
if it was that windy and of such big waves during the time it took her to do what I wrote of above.
Of course she shoulda made the call, especially if she wants him gone!
Need that alibi, right?
I've got plenty of memories of getting drenched or bitch smacked by sideways broaching waves when I just stopped paddling for a moment to try and open up a cargo hatch to get something to eat outta my cargo hatch when paddling in strong winds and fun sized swells by myself a few miles off the coast, try it, you'll see what I mean.
I do not think the surf and wind was that strong to toss Vinny in the water by himself, with his paddle in his hand, his kayak under power, if it did not also do the same to Angelika when she stopped paddling, latched her paddle down somewhere, looked around and found her phone, made the call, do you see what I mean?
She's at the complete mercy of wind and waves, err chop then.
And all of this took some time. But she never was apparently tossed then, right?
I think that she helped Vinny initiate his ah, "accident",
pulled away, and made the call when she knew he was getting tired...
"Hold on Baby."
Pffft.
By the way, the 911 operator could easily understand Angelica's English.
Just, ya know, sayin...
My 2¢ only,
RW
My point was that she shoulda had her cockpit filled with water
if it was that windy and of such big waves during the time it took her to do what I wrote of above.
Of course she shoulda made the call, especially if she wants him gone!
Need that alibi, right?
I've got plenty of memories of getting drenched or bitch smacked by sideways broaching waves when I just stopped paddling for a moment to try and open up a cargo hatch to get something to eat outta my cargo hatch when paddling in strong winds and fun sized swells by myself a few miles off the coast, try it, you'll see what I mean.
I do not think the surf and wind was that strong to toss Vinny in the water by himself, with his paddle in his hand, his kayak under power, if it did not also do the same to Angelika when she stopped paddling, latched her paddle down somewhere, looked around and found her phone, made the call, do you see what I mean?
She's at the complete mercy of wind and waves, err chop then.
And all of this took some time. But she never was apparently tossed then, right?
I think that she helped Vinny initiate his ah, "accident",
pulled away, and made the call when she knew he was getting tired...
"Hold on Baby."
Pffft.
By the way, the 911 operator could easily understand Angelica's English.
Just, ya know, sayin...
My 2¢ only,
RW
Last edited:
RWVBWL
Master Poster
There's some interesting video here.
Video from The Search for Vinny:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wSFWva9NTVA
Video from The Search for Vinny:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wSFWva9NTVA
anglolawyer
Banned
That is not a reasonable position.
anglolawyer
Banned
Saw that before (may well have posted it already). Look at the boat in the distance making way through the waves. A tiddly little kayak would have serious problems IMVHO. And note the weather change he describes. Did she plan that?
Desert Fox
Philosopher
- Joined
- Feb 4, 2014
- Messages
- 6,147
You are talking about witnesses from what appears to be some distance, when it is getting dark, and fairly good waves. You consider it unreasonable to be extremely skeptical about what these eye witnesses claim.
anglolawyer
Banned
I thought you were making a point about eye witnesses generally. Sorry if I misunderstood.
RWVBWL
Master Poster
Hi Anglowlawyer,
When I watched that video,
I was surprised at the gnarly conditions shown.
Wind, + waves!
Oh my!
Just a FYI,
I am kidding!
Though I believe the vid is from the next day,
the wind ain't that strong, those baby white-caps are childs play,
at least as far as how I, experienced, like to play.
My wingman gets a kick when we are off shore + I disappear completely from view
for seconds atta time in good size swells that whitecap also, meaning they break at their crest...
I'd read that the wind was blowing at 16 miles per hour at the time:
In the early evening of April 19, Vince Viafore and fiancée Angelika Graswald started paddling home from Bannerman Island in the Hudson River back to the mainland, against the current and into 16 mile-per-hour winds.
Link: http://www.people.com/article/kayak-murder-angelika-graswald-case-experts
But I just found out it was not 16 miles per hour.
The wind was not even blowing at 10 miles an hour when the accident happened at around 7:15pm?
That's nothing for someone experienced!!!
Heck,
the kitboarders I know wouldn't even be out there then,
they like it blowin' about 15 to 20 miles per hour at the beach where I sometimes photograph them:
http://www.lasurfpix.exposuremanager.com/g/sunset_kiteboards
Here are the recorded wind speeds for the local area:
Hmmmm,
winds under 10 miles an hour...
Link:
http://www.wunderground.com/history....zip=12498&reqdb.magic=1&reqdb.wmo=99999&MR=1
Anyways,
I am still of the opinion that she initiated his death,
by her intentional sabotage of his gear, however slight it appears to be,
and by Angleika's apparent lack of calling for 911 help for over 20 minutes.
As that kayak instructor said,
Knock him outta his kayak, and paddle away.
What I believe she did,
while also in possession of his own paddle...
It was a Sunday evening, it had not gotten dark yet.
If she had called for help from anyone The Cornwall Yacht Club,
instead of 1st calling 911, someone, anyone coulda raced out and helped Vinny much faster...
I believe that she did not want anyone to help Vinny...
With her cell phone between her legs, she easily coulda paddled her yak in the winds,
blowing less than 10 miles an hour at the time, to have stayed very near him as they waited for help to arrive...
My 2¢ only,
RW
By the way AngloLawyer,
Nice Work on The Translation!!!
Last edited:
RWVBWL
Master Poster
About that 911 call
Assistant District Attorney Julie Mohl of the Orange County District Attorney's Office:
Mohl explained in court that on April 19, Graswald and Viafore, 46, kayaked from Plum Point, New York, to Bannerman's Island – in the Hudson River not far from West Point – at about 4:15 p.m. Two-thirds of the way back to the mainland, "the victim's kayak filled with water, causing it to capsize."
According to Mohl's statements, Viafore was holding onto the kayak and a flotation device at around 7:15 p.m. but Graswald didn't call 911 until 7:40 p.m. and at that time told the operator she could see Viafore. Graswald told investigators that her kayak capsized during the call, Mohl said, but "others say she intentionally capsized her kayak."
Graswald was rescued two minutes after her 911 call, Mohl said, but she could not tell rescuers "where he capsized or the last place where she saw him floating."
<snip>
Link:
http://www.people.com/article/angelika-graswald-bail-hearing-missing-kayaker-murder
* * *
25 minutes to finally put your kayak paddle down,
get your cell phone out and then call 911 for help saving your Fiancè's life?
The chick was then rescued 2 minutes later by folks from the Yacht Club?
But can not tell rescuers where she last saw Vinny?
OK...
Have a look at the Google Map again:
See the wakes coming of the recreational boats in the pic?
Now imagine a 911 call for help, where someone is in trouble out there.
It only took 1 of the boats 2 minutes to locate and reach Angelika, in all that water where she coulda been?
So ood that she could not say where Vinny was, though...
* * *
I've wondered how Angelika coulda caused Vinny to capsize,
the winds were not that strong that evening for an experienced paddler.
They were probably not paddling upstream, straight into and against the current,
they were, most likely, paddling across it,
probably on a NW heading, make that a 45° angle of paddle back to Plum Point.
Could Angelika have pushed Vinny over?
As he neared her for, say a kiss or even to grab and open a cold one,
a beer as they yaked back home from an afternoon spent on The Island and river?
What about just taking her paddle and pushing him over as he came near her?
Did he have any marks on him?
I just found this a moment ago:
The autopsy offers a grim, methodical accounting of Mr. Viafore’s body, which was recovered from the middle of the river on May 23. His face and abdomen were bloated, the report says, and marked by a mottled red and green discoloration.
Besides evidence of drowning, the only injuries noted in the report are a two-inch abrasion on the left torso and bruises on the lower chest and arm, also on the left side. The police have made no reference to a possible struggle between Mr. Viafore and Ms. Graswald, 35, while they were in their kayaks, though they have said Ms. Graswald moved his paddle out of his reach after he went in the water.
Link:
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/11/n...says-kayaker-was-victim-of-homicide.html?_r=0
* * *
Did Angelika push Vinny with her kayak paddle,
helping to cause him to lose balance and capsize?
And doing so left a 2 inch abrasion on his left torso?
Here is a pic of the paddle blades,
Angelika's is on the left, I believe.
Could the curved end of her paddle blade have caused a 2 inch abrasion on Vinny?
Easily...
My 2¢ only,
RW
Assistant District Attorney Julie Mohl of the Orange County District Attorney's Office:
Mohl explained in court that on April 19, Graswald and Viafore, 46, kayaked from Plum Point, New York, to Bannerman's Island – in the Hudson River not far from West Point – at about 4:15 p.m. Two-thirds of the way back to the mainland, "the victim's kayak filled with water, causing it to capsize."
According to Mohl's statements, Viafore was holding onto the kayak and a flotation device at around 7:15 p.m. but Graswald didn't call 911 until 7:40 p.m. and at that time told the operator she could see Viafore. Graswald told investigators that her kayak capsized during the call, Mohl said, but "others say she intentionally capsized her kayak."
Graswald was rescued two minutes after her 911 call, Mohl said, but she could not tell rescuers "where he capsized or the last place where she saw him floating."
<snip>
Link:
http://www.people.com/article/angelika-graswald-bail-hearing-missing-kayaker-murder
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25 minutes to finally put your kayak paddle down,
get your cell phone out and then call 911 for help saving your Fiancè's life?
The chick was then rescued 2 minutes later by folks from the Yacht Club?
But can not tell rescuers where she last saw Vinny?
OK...
Have a look at the Google Map again:
See the wakes coming of the recreational boats in the pic?
Now imagine a 911 call for help, where someone is in trouble out there.
It only took 1 of the boats 2 minutes to locate and reach Angelika, in all that water where she coulda been?
So ood that she could not say where Vinny was, though...
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I've wondered how Angelika coulda caused Vinny to capsize,
the winds were not that strong that evening for an experienced paddler.
They were probably not paddling upstream, straight into and against the current,
they were, most likely, paddling across it,
probably on a NW heading, make that a 45° angle of paddle back to Plum Point.
Could Angelika have pushed Vinny over?
As he neared her for, say a kiss or even to grab and open a cold one,
a beer as they yaked back home from an afternoon spent on The Island and river?
What about just taking her paddle and pushing him over as he came near her?
Did he have any marks on him?
I just found this a moment ago:
The autopsy offers a grim, methodical accounting of Mr. Viafore’s body, which was recovered from the middle of the river on May 23. His face and abdomen were bloated, the report says, and marked by a mottled red and green discoloration.
Besides evidence of drowning, the only injuries noted in the report are a two-inch abrasion on the left torso and bruises on the lower chest and arm, also on the left side. The police have made no reference to a possible struggle between Mr. Viafore and Ms. Graswald, 35, while they were in their kayaks, though they have said Ms. Graswald moved his paddle out of his reach after he went in the water.
Link:
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/11/n...says-kayaker-was-victim-of-homicide.html?_r=0
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Did Angelika push Vinny with her kayak paddle,
helping to cause him to lose balance and capsize?
And doing so left a 2 inch abrasion on his left torso?
Here is a pic of the paddle blades,
Angelika's is on the left, I believe.
Could the curved end of her paddle blade have caused a 2 inch abrasion on Vinny?
Easily...
My 2¢ only,
RW
Last edited:
anglolawyer
Banned
He is much bigger than her. Once she starts she must win. No going back. How could she be sure? I notice the plug has now completely disappeared from the story. Also, while noting your weather research, the fact remains that the weather was described as atrocious and dangerous by those who know the waters.
Maybe you could find the weather forecast for the day because if she planned it she must have consulted it.
Maybe you could find the weather forecast for the day because if she planned it she must have consulted it.