Angelika Graswald

[RWVBWL]

Hey Ya'all,
In case you are interested!

Here is a Justice for Vinny page:
https://www.facebook.com/Justice-for-Vinny-373954829456749/timeline/

And a Justice for Angelika page too:
https://m.facebook.com/Justice4Angelika

 

[Samson]

Hey Ya'all,
In case you are interested!

Here is a Justice for Vinny page:
https://www.facebook.com/Justice-for-Vinny-373954829456749/timeline/

And a Justice for Angelika page too:
https://m.facebook.com/Justice4Angelika

RWV, You are doing some good heavy lifting here, and of course we have years to go on this one. One thing I might ask you, since this guilter game is probably slightly outside your true comfort zone, after all damsel in distress usually needs expert assistance, and a chivalrous bent.
Do you imagine changing course and becoming a conventional innocenti, and what would you need?
I love the interrogations, because they eliminate the not good with language stuff. This girl could talk the leg off a donkey in perfect Americanese.
But what about this euphoric stuff?
Surely a guilty girl would avoid this sort of talk, especially if she was expecting to resume normal programming of her life.

 

[quadraginta]

This doesn't really surprise me much at all. In rivers, currents are not uniform from shore to shore or top to bottom. It's been a while since limnology class and I'm not a hydrologist, but I believe around a bend, the current will be faster on the outside of the bend than the inside and surface current is often fast while current on the bottom is slow.

For illustration:

http://www.eoearth.org/view/article/155233/

Basically, once his body made it into one of these pockets of laminar flow, say on the bottom or the side of the channel, it's not going to go too far.

River paddlers (canoe and kayak) often stop to rest in quiet areas which form in spots along the sides of rivers. I've done this even in white water (Cheat River) running far too fast for anyone not in a boat of some sort to be safe.

Sometimes it's called "eddying up", as in finding an eddy current which actually flows backward from the main current and in a circular pattern.

Flotsam and debris are often caught in such eddys and can stay there for remarkably long stretches of time.

 

[Samson]

More yakking tragedy today.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11519019

 

[RWVBWL]

RWV, You are doing some good heavy lifting here, and of course we have years to go on this one. One thing I might ask you, since this guilter game is probably slightly outside your true comfort zone, after all damsel in distress usually needs expert assistance, and a chivalrous bent.
Do you imagine changing course and becoming a conventional innocenti, and what would you need?

Hiya Samson!
Thanks for the props,
yes, for the time being,
I am a Colpevolisti!

As we go waay back,
I value, I respect, and I will always consider your opinion, friend!



I'm digging deep,
but yet who knows, maybe I could someday be an Innocentisti, again!!!
I'll letcha know if and when I wanna display that card,
ya know...

That said,
let us continue onward with this discussion, ok?

I love the interrogations, because they eliminate the not good with language stuff. This girl could talk the leg off a donkey in perfect Americanese.
<snip>

I have to agree, Samson!
this gal was in the U.S. of A. since she was 15 years old,
she told this on NBC news to a reporter, I seem to recall.
And yes, in case The Grinder is ah, lurking,
I can go dig up a link,
hahaha!



For any of you who believe that Angelika
can not understand nor can not comprehend English,
well have a look at this:

You do know that Angelika was study-in' for her Real Estate License,
right?

Here in America,
not in Latvia, ok?

So what language was she studying in,
or taking notes in, or gonna be quizzed in???

https://instagram.com/p/0Vn6lAqIjd/

Please, please, please
do not ask me to post what she wrote here,
in English, as she studied with The Rascal,
her kitty, nearby,
ok?

For if you know me, I will post it,
to the best of my ability!


Angelika can not understand speaking English or reading English?
Pfffft!...

I'd betcha that if I had stopped by The Grand Centro Grill,
(where Angelika was working as a bar tender when she 1st met Vinny),
and I had ordered my favorite drink,
a Jack + Coke with 2 cherries in it,
Angelika would not have given me a Jack + Pepsi with Fruit Loops in it!!!


RW

 

[Desert Fox]

I think the issue of her not understanding English was a concern not a major point

Samson's post just prior to yours is more of what I am concerned with. People die in almost freezing water pretty damn easily without any intent to kill anybody.

 

[RWVBWL]

Hi DesertFox!
We've got some history, online in debate.
I respect your posting's, your input, I'll listen to what you write...

That said,
Angelika's defense lawyer is and has been makin' a stink
that Angelika can not understand English.
Bull crap-ola!!!

As I showed up above in my last post here.
If I read about this online, well I'll rebuttal it,
ya know?

* * * * *

I'm gonna go odd-ball here,
hear me out, ok?

DesertFox,
Maybe I luved you before.
You're f***in' hot, treat me to the things I want,
make me feel sexy...

But nowadays,
maybe I can not stand you.
Maybe I'd like my freedom back, maybe I want you gone,
you bother me, you piss me off, all the time.
F***in' ****hole.

I do not want to go to a strip club with your friends,
I do not want to have a 3-some, or a 4-some with your friends!
I will smack you in public, in front of your ****in' friends!
*** off!


I'm kinda simple,
but do not F*** with me!

I just wanna dig in the dirt,
play in the flowers,
photograph beauty,
+ play with my cat...

But I'm not working, where can I go?
How can I survive?

I think I know a way to get rid of you,
and collect $250,000.00 dollars.
You ******.

I'll subtlety sabotage your kayak, your gear.
I hope that you die. I'll be ok with it...

Just like that f***ed up dude did to RW's sister,
who, using an icepick, kept on prickin' 14 of her GMC pick-up trucks tires,
a freak who seemingly wanted his sister dead.
You know what I'm writin' about...

* * * * *

People die in cold water all the time.
But what if they are pushed? Knocked outta their yak as it's gettin' dark?
What if the beneficiary of $250,000.00 dollars grabs his paddle
and just sits there, watching.

Watchin' him struggle, suffer, and drown???

Waiting.

And then finally,
after the dude says he ain't gonna make it,
calls 911 for help???

So,
ah, when was it that Angelika called 911 for help?
Before or after Vinny said he was not gonna make it?

So,
ah, why was Angelika,
for the 1st time ever seen in any of her yakin' pix,
wearin' a lifejacket that evening?

Sorry to go 1st or 3rd person on ya,
or whatever it is that I just did,
ok DesertFox!?

Look,
I can dig that cold water kills.
I surf, I yak.

My avatar shows me trunkin' it as I surf.
I dig doin' this, trunkin' it, often, over the last 5 years or so,
even in December, January, February, too.

I luv the feelin' of cold water on my skin,
far more than most peps can stand here in the waters of Los Angeles.
Sometimes I do so with a single airplane shot of JD or Vodka in the system, pre-surf...

The shot,
especially 2, make my brain not even feel the cold, cold waters in Winter...

That said,
have you ever had ice-creamin' head-aches from playin' in cold water?
Goin' under sooo many waves that your brain is freaking out?
It hurts, friend!


Ever had a hard time tryin' to able to zip up your pants after gettin' outta the water?
Or had a beeee-itch of a time fittin' the key into your car door lock,
your hands just do not work?...

I'll tell ya this,
if it is gettin' dark, and I can knock you outta your kayak with my paddle,
take your own paddle away from ya, and watch your arse suffer hypo and drown,
I too will collect them $250,000.00 dollars afterwards.

Get past the news media, the Family + friends, the police...
IF, IF, IF I got that Life Insurance policy in my name!
Just as long as no ones sees this...

I wonder what that witness,
who had a telescope in his living room and could watch the Hudson River waters,
told that Grand Jury investigatin' Vinny's death?

For Angelika's in a jail cell right now as I type and you read this.

And Vinny?
Well he lies in a grave.
A victim of what The State of New York calls his death,
A Murder.

Or is that just Manslaughter?
Pfffft.
RW

 

[anglolawyer]

Randy, how do you visualise the part where she knocks him out of the boat? Also, when you fall out of a kayak, is it natural to let go of the paddle?

 

[RWVBWL]

Hi AngloLawyer,
Generally, when a person is coming up alongside another to meet up,
they are under more forward propulsion than the other person sitting there + waiting.

Even in choppy windy conditions,
been there, done this, many times.
When you're out on the water for hours and hours, ya gotta take a break sometimes...

As they near the stationary person,
they stop paddling, start to glide, they might even use the paddle blade to slow down a bit. At some point they usually take their kayak paddle out of the water and reach out with it, the person more stationary then grabs it and pulls the person coming near, closer, alongside.

This is when I can visualize Angelika taking her paddle
and pushing Vinny on the left side of his torso, causing him to capsize,
as he does not have any forward momentum...

 

[Bob001]

Randy, how do you visualise the part where she knocks him out of the boat? Also, when you fall out of a kayak, is it natural to let go of the paddle?

I haven't read this whole thread, but in case it hasn't been posted, CBS "48 Hours" devoted an hour to this case and makes a compelling argument that the woman was framed by aggressive cops who started with false premises and interrogated her for 11 hours. For example, that missing "drain plug" is actually on the top of the kayak, and the small hole is used only to drain it when it's stored. They demonstrated that in actual use, only a few drops of water could enter the kayak that way. She pretty much told the cops whatever they told her to say. The show pretty effectively refutes each element of the prosecution's case. This looks like another case where the cops went after a suspect because she didn't grieve the way they thought she should.
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/interrogation-video-raises-key-questions-in-new-york-kayak-murder-case/

Also, support for her:
http://www.people.com/article/kayak-murder-angelika-graswald-case-experts

 

[RWVBWL]

Missing gun, angry Diary

Greetings ya'all,
I had kinda wondered how the cops found Angelika's Diary,
I mean, did they get a search warrant to go look for it or something?

Reading around, I found this link:
http://www.hlntv.com/video/2015/05/15/must-see-kayak-murder-mystery

"She said police questioned her about a missing gun,
and found her Diary, detailing Viafore's alleged requests for rough sex,
3-somes, an entry she wrote wishing he were dead because of it".
Etc...


I own a gun, do any of you folks?
I know where it is at all the time.
A missing gun?
Hmmmm...


And that Diary,
sounds like some good stuff in there!
I wonder if Angelka wrote it Latvian?
Or English?

 

[shuttlt]

I haven't read this whole thread, but in case it hasn't been posted, CBS "48 Hours" devoted an hour to this case and makes a compelling argument that the woman was framed by aggressive cops who started with false premises and interrogated her for 11 hours. For example, that missing "drain plug" is actually on the top of the kayak, and the small hole is used only to drain it when it's stored. They demonstrated that in actual use, only a few drops of water could enter the kayak that way. She pretty much told the cops whatever they told her to say. The show pretty effectively refutes each element of the prosecution's case. This looks like another case where the cops went after a suspect because she didn't grieve the way they thought she should.
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/interrogation-video-raises-key-questions-in-new-york-kayak-murder-case/

Also, support for her:
http://www.people.com/article/kayak-murder-angelika-graswald-case-experts

The location and function of the drain plug should have been known to anybody interested enough in the case to spend half a minute on Google. Where are they getting the information on it only letting in a few drops of water? When I first read similar claims from the defence lawyer, I Googled "kayak drain plug dangers" and found this:

http://www.fishingfury.com/20130726/offshore-kayak-fishing-trip-takes-a-dangerous-turn

I know the story has been posted upthread, because I posted it:

What I also did not realize was that I had unscrewed the drain plug-in my kayak the night before to get some of the water out of it from when I capsized, and had forgotten to screw it back in before I headed out. I was out in the roughest seas I’ve ever been in, alone, and was taking on a lot of water without the slightest clue that it was happening.

Here's another one:
http://www.canoekayak.co.uk/Articles/10-Common-Whitewater-Kayaking-Mistakes---And-how-to-avoid-them/_ft974_tp34_cat9

This is a classic, and a favourite of paddlers of all levels of experience. The problem is today, in the world of ever bigger creek boats with plenty of volume to absorb water being taken on, it can be sometime before you realise that your kayak has come somewhat sluggish, and makes an unnerving sloshing sound as you turn and edge. Be vigilant, and always re-tighten your drain bung at the earliest possible opportunity after emptying. If you have ‘mischeviously fun’ paddling mates this process should be even more rigorous!

Presumably the case isn't just about whether or not a Kayak just lets in a few drops of water without the drain plug. Specifically searching for dangers is clearly not going to get a representative sample, but a "few drops" seems like excessive downplaying to me. It was pretty choppy on the day, wasn't it? In which case, surely he'd have been taking on a little water every time a wave went over the back of the kayak? If he paused and lent back, or anybody lent on the back of his kayak, he'd take on some water.

Edit: You said "they demonstrated" - where in the 48 hours do they demonstrate it? It's 43 minutes long.

 

[shuttlt]

Is see a demonstration 23 minutes in run by a defence expert in water with no meaningful waves where the kayaker says he's taking on minimal water. Im pretty sure they said earlier that the conditions were bad on the day with waves 4-5 feet high [I was wrong, it was 3-5 feet] and not at all like the conditions they were testing in. The 48 hours video format is terrible and keeps showing me ads, so it's hard to search.

There are then some more people from the defence saying that they had assumed the plug was in the bottom. I don't know why they would assume that. It seems to me like a hole in the bottom would cause the kayak to sink too quickly and obviously for it to pose a danger.

Is this what you are basing your post on? The parts I watched looked like a defence infomercial. Is there a prosecution rebuttal to this later on?

 

[shuttlt]

OK, I see about a minute later they for some reason do another test where they pull the kayak sideways through the water with the spraydeck on and off, and with the plug in and out. They appear to make one artificial wave break sideways over the kayak. For the spraydeck off/plug in test, they look in the middle and see water sloshing around. For the spraydesk on/plug out test, they instead tip the kayak out. I don't kayak often, but for small amounts of water, it is really hard to get the water out because the plug isn't actually in the end.

Honestly this is a weird test. Why create a fake sideways wave by strapping the kayak sideways to the back of the boat and generating some wash that looks nothing like a 4-5 foot wave, if that is what was supposed to have been breaking over the kayak on the day? Is there a reason why sideways waves are used here? I'd have thought you'd taken on a lot more water with the spraydesk off the way they do it than if the kayak actually got to ride over the waves as you would normally paddle. Who kayaks sideways on to 4-5 foot waves? Why use a single wave, when presumably lots of waves over an extended period would have been involved? This is a paid for defence demonstration.

Then they test whether holding the paddle would help him float by.... attaching the paddle to a brick rather than getting somebody to try and use it to help them float. In thinking about this it occurred to me, that my kids foam floats that they take to the pool have enough buoyancy to make a significant difference to how hard I have to work to stay afloat, but I can certainly make them sink to the bottom. Isn't their test far more demanding than it needs to be?

 

[Bob001]

...
This is a paid for defence demonstration.
...

I don't have time to watch the video again, but note that a full transcript follows the video on the CBS link. What's really most significant is the degree to which the police pretty much fed her the lines they wanted her to say during an 11-hour interrogation. She doesn't seem to understand the trouble she's in, and starts talking about how she wants to finish up soon so she can go home and take care of her cat. But the video makes it pretty clear that she didn't tamper with the guy's kayak as the police claim (the craft wasn't going to sink with the drain plug out), she didn't sabotage his paddle, and she didn't somehow force him to go kayaking in cold water with high waves after consuming a near-drunk level of alcohol while not wearing a life jacket. This sure looks like another frame job.

 

[shuttlt]

I don't have time to watch the video again, but note that a full transcript follows the video on the CBS link.

I spotted that after watching the video for a bit. It is much clearer in the video what tests they are actually performing and how.

But the video makes it pretty clear that she didn't tamper with the guy's kayak as the police claim (the craft wasn't going to sink with the drain plug out),

I see the defence saying that it wouldn't sink, but its not particularly surprising that they would say that. I don't see it being proved in any serious way. They do a weird test were they cause a single wave to go sideways over a kayak lashed to the back of a boat. And a report that no water went into the drain hole during realistic rowing in absolutely calm conditions. These are paid for acted out PR demonstrations by the defence handled completely uncritically, we should view them critically.

 

[Desert Fox]

I see the defence saying that it wouldn't sink, but its not particularly surprising that they would say that. I don't see it being proved in any serious way. They do a weird test were they cause a single wave to go sideways over a kayak lashed to the back of a boat. And a report that no water went into the drain hole during realistic rowing in absolutely calm conditions. These are paid for acted out PR demonstrations by the defence handled completely uncritically, we should view them critically.

if the Kayak is like the one I have used, the actual flotation body is completely separate from the compartment you are in. It would not matter if it fills up with water, still be no issue. Biggest issue would be tipping over the kayak and falling out.

 

[shuttlt]

if the Kayak is like the one I have used, the actual flotation body is completely separate from the compartment you are in. It would not matter if it fills up with water, still be no issue. Biggest issue would be tipping over the kayak and falling out.

I agree. I think some of them also have foam floats in the body of the kayak. They tend not to want to sink to the bottom. A kayak is also much harder to move through the water when it's got a bunch of water in it.

 

[RWVBWL]

Luv that Motive

Question for you guys:
Who buys a $250,000.00 life insurance policy
and names the girl that he is just only dating,
as The Beneficiary?

A dude smitten?
A dude p-whipped?
Whip It, Whip It Good!

A dude blinded to his reality,
who is dating a girl that smacks him in public?

Where's the fat diamond?
Have a look at this pic:

If you've read my posts here on The Angelika Graswald Thread,
well ya might know I've spent some time diggin' around.

Odd to not see a huuuge diamond on Angelika's hand!
Not in any of the pix I've seen on her FaceBook page, nor Instagram.
BUT she did have a coupla huge life insurance policies in her name,
if I understand it correctly...


I dated a gal before,
bought her diamond earrings,
thought I was gonna marry her, and her kids too.

Told her 1 time,
(when I got sick with a tumor in my throat,
which made it sooo hard to yell out to the boyz surfin' next to Venice Pier,
heck they could not even hear me heckle, err I mean yell at them to "Catch a Wave".)
that I was gonna hook her up, err make that hook up her young son, if I died.

The chick told me, somewhat sarcasticly in her own off-beat way,
that I would be more valuable to her dead, then.
F' her!

I never bought her, err her kid, that life insurance policy,
never bought her a diamond ring, and she finally moved back home,
back east where she's from, yea! And I'm still alive, my voice is back and as strong as when I was a kid!
Stoked, ya might say!!!

* * * * *

So ah Vinny, well he'd been had been married before.
As did Angelika

As did my last significant GF.

As I'm an old Devo fan,
I'm kinda an odd-ball, so ah,
well let me get a lil Mongolid on ya!

This spud-boy, a member of The Smart Patrol,
well I've never been there, never done it, ya know, buy the chick a diamond ring, take that walk.
It's still been my Freedom of Choice
but if I ever do do so, if I ever do go for it!
it be cool right?


Will I be livin' in a Beautiful World?

Or will I be Through bein' Cool?


Gosh,
this geek, err Jocko Homo
sure hopes he ain't gonna be some dude who Can't Get Me No - Satisfaction! if he do!


Hahahaha!
* * * * *

As for Angelika,
well she had been married 2 times previously.
Been there, done that, right?

Have any of you dude's ever bought a girl a huuuge life insurance policy,
yet you did not have kids with her, nor had you even bought her a huuuge diamond ring, yet,
nor even married the gal, yet?

Just wondering.
In what kinda way does an un-married girl start a convo with her dude about life insurance???

After a night of "Rough Luv?"

"Hey baby,
will you still luv me when you're gone?!?"

For those $250,000 dollars,
well it sure seems like Angelika had a lotta freedom luving motive to me...
RW

 

[Desert Fox]

They were talking about getting married from what I understand. The life insurance could also cost as little as about $35 a month so not even that much money based on a healthy and fairly young woman.