Baby rapist put on probation

[NWO Sentryman]

You would need to provide evidence that there is a true cause-and-effect going on; that a supposed low recidivism rate is due to hellish conditions rather than other factors.

It's a different form of "hellish" as in not so much due to inmates shivving each other so much as being a prison run on military lines, with the discipline being draconian well beyond most other prisons. Anyway, the recidivism rate in Glasshouse in the UK is far lower than that of Bastoy.

 

[Matthew Best]

This isn't at all germane to the discussion, but do people normally refer to 3 year olds as babies (other than as a term of endearment)?

Let me check with the babysitter.

 

[angrysoba]

I have to admit I'm mildly surprised at that. Though I try to pay attention to news from outside the US, I don't hear or read much regarding people from the UK (for example) who have kind of a bloodlusty outlook toward criminals. I figured that the lessons learned from the age of gin in English history would have been blunt evidence that harsher and harsher punishments do not lower crime rates or recidivism rates. When even children were hanged due to petty theft a hundred years ago and that still does not act as a deterrent, then perhaps we all need to rethink how we treat criminals in general.

ETA: hopefully the last comment makes some sense. I'm kind of tired yet.

Yeah, I don't even think most people who support the death penalty even think of it as a deterrent but mostly a case of retribution.

Here's a story about one of the periodic attempts to "bring back hanging".

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-14402195

 

[Ryokan]

What was the baby wearing?

 

[Ryokan]

It's been a while since I stopped being amazed at how some people rely on criminals to deliver justice, and what a hardon they get for harsh and violent prisons. The vast majority of people going to prison will eventually walk the streets again, and I would rather not have people who spent years in a prison like that to walk free.

As for capital punishment, even after Breivik's terrorist attack, Norwegians polled heavily against the death penalty. The death penalty evidently and obviously doesn't work, unless the only reason for it is bloody revenge.

 

[3point14]

It's been a while since I stopped being amazed at how some people rely on criminals to deliver justice, and what a hardon they get for harsh and violent prisons. The vast majority of people going to prison will eventually walk the streets again, and I would rather not have people who spent years in a prison like that to walk free.

As for capital punishment, even after Breivik's terrorist attack, Norwegians polled heavily against the death penalty. The death penalty evidently and obviously doesn't work, unless the only reason for it is bloody revenge.

I'd like to take this opportunity to bring up my opinion that the death penalty should be on the statue books only for the offence of 'abuse of the public trust while an elected official' or some such.

Then it might just work as a deterrent.

/derail

 

[NWO Sentryman]

It's been a while since I stopped being amazed at how some people rely on criminals to deliver justice, and what a hardon they get for harsh and violent prisons. The vast majority of people going to prison will eventually walk the streets again, and I would rather not have people who spent years in a prison like that to walk free.

As for capital punishment, even after Breivik's terrorist attack, Norwegians polled heavily against the death penalty. The death penalty evidently and obviously doesn't work, unless the only reason for it is bloody revenge.

I was thinking something along the lines of every inmate being put on 24 hour lockdown/suicide watch for the duration of their sentence. I'm sure that would make sure they stay on the straight and narrow no matter what afterward, and would work a lot better than spoiling them rotten.

Meanwhile, as for the death penalty/norway the UK has gone "tough on crime!" since at least the James Bulger murder and/or the Hungerford/Dunblane massacres, and does serve a purpose: to make sure threats to society are extirpated.

 

[The Don]

I was thinking something along the lines of every inmate being put on 24 hour lockdown/suicide watch for the duration of their sentence. I'm sure that would make sure they stay on the straight and narrow no matter what afterward, and would work a lot better than spoiling them rotten.

The evidence points to the contrary. Inmates who are held in this way leave prison angry and dissociated from society.

 

[NWO Sentryman]

The evidence points to the contrary. Inmates who are held in this way leave prison angry and dissociated from society.

But they know that if they break the terms of their probation, they will be going back there, and solitary/suicide watch is worse than the risk of being shivved by other inmates or a flea pit apartment.

 

[Ryokan]

I was thinking something along the lines of every inmate being put on 24 hour lockdown/suicide watch for the duration of their sentence. I'm sure that would make sure they stay on the straight and narrow no matter what afterward, and would work a lot better than spoiling them rotten.

That would be torture, under both EU and Norwegian law. Years and years in solitary confinement? Yeah, I'm sure you get healthy, happy and productive citizens after that.

 

[NWO Sentryman]

That would be torture, under both EU and Norwegian law. Years and years in solitary confinement? Yeah, I'm sure you get healthy, happy and productive citizens after that.

I doubt they will be "productive citizens" unless you drag employers kicking and screaming into having a quota of ex-cons under their employ and drag the public kicking and screaming into allowing ex-cons to live in their neighbourhoods.

Besides, if prison is a "Clean hell", then I doubt the ex-con will want to breach the terms of their probation or reoffend.

 

[bluesjnr]

DP

If he did then he's a worse animal than I thought.

 

[Cainkane1]

Is this an example of the best justice system money can buy ?

http://www.delawareonline.com/story...y-preview-du-pont-heir-stayed-prison/7016769/

What a stupd judge. He might rape another baby if hes crazy enough to rape his own toddler daughter. This happened in Atlanta some years ago when a man was caught molesting an 8 year old girl and had been doing so for most of the childs life. He was borderling retarded and thats the excuse the judge gave for putting him on probation.

What is "fourth degree rape" anyway? A type of violation that doesn't include penetration?

The mans disgusting and should be kept out of society.

 

[The Don]

But they know that if they break the terms of their probation, they will be going back there, and solitary/suicide watch is worse than the risk of being shivved by other inmates or a flea pit apartment.

As I said earlier, available evidence shows this not to be the case. Prisoners who aren't socialised are much more likely to re-offend and are much more likely to suffer severe mental illness which in turn will have a significant impact on their ongoing life chances.

 

[3point14]

As I said earlier, available evidence shows this not to be the case. Prisoners who aren't socialised are much more likely to re-offend and are much more likely to suffer severe mental illness which in turn will have a significant impact on their ongoing life chances.

Plesae don't let annoying little things like outcome or facts get in the way of a good bloodlust please.

As soon as you apply logic then anyone who sincerely uses the absolutely useless phrase 'tough on crime' goes mental.

 

[IDB87]

Baby WHAT?



Why is everything and everybody terrible?

 

[Ryokan]

I doubt they will be "productive citizens" unless you drag employers kicking and screaming into having a quota of ex-cons under their employ and drag the public kicking and screaming into allowing ex-cons to live in their neighbourhoods.

So not only do you want people who are mentally broken from being solitary for a number of years, you don't want want them to have the opportunity to get jobs either?

Seems to me like you want to live in a crime ridden country. Because what you advocate is a recipe for making people criminals for life.

 

[NWO Sentryman]

Baby WHAT?



Why is everything and everybody terrible?

What's even worse is the "soft on crime" lot cheering on the judge.

@Ryokan.

I was merely stating the truth about an ex-con's chances on the outside world, regardless of prison conditions. And tell me your solutions for that conundrum short of forcing it down society's throats (especially when the Bulger murder is in living memory in the UK's case) and dragging employers kicking and screaming towards hiring ex-cons.

@The_Don

We both know that an ex-con has relatively little life chances once they get out anyway, especially when employers will just shred their application forms. What I am saying is that the "clean hell" is meant to be something so dreaded that ex-cons will rather suffer the slings and arrows of fortune in society than reoffend.

 

[superfreddy]

I believe he got off easy because of his money and status. I lived in Delaware for 9 years and the DuPont name carries a lot of weight. Many elected officials and judges are linked to the family. He should be in jail.

Being a responsible member of society and a firm believer in the justice system, I don't agree with the "mob justice" mentality. However, reading about this case has made me ponder about my own feelings: what if this guy did something like that to my daughter? Would I be OK with him being put in jail and let mob justice take its course?

 

[The Don]

@The_Don

We both know that an ex-con has relatively little life chances once they get out anyway, especially when employers will just shred their application forms. What I am saying is that the "clean hell" is meant to be something so dreaded that ex-cons will rather suffer the slings and arrows of fortune in society than reoffend.

No we don't. In previous threads I have provided you with examples of organisations which actively seek to recruit ex-offenders. I have described how changes in the law have significantly shortened the time for which spent convictions have to declared on a job application. Ex-offenders regularly get jobs which doesn't mean that they don't face an uphill struggle (but then again, ensuring that all ex offenders are embittered and tortured will hardly help in this regard).

One of the "problems" with may offenders is that they are not the best at making life choices. I have no idea why you think your torture will act as a deterrent when evidence shows that the harshness of the regime makes no significant difference to deterrent (and significantly increases reoffending rates)