DC
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i would to both say, look into the future and not back, move on. without using the "get over it"
The "Nakba" Myth
- Thread starter Skeptic
- Start date
i would to both say, look into the future and not back, move on. without using the "get over it"
Germany and Israel have very good trade and diplomatic relations...do they not?
Germany also has decent relations with Poland, where they murdered millions of civilians.
Peaceful relations with Israel is clearly not contingent upon forgetting the ethnic cleansing that took place in 1948 and 1967....any more than peaceful relations between Germany, Poland, & Israel is contingent upon forgetting about the Shoah.
No one is comparing the Shoah to the Nakba. They were two very different and distinct events.
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Again, no one is comparing the Shoah to the Nakba. They were two very different and distinct events.
This is becoming what they call, a strawman.
Again, no one is comparing the Shoah to the Nakba. They were two very different and distinct events.
This is becoming what they call, a strawman.
Then stop comparing them.
I am going to write this in caps, so all who may be far-sighted can read it.
I AM NOT COMPARING THE HOLOCAUST TO THE NAKBA. THEY WERE TWO VERY DIFFERENT AND DISTINCT EVENTS.
DC
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define "Compare"
unfortunately it appears you are the only one laughing.
What can one do but to laugh at the absurdity of this exchange?
You say you're not comparing the Holocaust to the Nakba while you're using the Holocaust as a comparison for an argument about the Nakba...
You say you're not comparing the Holocaust to the Nakba while you're using the Holocaust as a comparison for an argument about the Nakba...
you said that the Palestinians should get over the Nakba in order to live in peace with the Israelis.
I have shown that Israel has made peace with the Germans and the Poles, while clearly not getting over the Holocaust nor forgetting about it.
This is not comparing the two events, only showing how a nation need not let go or forget about suffering in order to make peace with those who who were involved in their suffering.
If YOU think that is comparing the Holocaust to the Nakba, then I nor anyone else here can help you.
Suppose the Jews today claimed that, due to the holocaust, they will never be at peace unless Germany is utterly destroyed and all Germans exiled or killed. That would, indeed, be obsessing over the holocaust in a way that should be gotten over.
But this is precisely what Hamas, PLO, & co. are saying (and teaching their people), mutatis mutandis.
But this is precisely what Hamas, PLO, & co. are saying (and teaching their people), mutatis mutandis.
another strawman from Skeptic.
the Palestinians have signed numerous peace agreements with Israel and coordinate on all sorts of matters, including security.
the Palestinians have also accepted a state within the 1967 borders (with small land exchanges).
what will the next strawman be?
DC
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i wanted a definition, not an example, but OK.
yes indeed your example is correct.
what you do here is comparing the debate to a Monty Python sketch.
(which is rather insulting for Monty Python)
but maybe you notice, nobody did that with the Holocaust and the Nakba.
saying, the debate and the Monty Python sketch are history, we must look forward. is not a comparison.
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Mycroft
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So you think Sol Stern is a "Nakba Denier"?
What facts about the "Nakba" does he deny?
Mycroft
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Again, no one is comparing the Shoah to the Nakba. They were two very different and distinct events.
This is becoming what they call, a strawman.
You first made the comparison in this thread in this post here:
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=6190221#post6190221
Here, allow me to save you the trouble of looking it up and quote it for you.
a_unique_person
Director of Hatcheries and Conditioning
Germany doesn't have Jews under it's military control. Jews are citizens of Germany and free to vote, they aren't relegated to second class citizens in a bantustan. Big difference.
i wasn't comparing the events, only the reactions to the events by the Jews and Palestinians.
if Jews don't have to let go of the Shoah, Palestinians don't have to let go of the Nakba. this is comparing the events, simply how the involved communities deal with it.
duhh.
....p.s., I love how this discussion of folks who deny the expulsion & continued exile of the Palestinian people from Israel has turned into, once again, a "how dare you compare the Holocaust to any other event!!!!" thread.
excuse me for breathing, but the Holocaust is not some holy event, that can NEVER be compared to any other event from the past or the future. don't forget the Holocaust, no....but lose the sense of arrogance over it.
Genocide took place in Rwanda at such a speed and in such number, in such a short amount of time, that even Hitler would be jealous.
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Mycroft
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That's a comparison.
So...you claim not to have compared the two events, then you argue that it should be okay for you to compare the two events.
Nice.
Without claiming the Holocaust is "holy", can you think of any reasons at all why it might be offensive to make comparisons between Israel and Nazi Germany?
Mycroft
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So...you're saying the Jews in Nazi Germany weren't treated badly enough to warrant that kind of response?