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The "Nakba" Myth

Virus said:
How many Arabs outside of Israel have a meaningful vote? How many can protest the actions of their government?
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how many have had their land confiscated by the govt. to build housing for another ethnic group?

how many lived under martial law for 30 years while the other main ethnic group around them did not?

how many of them pay taxes which go to build housing that they cannot live in?
 
Thunder said:
how many have had their land confiscated by the govt. to build housing for another ethnic group?

how many lived under martial law for 30 years while the other main ethnic group around them did not?

how many of them pay taxes which go to build housing that they cannot live in?
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Evasion noted.

There's only one country ranked as "free" in the Middle East by Freedom House. Israel.

http://www.freedomhouse.org/template.cfm?page=546&year=2010
 
a_unique_person said:
No, it is just one more example of a misunderstanding leading to personalisation of an issue and unwarranted abuse. I'm betting it won't be the last time this happens, either.
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So you won't acknowledge your lack of clarity on the post in question by posting a rebuttal. Thanks for the admission by non-rebuttal.
 
Thunder said:
yeah, and Israel is less free than Slovena, Slovakia, and Costa Rica.

that tells you something.
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Yeah it tells you that it's as free as Japan. Shock horror. How they must suffer. Let's all go and protest about Japan while being indifferent to, or tacitly supporting North Korea.
 
bigjelmapro said:
Follow the succession of replies, and what you responded to here:

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6277130&postcount=714

Where's the connection to what you stated above 'clearly' in reference to the Ottoman empire? A 'dissolved empire' (past tense, as in non-existent anymore) is not a clear reference to the 'tyranny' you stated, but is more interpreted to refer to Israel or the Palestine mandate.

So cease with the whinging about being a victim. You lack clarity, and this is not the first time....
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So you aren't clear, and I just stick arguing a point, then you say I'm not clear, and stick the boot in. Just typical of the extremist Israeli supporters, never forget to attack the individual you disagree with.

Just to be clear, the Ottoman Empire was a tyrrany. If you didn't submit to their rule, you were liable to be treated like the Armenians, with an act of genocide. The people under their rule were not Ottomans, they were subjects of a tyranny, and denied their right to self determination. That does not remove their existence, nor right to self determination.
 
a_unique_person said:
So you aren't clear, and I just stick arguing a point, then you say I'm not clear, and stick the boot in. Just typical of the extremist Israeli supporters, never forget to attack the individual you disagree with.
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Who you trying to convince by accusing me of the same thing I'm accusing you of? I've provided a sequence of posts to show that you weren't clear. Simple as that. Now I'm an extremist. Nice.

Desperation at its worst, and a poor attempt at that buddy.

Just to be clear, the Ottoman Empire was a tyrrany. If you didn't submit to their rule, you were liable to be treated like the Armenians, with an act of genocide. The people under their rule were not Ottomans, they were subjects of a tyranny, and denied their right to self determination. That does not remove their existence, nor right to self determination.
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You've been asked before to provide evidence, not just by me, about this 'tyranny', but you simply keep repeating the same allegation. Now you add 'genocide' into the mix...
 
And just as a not AUP, this really hasn't been a discussion about the Ottomans in the first place, so I have no interest in feeding into this deflection from the OP of this thread.
 
bigjelmapro said:
And just as a not AUP, this really hasn't been a discussion about the Ottomans in the first place, so I have no interest in feeding into this deflection from the OP of this thread.
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You were the one who raised the point about the Palestinians merely being part of the remnants of a faded empire. The Ottomans were not benign, they attempted genocide on one of their states, the Armenians. The people ruled by the Ottomans had their own identity.
 
a_unique_person said:
You were the one who raised the point about the Palestinians merely being part of the remnants of a faded empire. The Ottomans were not benign, they attempted genocide on one of their states, the Armenians. The people ruled by the Ottomans had their own identity.
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http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6277051&postcount=709
You can go back to that response where I was talking to BP about the term Palestine and how it was applied retroactively to Arabs. Then you butted in and started talking about the Ottoman empire and genocide against the Armenians (which you also posted a few responses previous with Virus). I was talking about the land itself and how it was time for state building following the collapse of the Ottoman empire, as the British and French were doing throughout this former empire.

Then you miraculously applied the hypothetical tyranny and genocide to what was to be the Palestine mandate because the Ottomans did so against the Armenians. You have yet to provide evidence for this tyranny and genocide (or threat thereof) against the inhabitants of what was to be the Palestine mandate.

This is pretty straightforward. But if you wish, you can harp on about misrepresentation, lying, or the even so often allegation of 'extremist'.
 
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