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Roger Waters promotes 9/11 conspiracy theories...

Vixen said:
Cool! I like it but it's 'straight', right..?

Try wikipedia instead:

en.wikipedia.org

UK underground - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org
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WTF are you talking about? You claimed to be "unteachable" about the history and inner workings of Pink Floyd because you once distributed flyers for their management group. You then criticized me for claiming no expertise for a job where I was far closer to the inner workings than anyone posting flyers could ever be to Pink Floyd. Now you post some wiki page about 60's counter culture in the UK to prove . . . uhhhh . . . what?
You are one strange bird, Vixen.
 
Smock said:
WTF are you talking about? You claimed to be "unteachable" about the history and inner workings of Pink Floyd because you once distributed flyers for their management group. You then criticized me for claiming no expertise for a job where I was far closer to the inner workings than anyone posting flyers could ever be to Pink Floyd. Now you post some wiki page about 60's counter culture in the UK to prove . . . uhhhh . . . what?
You are one strange bird, Vixen.
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Standard reaction to Vixen posts.
 
Allen773 said:
Moreover, Bin Laden talked about his anger over US support for the Israeli war in Lebanon in the 80s. He specifically mentioned seeing TV coverage of some bombed out “towers” in Beirut and how it gave him the idea to one day “hit towers in America” as retribution. Now he said this after 9/11 and so caveat of it being a convenient propaganda narrative, but I have no reason to believe that that war didn’t have an effect on him. Bin Laden had spent time in Beirut in his youth.
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I posted his fatwa a few pages back.

Yes, US support of Israel was one of bin Laden's issues. If you know him, the shelling of Lebanon by the USS New Jersey is what set him on his collision course with America. The point of this thread is Waters backing the claim that the WTC was a control demolition, and that Israel was behind it.
 
Vixen said:
Just as one needs to step back and look at discrete incidents - such as the WTC attack of 9/11 - and try to see what might have led up to it, we can do the same with Waters. Waters and his three bandmates,
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No. These things have nothing to do with each other. We know 98% of the facts behind 9-11, the remainder being US intelligence, Saudis, and the FBI. A history of Pink Floyd is irrelevant.

Vixen said:
Roger Waters might have changed with age, as it's known that people become more conservative over time and he might now be a racist ◊◊◊◊, well I guess he's become right wing, getting into bed with Tucker Carlson and supporting Putin.
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Waters has always been a human sphincter. His antisemitism is well known. His judgement has always been questionable.
 
Smock said:
WTF are you talking about? You claimed to be "unteachable" about the history and inner workings of Pink Floyd because you once distributed flyers for their management group. You then criticized me for claiming no expertise for a job where I was far closer to the inner workings than anyone posting flyers could ever be to Pink Floyd. Now you post some wiki page about 60's counter culture in the UK to prove . . . uhhhh . . . what?
You are one strange bird, Vixen.
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Roger Waters is said to be one of the most enigmatic figures in rock. I was trying to understand what makes him tick and where his values lie. People like Rod Stewart, Roger Daltrey and even Eric Clapton: you can see the transparency of their sometimes expressed right wing views (for example, on Brexit or immigrants). Waters strikes me as being a completely different kettle of fish.

It isn't to do with fame or celebrity. Your working for/with a famous racing driver misses the point. I've worked for plenty of 'names', Andrew Lloyd Webber, wine designers, and plenty of celebrities, luvvies and famous faces coming to us for bankruptcy advice when I was in Insolvency Practice.

It's to do with life-style. Waters very much went from bumming around to incredible international wealth, ranking about 8th wealthiest in rock rankings. How did Waters come to flirt with Putin..? I dunno. His anti-war background doesn't make him an obvious candidate for reactionary views, unlike the aforementioned.

Anyway, here's a really good article of the scene Waters started in. Peter Jenner was a lecturer at the London School of Economics before becoming a mover and shake in the music industry.

 
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Waters views are that the Jews are bad and do horrible things, and everyone who disagrees with him on anything is evil.

He's an entirely self absorbed dickhead. There isn't much else behind it, he forms an opinion based on nebulous or outright false information and then proceeds to defend it to the last because in his own mind Roger Waters is an absolute genius who can't be wrong about anything.

No one ever said he was entirely right wing, or even particularly consistent in his views. He strikes me entirely as someone who picks up ideas he likes the sound of from the aether and then holds onto those views for dear life because he's absolutely convinced he can never be wrong, even when his own ideas don't fully align with each other, or even make sense. The man has criticised the Israeli genocide as being an opportunistic land grab and attempt to remove an ethnic/religious/political group they do not like and then turned around and praised Vladimir Putin's invasion of Ukraine as being provoked despite the fact that it is an obvious parallel situation, albeit not a 1:1 match.

The man has no deep guiding philosophy besides his own egomania and desperate need for attention and adulation. He used to get that through his own incredible musical talent but nowadays he tries to get it by spouting off whatever vapid idea has drifted into his mind today and repeating it with an almost religious vehemence and an almost Caligula-like belief in his own infallibility.

To put it bluntly, the man is a raving lunatic.
 
Vixen said:
Roger Waters is said to be one of the most enigmatic figures in rock. I was trying to understand what makes him tick and where his values lie. People like Rod Stewart, Roger Daltrey and even Eric Clapton: you can see the transparency of their sometimes expressed right wing views (for example, on Brexit or immigrants). Waters strikes me as being a completely different kettle of fish.

It isn't to do with fame or celebrity. Your working for/with a famous racing driver misses the point. I've worked for plenty of 'names', Andrew Lloyd Webber, wine designers, and plenty of celebrities, luvvies and famous faces coming to us for bankruptcy advice when I was in Insolvency Practice.

It's to do with life-style. Waters very much went from bumming around to incredible international wealth, ranking about 8th wealthiest in rock rankings. How did Waters come to flirt with Putin..? I dunno. His anti-war background doesn't make him an obvious candidate for reactionary views, unlike the aforementioned.

Anyway, here's a really good article of the scene Waters started in. Peter Jenner was a lecturer at the London School of Economics before becoming a mover and shake in the music industry.

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ONCE AGAIN . . . What on God's great green Earth does this (which anybody with an internet connection and the ability to type "Google Roger Waters" can find) have to do with the fact you claimed to be "unteachable" about the history and inner workings of Pink Floyd just because you once tossed up some flyers? We know you think you are an expert on Pink Floyd . . . I'm asking you how in the hell you got to be an expert? From inhaling wallpaper paste? Did a staple pierce your frontal lobe and you woke up with the the combined thoughts of Gilmore and Waters running through you cortex? People want to know how a stint putting up leaflets suddenly makes you the authority on Pink Floyd, so much so that anybody else who has been listening to and researching the band for the last 40 years cannot teach you anything?
 
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MarkCorrigan said:
Waters views are that the Jews are bad and do horrible things, and everyone who disagrees with him on anything is evil.

He's an entirely self absorbed dickhead. There isn't much else behind it, he forms an opinion based on nebulous or outright false information and then proceeds to defend it to the last because in his own mind Roger Waters is an absolute genius who can't be wrong about anything.

No one ever said he was entirely right wing, or even particularly consistent in his views. He strikes me entirely as someone who picks up ideas he likes the sound of from the aether and then holds onto those views for dear life because he's absolutely convinced he can never be wrong, even when his own ideas don't fully align with each other, or even make sense. The man has criticised the Israeli genocide as being an opportunistic land grab and attempt to remove an ethnic/religious/political group they do not like and then turned around and praised Vladimir Putin's invasion of Ukraine as being provoked despite the fact that it is an obvious parallel situation, albeit not a 1:1 match.

The man has no deep guiding philosophy besides his own egomania and desperate need for attention and adulation. He used to get that through his own incredible musical talent but nowadays he tries to get it by spouting off whatever vapid idea has drifted into his mind today and repeating it with an almost religious vehemence and an almost Caligula-like belief in his own infallibility.

To put it bluntly, the man is a raving lunatic.
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Seems about right
 
MarkCorrigan said:
Waters views are that the Jews are bad and do horrible things, and everyone who disagrees with him on anything is evil.

He's an entirely self absorbed dickhead. There isn't much else behind it, he forms an opinion based on nebulous or outright false information and then proceeds to defend it to the last because in his own mind Roger Waters is an absolute genius who can't be wrong about anything.

No one ever said he was entirely right wing, or even particularly consistent in his views. He strikes me entirely as someone who picks up ideas he likes the sound of from the aether and then holds onto those views for dear life because he's absolutely convinced he can never be wrong, even when his own ideas don't fully align with each other, or even make sense. The man has criticised the Israeli genocide as being an opportunistic land grab and attempt to remove an ethnic/religious/political group they do not like and then turned around and praised Vladimir Putin's invasion of Ukraine as being provoked despite the fact that it is an obvious parallel situation, albeit not a 1:1 match.

The man has no deep guiding philosophy besides his own egomania and desperate need for attention and adulation. He used to get that through his own incredible musical talent but nowadays he tries to get it by spouting off whatever vapid idea has drifted into his mind today and repeating it with an almost religious vehemence and an almost Caligula-like belief in his own infallibility.

To put it bluntly, the man is a raving lunatic.
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I got the impression, and it’s just an impression mind, that he blames the Jews for provoking the nazis. (Possibly by not getting out of their way before the nazis took over, although that part is a bit vague).
Once the nazis were provoked, this caused the British government to declare war on them. Which, in turn, caused his father to be placed in Italy, where the high command caused his father to be killed by the Nazis.

This is twisted and certainly not consistent, but it’s the only way I can make sense of Roger Waters.

Which is a shame as he certainly was musically a genius. Too bad he never truly grew up.
 
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erwinl said:
I got the impression, and it’s just an impression mind, that he blames the Jews for provoking the nazis. (Possibly by not getting out of their way before the nazis took over, although that part is a bit vague).
Once the nazis were provoked, this caused the British government to declare war on them. Which, in turn, caused his father to be placed in Italy, where the high command caused his father to be killed by the Nazis.

This is twisted and certainly not consistent, but it’s the only way I can make sense of Roger Waters.

Which is a shame as he certainly was musically a genius. Too bad he never truly grew up.
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Pretty much. I can understand his being angry at British military high command for his father being killed. Goodness knows there were some serious screwups in the Italy campaign, it could well be that his father died due to some moronic officer or other.

That being said he certainly believes that some people provoked the Nazis, and the Jews ARE a group he hates vehemently...
 
Smock said:
ONCE AGAIN . . . What on God's great green Earth does this (which anybody with an internet connection and the ability to type "Google Roger Waters" can find) have to do with the fact you claimed to be "unteachable" about the history and inner workings of Pink Floyd just because you once tossed up some flyers? We know you think you are an expert on Pink Floyd . . . I'm asking you how in the hell you got to be an expert? From inhaling wallpaper paste? Did a staple pierce your frontal lobe and you woke up with the the combined thoughts of Gilmore and Waters running through you cortex? People want to know how a stint putting up leaflets suddenly makes you the authority on Pink Floyd, so much so that anybody else who has been listening to and researching the band for the last 40 years cannot teach you anything?
Click to expand...

Hopefully, my interpreter will be along shortly.
 
erwinl said:
I got the impression, and it’s just an impression mind, that he blames the Jews for provoking the nazis. (Possibly by not getting out of their way before the nazis took over, although that part is a bit vague).
Once the nazis were provoked, this caused the British government to declare war on them. Which, in turn, caused his father to be placed in Italy, where the high command caused his father to be killed by the Nazis.

This is twisted and certainly not consistent, but it’s the only way I can make sense of Roger Waters.

Which is a shame as he certainly was musically a genius. Too bad he never truly grew up.
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Is there a citation? I would really like to understand this.
 
Vixen said:
Hopefully, my interpreter will be along shortly.
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Another hamfisted dodge noted. So I'll say it for you . . . claiming an "unteachable" level of expertise was achieved by the mere act of tossing up flyers is one of the dumbest things you've ever said. And you've said some pretty freaking dumb things.
 
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