Split Thread Heart transplant not for muslins

RecoveringYuppy said:
Yep. He has some other conditions that make him too unhealthy to warrant the less experimental human heart.
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And a necessary condition to be a candidate for such experimental surgery.

Maybe we could conduct these kinds of experiments on death row prisoners? Asking the big philosophical questions here.
 
Sideroxylon said:
And a necessary condition to be a candidate for such experimental surgery.

Maybe we could conduct these kinds of experiments on death row prisoners? Asking the big philosophical questions here.
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While reading about this event I came across sources that mentioned that a xenotransplant of a kidney in to a brain dead person happened just a few months ago.

BTW I've also come across multiple statements that this guy has a history of not complying with doctor advice and that was a factor in ruling him out of for a human heart.
 
In the US, criminals aren't discriminated against when it comes to organ transplants or medical care in general (at least in theory). The safer option in my opinion.
 
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RecoveringYuppy said:
While reading about this event I came across sources that mentioned that a xenotransplant of a kidney in to a brain dead person happened just a few months ago.

BTW I've also come across multiple statements that this guy has a history of not complying with doctor advice and that was a factor in ruling him out of for a human heart.
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Your last is a more standard triage question.
 
RecoveringYuppy said:
BTW I've also come across multiple statements that this guy has a history of not complying with doctor advice and that was a factor in ruling him out of for a human heart.
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Despite having a heart condition, he continued to eat a lot of bacon.
 
Sideroxylon said:
Good point. Doctors should run a morality profile first. Start by putting anyone with a criminal record at the back of the queue.
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Not quite, but I think a simple check of what crimes they've committed might be in order. I think there's a line that says you let the worst crooks die rather than being given surgery that I'm presuming he didn't have to pay for. I'm sure, out of the 330 million Americans there was someone more deserving.

I doubt many people would support Ian Watkins being given life-saving surgery.
 
Well, this guy had presumably paid his debt although whether he paid properly seems a reasonable question. But those other more deserving people are holding out for the option that's got a track record and isn't a first of a kind experiment. Those deserving people aren't being used as guinea pigs.
 
RecoveringYuppy said:
Well, this guy had presumably paid his debt although whether he paid properly seems a reasonable question. But those other more deserving people are holding out for the option that's got a track record and isn't a first of a kind experiment. Those deserving people aren't being used as guinea pigs.
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Even if he didn't pay his debt, is tat the business of the doctor?
 
RecoveringYuppy said:
Yep. He has some other conditions that make him too unhealthy to warrant the less experimental human heart.
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What really? He has a bucket of other stuff happening? I had only heard of one. Bad enough, I know. Nobody wants to be sitting in hospital with complications. Been there not a happy place. But if one has more than one complication, it becomes unhappier very fast.
 
RecoveringYuppy said:
Well, this guy had presumably paid his debt although whether he paid properly seems a reasonable question. But those other more deserving people are holding out for the option that's got a track record and isn't a first of a kind experiment. Those deserving people aren't being used as guinea pigs.
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This line of discussion seems more appropriate to the science thread than the anti Muslim bigotry thread.
 
The Atheist said:
I'm sure, out of the 330 million Americans there was someone more deserving richer.
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ftfy.

This wasn't about saving the life of someone who might not have 'deserved' it, it was a rare opportunity to do an experimental procedure that could save countless rich deserving lives if it works.

And it will benefit more than just the recipients. The pig breeders, heart surgeons, hospitals etc., all stand to make a lot of money out of it. No matter how little this guy might have 'deserved' it, he is providing a valuable boost to the medical industry and all the people who will get richer benefit from it. So it's not about him as a person, but a resource that shouldn't be squandered.

I doubt many people would support I doubt many people would support Ian Watkins being given life-saving surgery.
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Imagine you need a new heart and this pig thing might work, but it might kill you if they don't get it right. Would you agree with them trying it on Ian Watkins first so they can learn from their mistakes? Again it's not about him - you don't turn down a chance to do good just because someone who doesn't 'deserve' it might peripherally benefit. Or would you?
 
Yes. Let's start removing life-saving health care from criminals. That will surely help rehabilitation... Just like the death penalty has really cut down on murders... :rolleyes:

"Do you deserve this" shouldn't be a question asked in regards to health care. If a person has served their sentence that is their debt to society paid.
 
erlando said:
Yes. Let's start removing life-saving health care from criminals.
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Or, in the real world, let's not conduct potentially life-saving experimental surgey worth millions of dollars for free on despicable crooks.

erlando said:
"Do you deserve this" shouldn't be a question asked in regards to health care.
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At a time when unvaccinated morons are sucking up vast amounts of care, I disagree entirely.

erlando said:
If a person has served their sentence that is their debt to society paid.
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Utter bollocks, and if you thought about it for a billisecond, you'd know it's bollocks.

Criminal records stop people from getting jobs, credit and travelling, just for starters.
 
Thor 2 said:
The Atheist said:
I'm a bad person to take to parks in West Auckland in the heat of summer, because I'll go up to women and tell them they don't need to wear a burka and are only doing so because their goat-******* husband has them under his control.
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arthwollipot said:
Have you ever actually asked someone why they're wearing it? What was their reply?
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I think it is easy to see this too simply. To those on the outside many make the mistake of failing to understand the difficulty women face when they have an abusive husband. "Why doesn't she just leave him?" is the plaintive cry...... It's not the easy.

The husband in a religious community may be even harder to cross. The community she lives in may be vastly different from the wider community surrounding them. The bonding within may be difficult to overcome.
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Indeed. There are people in the world who view religious authority as valid, but I think if you actually ask someone why she's wearing a burkha, or a hijab as is way more common in our countries, you might get some surprising answers. One of which, of course, might be "because I want to", and that's perfectly valid in my opinion.

But I'm assuming at this point that the answer to my question is "no".

This might be interesting:
Why some Muslim women feel empowered wearing hijab, a headscarf
 
I don't buy a bar of it.

Stockholm Syndrome done to perfection.

Or, as the most famous muslin in history* once said "Nothing pleases whitey more than slaves cheering for slavery."

*Muhammad Ali
 
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