Cont: Brexit: Now What? 9 Below Zero

[a_unique_person]

It's on. December. Get your Macs and Wellies on and head out to vote.

 

[Squeegee Beckenheim]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1189129826357129216

Breaking: i am told shadow cabinet WILL back early election in december

This could be a disaster.

 

[Nessie]

Yeah, I don't blame Scotland at all. If I were Scotland I'd definitely be looking for a second referendum on independence from the UK. The first referendum was predicated on the UK staying in the EU. If that changes, so do the circumstances of Scottish independence.

That's yet another reason why I'm against Brexit. Without Scotland's left-leaning votes, the Tories will have control of the UK in perpetuity. It'd be very, very difficult to prevent them from getting a majority, let alone any other party getting one.

I have switched to voting SNP because of brexit. Scotland's role as an EU member was a huge part of the way people voted. I am sure the overall result would have been for independence if at the time people knew that would mean staying in the EU.

Scotland will never have a Tory government, we will be middle to left parties dominating. Brexit has fully revealed how much further to the right England is compared to Scotland.

 

[The Don]

Oh dear

I fear that the opposition parties have completely misread the situation. The Conservatives will gain a healthy majority and will take us out of the EU and will sell the NHS piece by piece to the US, jettison all kinds of employment and environmental protections, reduce economic and social mobility and ensure that the 1% or 0.1% continue to enrich themselves.

 

[McHrozni]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1189129826357129216

This could be a disaster.

Brexit is distilled disaster anyway. One more drop can't hurt.

Probably.

No matter what happens with the election, at least we can be certain the result will bring either ratification of the deal and an orderly Brexit; a second referendum; or at least a no-deal Brexit.

Also probably.

McHrozni

 

[Squeegee Beckenheim]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1189136234557382656

Labour will push for EU citizens to get vote and reduction of voting age to 16

 

[Archie Gemmill Goal]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1189136234557382656

Don't think it's possible to do the under 16s in time for a Dec election. Think EU nationals could be possible.

 

[The Don]

Labour will push for EU citizens to get vote and reduction of voting age to 16

They may push for it, the question is whether they'll get it - I'd say no.

 

[Squeegee Beckenheim]

Brexit is distilled disaster anyway. One more drop can't hurt.

This will almost certainly lead to a Tory majority. So not only will we have the harshest of harsh Brexits, but we'll have 5 years of the Tories taking away people's rights, selling off the NHS, and siphoning money from the poor to the rich.

And what's worse is it's not improbable that Scotland will leave during those 5 years, and then we'll have the Tories ******* us over for the rest of our lives.

Also, depending on exactly when the election is scheduled, it may be down to the Tories to pick the next Speaker.

There are basically two ways to prevent a Tory majority in this election - everybody voting tactically, rather than for their party of choice (which isn't going to happen), or Corbyn stepping down as leader and a much better leader who can capture the public imagination taking his place (which is really not going to happen).

 

[Ian Osborne]

I fear that the opposition parties have completely misread the situation. The Conservatives will gain a healthy majority and will take us out of the EU and will sell the NHS piece by piece to the US, jettison all kinds of employment and environmental protections, reduce economic and social mobility and ensure that the 1% or 0.1% continue to enrich themselves.

I think you're right, but then, we all thought that when May called an election. Last time around, I voted Lib-Dem to keep the tory out. It failed, and the Labour candidate ( a really nice bloke) beat the Lib-Dem. I've not much of a clue which way to vote this time around.

 

[Squeegee Beckenheim]

They may push for it, the question is whether they'll get it - I'd say no.

There's the hint of a suggestion that this is a tactic. Amend those to the bill so it'll be unacceptable to Johnson, so he'll pull it.

I wouldn't hold my breath, though.

 

[Archie Gemmill Goal]

Darat is suggesting that the SNP would support the Conservatives' request for a general election if the Conservatives would in turn allow the SNP a second independence referendum.

If true, that sounds like a sensible approach to me. The SNP is a nationalist party and Brexit represents a great opportunity for a successful independence vote, especially if the Scots can obtain a commitment from the EU for expedited EU membership post-Brexit.

There may be a significant number of people who may not be ardent nationalists but who would accept independence as an acceptable price for continued EU membership and this, combined with the increasingly offhand way in which the government is treating non-English parts of the UK, IMO makes a successful independence vote likely.

It was the 'pity they can't think about anyone but themselves' and the 'kingmakers' part I didn't get. They have been the only party putting forward solutions and Labstain have been sitting on their hands when asked to do anything useful.

As for kingmakers, the SNP aren't the ones who have been colluding with the Tories, voting for their bills, or accepting their ex-MPs into the party. Unlike Labour and Lib Dem.

 

[McHrozni]

This will almost certainly lead to a Tory majority. So not only will we have the harshest of harsh Brexits, but we'll have 5 years of the Tories taking away people's rights, selling off the NHS, and siphoning money from the poor to the rich.

Also probably.

At least then the disaster will be on Tory hands though. Corbyn will be resigned to the dustbin of history, which is better than what he deserves and maybe, just maybe, UK will be beginning to look normal.

Again, probably.

Then again, Labour would not have supported a new GE if they didn't think (or equivalent) they could win, or at least not lose. How they intend to accomplish that feat I don't know. An alliance with LibDems in exchange for a second referendum, maybe. Their combined poll numbers outstrip the Tories, if they don't strike a deal with Brexit party it might work.

Electoral calculus predicts a Tory majority of 32 (from minimum) or 58 (from second largest party). This result is a disaster for Labour any if Corbyn had any integrity whatsoever he'd be comitting a seppuku right now.

https://www.electoralcalculus.co.uk/homepage.html

McHrozni

 

[catsmate]

Boris has taken his passion for wasting money and turned it into performance art.

Oooo, how about someone buying them up and turning them into a suitable sculpture?

 

[The Don]

Also probably.

At least then the disaster will be on Tory hands though. Corbyn will be resigned to the dustbin of history, which is better than what he deserves and maybe, just maybe, UK will be beginning to look normal.

I wish I shared your optimism. I fear that the changes that the Conservatives will make will be irrevocable, especially if Scotland achieves independence.

Again, probably.

Then again, Labour would not have supported a new GE if they didn't think (or equivalent) they could win, or at least not lose. How they intend to accomplish that feat I don't know. An alliance with LibDems in exchange for a second referendum, maybe.

McHrozni

Jeremy Corbyn, his inner circle, Momentum and the unions have been drinking their own Kool Aid. IMO they are deluded and are going to lose, very badly.

 

[The Don]

As usual, Jeremy Corbyn fails to understand:

Mr Corbyn told his shadow cabinet: "I have consistently said that we are ready for an election and our support is subject to a no-deal Brexit being off the table.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-50221856
Except that it isn't off the table, it's still the default outcome

"We have now heard from the EU that the extension of Article 50 to 31 January has been confirmed, so for the next three months, our condition of taking no-deal off the table has now been met.

 

[Darat]

Oh dear

I fear that the opposition parties have completely misread the situation. The Conservatives will gain a healthy majority and will take us out of the EU and will sell the NHS piece by piece to the US, jettison all kinds of employment and environmental protections, reduce economic and social mobility and ensure that the 1% or 0.1% continue to enrich themselves.

Agreed.

 

[catsmate]

Oh dear

I fear that the opposition parties have completely misread the situation. The Conservatives will gain a healthy majority and will take us out of the EU and will sell the NHS piece by piece to the US, jettison all kinds of employment and environmental protections, reduce economic and social mobility and ensure that the 1% or 0.1% continue to enrich themselves.

Yeah, a poor choice, a nasty winter with the NHS crumbling and the elderly dying in droves from the new 'flu strain would have set the tone nicely.

 

[catsmate]

SNP obviously want to be kingmakers so they get their 2nd referendum. Pity they can't think about anyone but themselves.

Meh, why should they? No-one else is thinking about Scotland.

 

[Squeegee Beckenheim]

At least then the disaster will be on Tory hands though.

I honestly don't give a **** who we can point fingers at. The country going down the plughole doesn't become better just because we can say it's Boris Johnson's fault.

Then again, Labour would not have supported a new GE if they didn't think (or equivalent) they could win, or at least not lose.

I'm sure Corbyn does think he can win. But he's wrong. The Conservatives are way ahead on the polls.

This is the latest polling information from YouGov, one week ago. The Conservatives have 26% of people saying they'd vote for them, while the next closest is Labour with 16. That's not close at all.

What's more, as to the question as to who would make the best PM, Johnson has 43% of the vote, and Corbyn has 20%

And it's not like Corbyn can siphon off the anti-Brexit vote from the Tories, because the official stance of the Labour party is (or is commonly perceived to be) pro-Brexit. Corbyn himself is pro-Brexit. So they can't even run as an anti-Brexit party.

An alliance with LibDems in exchange for a second referendum, maybe.

Nope, they've both categorically ruled that out.

Electoral calculus predicts a Tory majority of 32 (from minimum) or 58 (from second largest party). This result is a disaster for Labour any if Corbyn had any integrity whatsoever he'd be comitting a seppuku right now.

Yes, he should. But he won't.

As I say, it's a disaster waiting to happen.