catsmate
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And when the EU continues to laugh at Britain's deluded pretentiousness?
Cont: Brexit: Now What? Magic 8 Ball's up
- Thread starter Dave Rogers
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catsmate
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Hence the utter lack of sympathy for Britain and it's decision to commit economic suicide.
The Atheist
The Grammar Tyrant
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That's beautiful.
Sean lock made a very good point a while back when he said that people over 65 shouldn't get a vote, because it's not actually their future. Their future is in a box.
The bottom line? (With the meat in bold)...
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The prime minister’s senior adviser, Dominic Cummings, instructed special advisers across the government to keep on top of preparations for a no deal Brexit early on Monday morning and attacked Philip Hammond, the former chancellor, for failing to get the country ready.
Over the weekend, it became clear he believes that Johnson could simply refuse to resign in the event of losing a no-confidence motion and schedule an general election for November – after leaving the EU at the end of October.
Johnson said on Monday that an election was the “last thing” he wanted. But his official spokesman stressed at his regular briefing for journalists that Brexit would take place on 31 October “whatever the circumstances”, even if parliament has voted against a no-deal departure or passed a confidence motion against the prime minister necessitating an election.
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Once again, we're looking at the default position. If Johnson simply obstructs to the maximum extent then we crash out. There is no parliamentary procedure that can stop that, as far as I can see.
I don't know quite what's in it for him to take such a path, as it would seem to consign him to political oblivion.
p.s. Cummings is, apparently, wielding a lot of power in Downing St. and is also [expletives deleted]
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The prime minister’s senior adviser, Dominic Cummings, instructed special advisers across the government to keep on top of preparations for a no deal Brexit early on Monday morning and attacked Philip Hammond, the former chancellor, for failing to get the country ready.
Over the weekend, it became clear he believes that Johnson could simply refuse to resign in the event of losing a no-confidence motion and schedule an general election for November – after leaving the EU at the end of October.
Johnson said on Monday that an election was the “last thing” he wanted. But his official spokesman stressed at his regular briefing for journalists that Brexit would take place on 31 October “whatever the circumstances”, even if parliament has voted against a no-deal departure or passed a confidence motion against the prime minister necessitating an election.
----
Once again, we're looking at the default position. If Johnson simply obstructs to the maximum extent then we crash out. There is no parliamentary procedure that can stop that, as far as I can see.
I don't know quite what's in it for him to take such a path, as it would seem to consign him to political oblivion.
p.s. Cummings is, apparently, wielding a lot of power in Downing St. and is also [expletives deleted]
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The Atheist
The Grammar Tyrant
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Any Pom who doesn't have a contingency plan for a near breakdown of the entire United Kingdom on 1 November is mad.
I can see lots of problems arising very quickly, not least of which will be the supply chain, which will screw up monumentally and it'll be like Venezuela a couple of years ago when they ran out of bog paper.
Stockpile essentials. Heck, I'd be buying enough of some goods to be able to sell them.
I think the "what if" scenarios are all done and dusted.
catsmate
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The Poms in this house are quietly drawing up plans for returning to the UK.
If it comes to it we'll deal with UK madness when we get there
Vixen
Penultimate Amazing
No, no, no. That picture of Davis at the EU negotiation with, er, nothing in front of him, whilst the EU guys - especially Barnier - had piles of paperwork in front of them, was just a dastardly plot by Johnny Foreigner to make him look stupid and unprepared.
Davis got revenge on Barnier when he visited the UK. French bastard.
Vixen
Penultimate Amazing
FIFY
Vixen
Penultimate Amazing
Vixen
Penultimate Amazing
Vixen
Penultimate Amazing
The Poms in this house are quietly drawing up plans for returning to the UK.
If it comes to it we'll deal with UK madness when we get there
One here is quietly drawing up plans to leave the UK.
The Atheist
The Grammar Tyrant
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You should see some of the corporate contingency plans. Sweet jeebus...
I have. It's nice to see Brexiters involved in so many of them. Heartwarming.
The Poms in this house are quietly drawing up plans for returning to the UK.
If it comes to it we'll deal with UK madness when we get there
Sheesh, you'll have plenty of room on the plane - every Pom I know is trying to figure how to get out.
PLENTY OF JOBS IN NZ, PEOPLE!!
Matt Hancock is now saying that Parliament is powerless to stop a no-deal Brexit (in direct contradiction of what he said when he was running for Conservative leader)
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-49234603
He seems to be saying two different things. Parliament still has the power to stop a no-deal Brexit that's a given, but it is his opinion this group of MPs is unable to come to an agreement that would be needed to stop the no-deal Brexit.
From the article:
During his bid for the Tory leadership, Matt Hancock said no deal was "not an available choice" to the next PM, as MPs "will never allow it to happen".
He told the BBC he had now changed his mind because they had a chance to block it in a series of votes last month, but failed to muster the numbers.
Can BJ do that? Ignoring a vote of no confidence by Parliament seems like something out of 1640s.
McHrozni
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He doesn't have to ignore a vote of no confidence. Leaving the EU on 31st October is the law, and a vote of no confidence doesn't change the law. The law allows the Prime Minister to request an extension, but there is no law that says a vote of no confidence forces the Prime Minister to do that.
There are various conventions about the timing of general elections following a vote of no confidence, but if the usual polling day of Thursday is to be retained, then the earliest possible vote of no confidence results in an earliest general election AFTER October 31st.
Then there is the convention that an outgoing government doesn't do anything significant during the general election campaign - but you can argue that both ways: certainly leaving the EU after a vote of no confidence intended to stop that would be significant; but it would also be significant to ignore the law passed by parliament requiring us to leave on 31st.
There are various conventions about the timing of general elections following a vote of no confidence, but if the usual polling day of Thursday is to be retained, then the earliest possible vote of no confidence results in an earliest general election AFTER October 31st.
Then there is the convention that an outgoing government doesn't do anything significant during the general election campaign - but you can argue that both ways: certainly leaving the EU after a vote of no confidence intended to stop that would be significant; but it would also be significant to ignore the law passed by parliament requiring us to leave on 31st.
In this context "ignoring" means not resigning as Prime Minister.
The Fixed Term Parliament Act changed the rules. Previously losing a vote of no confidence meant an immediate election. Now the Government has 14 days for another vote of confidence before an election. If Boris Johnson doesn't resign as Prime Minister at the first vote of no confidence then he still has control of the government (but possibly not Parliament) and can ensure any election is past 31st October, and that no extension to the timetable happens.
Getting a new Prime Minister would probably involve the Queen intervening, which seems very very unlikely.
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I'm reasonably certain Parliament would vote to ask (beg) for an extension if it was facing a general election shortly after Brexit day.
Unless the election was held immediately after Brexit day there is no guarantee it could be held at all, with voter panic and all.
McHrozni
It depends on when the vote is held. If it's held in late October then sure, that is a viable possibility that would require Parliament to act in other ways to prevent it. If it's in September or early October a new election would be called well before Brexit day.
With election looming, Parliament will probably force the PM to beg for an extension. Probably. Tories would likely vote against, since holding a vote just after a no-deal Brexit eliminates Farage as a competitor and there's really no way they can lose. Either they win power or someone else has to solve the feces they created. Both are sort of a win. But their working majority is near nil so it's likely Parliament will still opt for an extension, ruining the Tories.
McHrozni
No
As I understand it there are 3 things which drive the timetable:
- votes of no confidence and the 2 weeks required between them
- "wash-up" session to clear Parliamentary business probably 1 -2 weeks
- election campaign IIRC minimum of 5 weeks
If Boris Johnson is still Prime Minister he controls the timetable, and an election before 31st October is difficult. If he was trolling then call it for the 31st; polls close 10pm, leave EU 11pm.
Parliament does not get to ask for an extension; it has to be the Government, which is why who is Prime Minister is so critical. It is far easier for Parliament to stop the Government doing things than to force them to do something specific - that would normally involve changing the Prime Minister.
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