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Michael Shermer vs. "alternative history" Hancock and Crandall

Captain_Swoop said:
You have hit on the main objection to your civilization theory.
You claim that any evidence other than the stones has been washed away.
That relies on the civilization only occupying coastal plains where there could be a big enough flood or rise in level to wash everything away.

I live in a village only a mile from the cliffs on the North Yorkshire coast but I am at an elevation of over five hundred feet. It would be a hell of a flood needed to wash away any evidence of my village.
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May I humbly suggest you use Google Earth, and check out the coastlines... I've posted several images from finds I've made.

Maybe early earth was much less habitated?
 
Reality Check said:
Ignorance and a display of deep ignorance about the Earth or maybe even English :p!.
This is Göbekli Tepe which has no evidence of any advanced agricultural civilization.
Göbekli Tepe is in Turkey, not China which is the subject of the irrelevant 2009 article World's Oldest Pottery?

Pre-Pottery Neolithic (PPN) is obvious in Göbekli Tepe.

Can you understand that Göbekli Tepe is in Turkey and has no evidence of any agriculture contrary to your claim of an "advanced agricultural civilization"?
Alternately:
9 November 2017: Present your evidence of an "advanced agricultural civilization" at Göbekli Tepe
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I understand that the oldest GT site was abandoned by its makers, and covered up by its finders. I've read that they found no tools, writings, or pottery and that the place looks to have been preserved, then mimicked- poorly, in later building.

I am arguing it is incorrect to stipulate that you know something, without evidence of it. Since GT lacks any evidence, all that we can say is, we don't know yet.

It's the difference between saying, "We don't have evidence they did this, but they could have so we are still considering the possibility." & "Since we have found no evidence, we are declaring they didn't."

GT has not been fully excavated. When it has, then we'll draw conclusions.

"Beer"...is my argument for a settled, advanced, agrarian society. Fermenting does not do well "on the road." It needs to be stable, temperature controlled, if it is wine, racked, and left to settle-out for an initial 21 days, then another 30 or more. Hunting and gathering for beer and wine stuffs for a large community ...??? Nope, not buying it. Someone was cultivating.
 
Reality Check said:
That make us the only advanced civilization (think about this forum!) that has ever existed :p!
Followed by "Microspherials..." nonsense maybe about the disputed claim of a Younger Dryas impact hypothesis about a comet impact. FYI a asteroid is not a comet!

9 November 2017: Present your evidence of a "globally connected" civilization about 12,900 BP (start of the Younger Dryas).
E.g. American Indian artifacts being found in European sites of that date or vice versa. Ditto for Asian artifacts & Europe. What about South America artefacts & Africa?
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Did I say "comet"...?

The evidence you seek is in the video of this thread's OP.
 
Hans said:
Full bloom

One of the great aspect of 'Lost civilization mania' is that they imagine that this global entity came about fully formed - it didn't come from anywhere. Just

POP

.....and it was there. Our own civilization (in the real world) took about 5,000 years to mature to us, plus tens of thousands of preparatory years.

So where did this LGC come from? - and strangely enough it left no evidence of its early existence either.............how fun!
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Look into the lost book of Enki.
 
Reality Check said:
Which was an ignorant act. Pyramids were built by many different civilizations at many different times. The reason is simple - people are not stupid! It was impractical or impossible to build stable walls that were vertical to heights of 30 or more meters thus no cubical tall buildings in ancient times. So they stepped the walls, then smoothed the steps and we get the classical Egyptian pyramids.

For example
  • "The Mesopotamians built the earliest pyramidal structures, called ziggurats" about 4000 BC.
  • Egyptians from 2700 BC until around 1700 BC
  • Aztecs in the 14th, 15th and 16th centuries.
  • French in 1989 (Louvre Pyramid) :D
9 November 2017: Present your evidence of a single civilization building pyramids globally about 12,900 BP (start of the Younger Dryas).
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"No, I am not your monkey."

&

Your list of pyramid structures is too tiny. They were everywhere in the ancient world.
 
Hans said:
Oh really lets see if it works again:

KOTA I refuse to accept your total lack of evidence as evidence.

Thanks to SOdhner for wasting his time to look up kota bogus info.
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I refuse to accept your lack of evidence as evidence in return.

Objection: Speculation
 
Reality Check said:
Our 9,000-Year Love Affair With Booze
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Do you know how much malted grain it takes to use 40 gallon primary fermenters??

I made wine, but I have friends who make beer...0.25kg malt/grain per liter, relatively speaking. You can go up or down, depending on how efficient your yeast is. But that's A LOT...they had it in excess to use it to produce beer and bread.
 
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John Jones said:
Ha! After that, I'll ask Nancy Lieder and her imaginary Zeta friends. This is too much!:D
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ALL religions say we are children of star gods.

How else do you explain that every race came out of the same indus valley, through punctuated equilibrium or drastic changes to the human condition, beginning about 40,000 years ago.

The first male gene found and mapped spread out from the middle east up into Eurasia, and down into parts of Africa. This single lone ancestor was more active than Ghangis Khan...or we were cloned, and the first "Adam" was actually many individuals with the same genes...who really knows, this was millennia ago...

---

I know evolution is real, and has influenced what and who we are today, but it is not the only betterment-driver humans have been subjected to.
 
Matthew Ellard said:
That would be the general consensus.

How do you explain that the language spoken on Easter Island is Polynesian and all the artifacts are Polynesian?

When do you think the Polynesians migrated to the various Polynesian Islands?
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Read Guns, Germs, and Steel for a good breakdown of the Polynesian Island migration.

They were populated by a single sea faring nation, but there was a collapse, then each of the islands began its own individual evolution, with its own geographical conditions setting the stage for its development. While they all contained a similar underlined initial beginning, each turned into the thing it would be due to the environment around them.

I believe Easter Island has probably been found and settled multiple times, both before and after the great flood.
 
King of the Americas said:
ALL religions say we are children of star gods.

How else do you explain that every race came out of the same indus valley, through punctuated equilibrium or drastic changes to the human condition, beginning about 40,000 years ago.

The first male gene found and mapped spread out from the middle east up into Eurasia, and down into parts of Africa. This single lone ancestor was more active than Ghangis Khan...or we were cloned, and the first "Adam" was actually many individuals with the same genes...who really knows, this was millennia ago...

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[...]
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Is there any woo you don't swallow whole?
 
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