International Men's Day is apparently controversial

[Lothian]

All 'Days' are bollocks.

Why does no-one think of the children

 

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Back in 1991 I saw a post that stated "If men got breast cancer there would be a cure by now." I stopped donating ***** at that point.

 

[commandlinegamer]

Yes. Well-known issue. Pads and tampons cost money. People with no money, e.g. living on welfare or assistance, cannot put their menstrual treatments on food stamps ('cuz they're not food) and cannot put them on their Medicaid because they're not covered.

Furthermore, women during their period are classed as dirty, impure in some societies. Fortunately, some people are trying to change things:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-26260978

 

[John Nowak]

Male societal problems are inisignificsnt in comparison to female ones.

The societal problems of women in Western societies are insignificant in comparison to the problems of women in the third world.

Funny how that works, isn't it?

"It's not about ME ME ME! Therefore misogyny."

 

[pharphis]

Who is "we" and what is "this part of the world" You're addressing someone who spent years in Turkey. I'm in Thailand. Wolfman and Roborrama are in China. Do we have to put on our original roots thinking caps, or are we allowed to think about the 70% of the earth's population that does not enjoy the progress of the last century towards equality?

I don't want to go all Dear Muslima on you but the concerns of a bunch of western middle class petulant children (feminists or MRAs) pale in comparison to worrying about your neighbors and countrymen selling off their not-yet-teenaged daughters to people traffickers.

so you are going all Dear Muslima on him?

I mean, that's what this entire thread has boiled down to: ignoring the context of the open letter (university of york) because somewhere bigger problems exist for women.

Why is spending SOME amount of time on a group of people equivalent to ignoring 70% of the world's population? Hell, we might as well not care about any genocides then since it's just a tiny fraction of the world.

 

[pharphis]

ITT: People are saying men's issues are pretty irrelevant in developed democracies because 1) "reasons", 2) it's not representative of the global population while simultaneously referring to problems women face in these same places as the "real problems"

The doublethink is real

 

[wobs]

Haven't seen a post about this, so here goes:

A bunch of students, faculty and alumni at the University of York sent an open letter to complain about the university marking International Men's Day. I can't do it justice so you might as well read it yourself.


Here is the university's response where they back down and apologize for being so thoughtless (read: misogynistic) as to acknowledge that men have issues, too.

I liked the part of the first article that refers to the day as a "controversial international day". Can't say I'm surprised.
Absolutely insane. My thoughts at present mirror this video by Vernaculis pretty well (where I first heard about it):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VEW9Jajqty4

Here is the original letter in support of IMD:
https://web.archive.org/web/2015111...nts/news/2015/events/mensday-gender-equality/
Which includes:

“In academic staff appointments, the data suggests that female candidates have a higher chance of being appointed than men. In the professional support services, there are areas where men are significantly under-represented. Likewise in academic departments, the support staff complement is often heavily weighted towards women, with some departments employing no men at all in these roles.

“The reasons for these circumstances are complex and the solutions will not be found overnight, but we are resolved to address these issues systematically and fairly, in the same way that we approach unfairness and discrimination faced by women.”

In wider society, men are confronted by other challenges which are significant from an equality perspective. Boys underperform at school compared to girls. Men are 20 times more likely than women to go to prison; they are much more likely to be victims of violent crime, are more likely to commit suicide and have a lower life expectancy than women. Men are also less likely to access mental health services and other forms of support when they need them.

Men currently have to wait longer than women before they receive a State pension and at certain stages in life, they are less well protected by equality legislation than women. These issues inevitably impact on men employed at the University and on the lives of our students.

I have yet to find anything in there that is dishonest or offensive. I fail to see why they would object other than their own misguided political BS.

Further reading here:
http://www.independent.co.uk/studen...nkly-looks-rather-silly-says-mp-a6741811.html
MPs not impressed.

 

[Information Analyst]

Haven't seen a post about this, so here goes:

A bunch of students, faculty and alumni at the University of York sent an open letter to complain about the university marking International Men's Day. I can't do it justice so you might as well read it yourself.


Here is the university's response where they back down and apologize for being so thoughtless (read: misogynistic) as to acknowledge that men have issues, too.

I liked the part of the first article that refers to the day as a "controversial international day". Can't say I'm surprised.
Absolutely insane. My thoughts at present mirror this video by Vernaculis pretty well (where I first heard about it):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VEW9Jajqty4

The central problem with radical feminism is an utter refusal to brook even the slightest acknowledge that there are some areas in which men are clearly and significantly worse off than women.

 

[pharphis]

That's an interesting (and probably unquantifiable) claim but ultimately it's irrelevant. How does one group suffering less make talking about their suffering controversial?
edit: or do you think males suffer so little that the tiny bit they do suffer is irrelevant?

Out of curiosity, I am wondering how you've come to the conclusion that TODAY men are in a better position than women overall.

Still waiting for an answer to this

 

[Meadmaker]

Well, you don't actually have to be an oppressed minority to get a day. Trees, St James, President Lincoln, and Pi all have days. It's not like there's an official Calendar Keeper who gets to decide who deserves days or not. It's just various people deciding to say "such and such is a day for so-and-so". That Waffles have a day doesn't take away from Pearl Harbor Day, unless of course they are the same day in which case that's a question of taste.

There you go again, dismissing the long struggle of trees for recognition by lumping them in with with inconsequential entities like Lincoln and Pi.

Oh when will the struggle end? When will trees' rights finally just be a given, and not something that must be championed? We must all declare solidarity, human and vegetation alike, and declare, "I am an arborist!"

Please report to Sensitivity Training at the first possible opportunity. Centers are being established in forests around the nation. You've heard of forests, right? It's where the TREES live! Don't be afraid. They won't hurt you.

 

[Aepervius]

We should have a day to remember men's long and ongoing struggle for suffrage and franchise.

That *some* men had advantage in the past, does not mean we should ignore the problem men have today. Neither the fact that some women issue exists means we should ignore men's issue.

That this need to be said is... strange.

 

[Information Analyst]

Male societal problems are inisignificsnt in comparison to female ones.

What, like the higher rates of male homicides and suicide? Or that prostate cancer research gets about half the funding as breast cancer research, despite causing a similar number of deaths?

 

[pharphis]

Here is the original letter in support of IMD:
https://web.archive.org/web/2015111...nts/news/2015/events/mensday-gender-equality/
Which includes:

I have yet to find anything in there that is dishonest or offensive. I fail to see why they would object other than their own misguided political BS.

Thanks!

Of course, the offensive part is every time they mentioned men or "equality for everyone" which includes men.

As an aside, I don't find all of these disparities "problems" and I think that's up for debate, just like I do when feminists point out disparities and assert that any disparity is a problem. That said, some of these disparities are very different than the mainstream narrative which is "women have it bad, men have it good"

 

[pharphis]

What, like the higher rates of male homicides and suicide?

Blame the patriarchy for those. I mean, it's men (TM) who are in power and influencing culture in such a way to brainwash men into thinking that they need to kill themselves, etc. and brainwashing women into taking lower paid jobs that they enjoy more

 

[marplots]

What, like the higher rates of male homicides and suicide? Or that prostate cancer research gets about half the funding as breast cancer research, despite causing a similar number of deaths?

It's true that some men oppress other men. But oppression is what we are best at, so that's to be expected.

 

[3point14]

Back in 1991 I saw a post that stated "If men got breast cancer there would be a cure by now." I stopped donating ***** at that point.

Men do get breast cancer.

 

[Sideroxylon]

What, like the higher rates of male homicides and suicide? Or that prostate cancer research gets about half the funding as breast cancer research, despite causing a similar number of deaths?

Is it a fact and important in the context of this thread that women's societal problems are caused by men?

 

[Information Analyst]

Yes. Well-known issue. Pads and tampons cost money. People with no money, e.g. living on welfare or assistance, cannot put their menstrual treatments on food stamps ('cuz they're not food) and cannot put them on their Medicaid because they're not covered.

Toilet tissue costs money. Can that be put on food stamps? A quick Google confirms it can't because, hey... it's not food. The same apparently applies to soap and deoderant. I think collectively there's a lot of stuff there that could affect a person's ability to present themselves well at a job interview, so why single out sanitary products?

 

[Information Analyst]

Is it a fact and important in the context of this thread that women's societal problems are caused by men?

What, all of them? Do you have a list?

 

[Lothian]

Is it a fact and important in the context of this thread that women's societal problems are caused by men?

That is a bit harsh, look at all the work men have put into developing and improving irons, cookers and washing machines.