Why Wasn't Auschwitz Bombed?

[chillzero]

Get both of them in here and I will.

Actually, this is a little flippant.

I don't doubt that terrible things were done by Allied soldiers in the war - humans being what they are. However the point that was put to MaGZ and he missed completely, is that individual atrocities are not the same as war crimes commited by a nation, or ordered by generals and /or governments.

 

[Sword_Of_Truth]

I presume Sword_of_Truth meant the Western Allies. And at least a part of the Soviet soldiers' bad behavior in Germany was in retaliation for German atrocities perpetrated in the Soviet Union. That doesn't make it right, but it makes it at least somewhat understandable.

That I did. I should have been more specific.

Your post does show that smart people know what I was talking about.

 

[332nd]

You showed your intelligence with that answer.

Feel free to show me how I'm wrong.

 

[Sword_Of_Truth]

Actually, this is a little flippant.

More than a little, actually. I hold the beliefs of the person I was responding to in contempt.

I don't doubt that terrible things were done by Allied soldiers in the war - humans being what they are. However the point that was put to MaGZ and he missed completely, is that individual atrocities are not the same as war crimes commited by a nation, or ordered by generals and /or governments.

That's pretty much what I said.

 

[chillzero]

More than a little, actually. I hold the beliefs of the person I was responding to in comtempt.



That's pretty much what I said.

Fair enough. It wasn't really how it came across.

 

[littlehulkster]

Question: why would those in charge of the camps take the time to put tattoos on the prisoners if they were to be killed?

Because they wanted to get as much work as possible out of them first.

And why were those in the picture not exterminated?

Because wiping out an entire race of people is not something you can do overnight.

 

[Sword_Of_Truth]

No, MaGZ is referring mostly to the behavior of Soviet soldiers in Germany at the end of the war.

Again, you understood that I was referring to western (US, Canada, England, Australia) Allied servicemen without me having to actually say it.

For the tens of millions of innocent germans and soviet citizens caught between Stalin and Hitlers titanic egos, the world would have been a better place if they had been thrown into a cage with rusty chainsaws and the "winner" tossed into a shark tank.

Both went out of their way to breed and encourage brutality in their minions.

 

[Donal]

Question: why would those in charge of the camps take the time to put tattoos on the prisoners if they were to be killed?

To keep track of them. They wanted to make sure everyone of their undesirables were accounted for.

Also, many of them were used as lab rats. The tattoos were a way of identifying them.

There is a reason the term "German efficiency" is in our lexicon.

And why were those in the picture not exterminated?

Didn't get to them. Many of those shipped to the camps were used as workers. Couldn't cremate the able bodied ones right off the bat, now could they?

 

[BenBurch]

Wasn’t the Jews themselves who where complaining after the war why the camps were not bombed, or at least the rail lines to the camps?

It just shows there is no way to please the Jews.

I cannot say what I think of you here and remain on this board.

 

[coops]

The Allies did commit war crimes in WWII, but you knew this.

They were the victors, so they were never tried.

While I STRONGLY disagree with MaGZ on anything to do with the holocaust I think the Dresden firebombing could be considered a war crime.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bombing_of_Dresden_in_World_War_II

Again, not agreeing with MaGZ, not excusing Hitler or excusing ANY nazi war crimes.

Just pointing out a potential western allied war crime.

 

[robinson]

While veering wildly off topic, the allied war crimes are well documented, and of course they occurred.

The Canicattì slaughter, the Biscari massacre, the The Dachau massacre, the Chenogne massacre, and the inadequate feeding of the German population in occupied Germany by the Allies. All by my country. The Chinese and Russians of course were far far worse. Most people didn't care, still don't.

Tit for tat, they started it, it was justified. And of course the winners aren't going to stand trial.

How is this on topic?

 

[coops]

While veering wildly off topic, the allied war crimes are well documented, and of course they occurred.

The Canicattì slaughter, the Biscari massacre, the The Dachau massacre, the Chenogne massacre, and the inadequate feeding of the German population in occupied Germany by the Allies. All by my country. The Chinese and Russians of course were far far worse. Most people didn't care, still don't.

Tit for tat, they started it, it was justified. And of course the winners aren't going to stand trial.

How is this on topic?

Not on topic at all.

But when the original topic is an anti-semitic attempt to deny the holocaust I personally don't feel to bad about veering off onto something different.

 

[Mobyseven]

Sure they were in the work camps and had tattoos put on their arms, but they were not exterminated, were they?

Tattoo prisoners is proof there was no Holocaust.

The letter in my mother's room describing the last day and moments of one of my great uncles disagrees with your moronic statement.

 

[gtc]

Why do you consider Hitler to have been a madman or militarily incompetent?

The nazis were incompetent because their desire to rid Europe of those they disliked was greater than their desire to win the war.

 

[SpitfireIX]

While veering wildly off topic, the allied war crimes are well documented, and of course they occurred.

The Canicattì slaughter,

Italian civilians in question were looting and were fired upon after they refused to disperse. Investigated but no charges filed.

the Biscari massacre,

Perpetrators were court-martialed.

the The Dachau massacre,

All documented victims were SS camp guards; some were killed by irate inmates using improvised weapons. Indictments of US soldiers responsible quashed by Patton.

the Chenogne massacre,

There is no documentary evidence that this event even took place; the only available evidence is anecdotal. Those same anecdotes claim that this was in response to the Malmedy Massacre.

and the inadequate feeding of the German population in occupied Germany by the Allies.

This is a complete canard started by journalist and non-historian James Bacque. The inadequate feeding of the population of Europe was due to a severe food shortage caused by the war. See here for Stephen Ambrose's criticism of Bacque's claims.

<snip>

Tit for tat, they started it, it was justified. And of course the winners aren't going to stand trial.

See above.

 

[Minadin]

Why does it always seem that the ones who engage in Holocaust denial are the very ones who wouldn't be appalled by it?

 

[gtc]

I have known several people who simulataneously believe that the Jews weren't killed and they had it coming.

 

[robinson]

That is just messed up.

 

[Corsair 115]

So they did bomb the rail lines? Bridges, switching, engines and such?

During the latter part of the war the Transportation Plan called for the systematic destruction of all infrastructure related to transportation. That meant attacking trains, railyards, bridges, and road and water traffic.

The Transportation Plan contributed greatly to the collapse of the German war economy as the Reich became incapable of moving goods, supplies, and military assets from one location to another.

The war could have gone either way.

Not after Stalingrad. The writing was on the wall after that. One could even argue the writing was on the wall before that.

Stalingrad, for openers. Also Norway, the Me-262, Wacht am Rhein, Overlord, and numerous others.

Actually, Hitler's interference with the Me-262 didn't really make that much of a difference. The real problem for the jet was mass production of reliable engines, and that problem wasn't solved until mid-1944.

While I STRONGLY disagree with MaGZ on anything to do with the holocaust I think the Dresden firebombing could be considered a war crime.

The only reason Dresden became infamous was because of the freak occurrence of a firestorm which caused an unusually high number of casualties. Remove that, and casualties would have been no worse than similar raids on other German cities.


In terms of accuracy of the bombing performed by heavy bombers, the post-war U.S. Strategic Bombing Survey found that when bombing by day in clear weather, the 8th Air Force was able to get half the bombs dropped within one-third of a mile of the aiming point. When bombing by day through heavy cloud, accuracy fell dramatically, with half the bombs dropped falling within 3.9 miles of the aiming point.

Bomber Command's bombing accuracy generally increased during the war in response to technological and operations factors. By the end of 1944, it was able, in moderate or good weather, to get about 90% of the bombs dropped falling within three miles of the aiming point, with a good proportion of those falling within one mile.

 

[SpitfireIX]

Actually, Hitler's interference with the Me-262 didn't really make that much of a difference. The real problem for the jet was mass production of reliable engines, and that problem wasn't solved until mid-1944.

True, but it's still a great example of his military incompetence.