Why Trump will be reelected

[dudalb]

I see someone just proved our points about Bernie Bros.

 

[Meadmaker]

No President has lead the Executive Branch, commanded the Armed Forces, or represented the United States as well as Trump has trolled the Left. And make no mistake that is what he was elected to do. Trump won 2020 an hour into election night 2016 when the first video of a crying college liberal with pink hair and a "Gender is Fluid" t-shirt was broadcast on CNN.

This.


And it has been a problem for Democrats for a while. To win, it's important for the nominee to denounce at least some aspect of the extreme left, so that this doesn't work.

They have to have the Sister Soulja moment, or be willing to denounce the Reverend Wright.

And even then there's the uphill climb due to the economy, but it's a start.

 

[Venom]

If Democrats would get behind the nominee, and it's increasingly clear who that's going to be, many of these problems would look smaller.

 

[dudalb]

And I think the Bernie Bros whole "Bernie will excite large numbers of voters who have not voted before to come out" is just the "Lost Tribe" school of politics under different labelling.

 

[dudalb]

If Democrats would get behind the nominee, and it's increasingly clear who that's going to be, many of these problems would look smaller.

Not really.
It all depends on a small group of voters in a few swing states. and I submit Bernie will not appeal to them at all.

 

[dudalb]

And If Bernie shold not get the nomination, I wonder if the Bernie Bros will stick to their "Party Unity" statement.
And, frankly, we have just seen blind party loyalty at work with the GOP in the Senate, and I don't want any more of it. It's bad, no matter which party indulges in it.

 

[Venom]

And I think the Bernie Bros whole "Bernie will excite large numbers of voters who have not voted before to come out" is just the "Lost Tribe" school of politics under different labelling.

Again, it's not so much attracting large non-voters to come out and vote, (although we shouldn't rule that out; think of the significant chunk of Sanders voters who, according to one poll anyway, say they won't vote for a different nominee)
but that Democratic and Independent voters would vote for Sanders regardless of the labels thrown his way. He offsets some of the socialist baggage with his honesty and fighting spirit. Voters are superficial enough (or reasonable enough) to look past that in the general.

 

[Venom]

And If Bernie shold not get the nomination, I wonder if the Bernie Bros will stick to their "Party Unity" statement.
And, frankly, we have just seen blind party loyalty at work with the GOP in the Senate, and I don't want any more of it. It's bad, no matter which party indulges in it.

If the Bernie Bros are who you think they are, they were never seated and secured in the party unity train. The party unity calls from the Bernie Bros were more a shot at Tom Perez and DNC bosses who urge party unity whenever it's their favored incumbents and candidates and drop it when it involves progressives who rock the boat.

 

[PhantomWolf]

Former Goldman Sachs CEO and lifelong Democrat Lloyd Blankfein told the Financial Times in an interview published Friday that he could have an easier time voting to reelect President Donald Trump than for Sen. Bernie Sanders, should the latter secure the Democratic nomination for president.




Sanders replied: I welcome the hatred of the crooks who destroyed our economy.

This is one of the major issues I have with Bernie. He doesn't have the ability to read people and calm their fears, but rather acts in ways that actually exacerbates those fears.

Consider his UHC scheme. One of the questions that keeps being raised is that about Private Insurance. He doesn't seem to understand that Americans have been programmed into a belief that they have to have Insurance, and the way he goes about explaining builds up the fear that in losing their Insurance they will lose their healthcare.

He says "We're getting rid of Private Insurance" instead of saying "Under the healthcare plan I have, you will no longer have any need for Private Insurance."

In his stump speeches in the debates he doesn't come across well as understanding how people think, and that causes people unnecessary fears.

It's an issue that I do worry about as far as how well he can talk to, and convince the middle ground people that he is better than Trump.

 

[dudalb]

This is one of the major issues I have with Bernie. He doesn't have the ability to read people and calm their fears, but rather acts in ways that actually exacerbates those fears.

Consider his UHC scheme. One of the questions that keeps being raised is that about Private Insurance. He doesn't seem to understand that Americans have been programmed into a belief that they have to have Insurance, and the way he goes about explaining builds up the fear that in losing their Insurance they will lose their healthcare.

He says "We're getting rid of Private Insurance" instead of saying "Under the healthcare plan I have, you will no longer have any need for Private Insurance."

In his stump speeches in the debates he doesn't come across well as understanding how people think, and that causes people unnecessary fears.

It's an issue that I do worry about as far as how well he can talk to, and convince the middle ground people that he is better than Trump.

THIS.
Though with healthcare the problem is that Nobody knows what "Berniecare" will look like. People are going to be very reluctant to exchange their current health care..whatever problems they might have with it...for something they don't know anything about.
And then there is cost..Bernie cannot just nationalize the private insurance companies;he is going to have to buy out the stockholders at a fair market value. That is going to cost huge bucks.

But don't worry; the Berniebots will just handwave this away like they do any criticism of the Anointed One.

 

[Venom]

This is one of the major issues I have with Bernie. He doesn't have the ability to read people and calm their fears, but rather acts in ways that actually exacerbates those fears.

Consider his UHC scheme. One of the questions that keeps being raised is that about Private Insurance. He doesn't seem to understand that Americans have been programmed into a belief that they have to have Insurance, and the way he goes about explaining builds up the fear that in losing their Insurance they will lose their healthcare.

He says "We're getting rid of Private Insurance" instead of saying "Under the healthcare plan I have, you will no longer have any need for Private Insurance."

In his stump speeches in the debates he doesn't come across well as understanding how people think, and that causes people unnecessary fears.

It's an issue that I do worry about as far as how well he can talk to, and convince the middle ground people that he is better than Trump.

I do have concerns about how he frames his arguments at least if he's going to be that unapologetic and adamant in his views.

 

[Cabbage]

THIS.
But don't worry; the Berniebots will just handwave this away like they do any criticism of the Anointed One.

....said the poster who routinely hand waves away the polls showing Sanders leading Trump.

Oh, the irony!

 

[Segnosaur]

THIS.
But don't worry; the Berniebots will just handwave this away like they do any criticism of the Anointed One.

....said the poster who routinely hand waves away the polls showing Sanders leading Trump.
Oh, the irony!

People skeptical of Sanders' ability to win the general election generally have a reason why polling data may not mean much... because Sanders hasn't been subject to the type of Republican attacks that candidates like Hillary Clinton (or even Joe Biden) had to endure.

How Sanders will implement parts of his health care plan are different... There is nothing preventing a complete discussion of the impact on the economy when all those health insurance companies see their markets disappear overnight.

 

[PhantomWolf]

THIS.
Though with healthcare the problem is that Nobody knows what "Berniecare" will look like. People are going to be very reluctant to exchange their current health care..whatever problems they might have with it...for something they don't know anything about.

Very true, and the thing is that it shouldn't be that hard to actually do it either.

Here we go let's try.

All US Citizens and Legal Residents will have their healthcare covered such that they can visit with any General Practitioner inside the US with a minimal cover fee ($20-40). Specialist Appointments, along with with emergency treatment, as well as all non-elective inpatient or outpatient hospital services within the US will be without any cost to the patient (assuming US Citizen or Legal Resident) at the point of service.

Certain elective services, such as elective plastic surgery, will not be covered, but can be covered via a private insurance. Non-elective versions of these, such as plastic surgery for burns victims, would be covered.

Prescriptions will have a subsidised listing which will result in a charge of $5 per prescription for those medications on the list, to a maximum cost to the patient of $100 per year 1st Jan-31st Dec.

Birth control medications well also be subsidised so as to be freely available.

Costs for the system will obtained be via:

• Savings in Hospital Administration
• Saving in the Administration costs of Medicare, Medicaid, and Veteran Healthcare as these will all be incorporated into the new system
• A Healthcare Levy on Businesses based on Number of Employees and the Industry Type of the Business, aimed to be lower that current Insurance Premiums
• A Healthcare Levy on income earners. Again aimed to be lower that current Healthcare Premiums
• Levies will be administrated via the IRS to reduce Government Administration

Hospitals will be funded based on populations served and historical use. GPs will be funded based on patients seen and enrolled. Specialists including Dentists, Ophthalmologists, and Physiotherapists will be funded per appointment.

There we go, basic bare bones, but an idea of what it could look like.

And then there is cost..Bernie cannot just nationalize the private insurance companies;he is going to have to buy out the stockholders at a fair market value. That is going to cost huge bucks.

Literally don't need to buy them out or nationalize them, just make them useless. Of course it will result in somewhat of a financial lose for those invested in them unless they manage to come up with a new business model that keeps them afloat, but at the end of the day, any business can fail because its marketplace changes, so... market forces, right?

 

[Sideroxylon]

“Toxic Bernie Bro culture” is narrative propagated by political opponents that provides many a non
Sequitur justification for suspicion of the candidate.

If America votes for Trump again you will just have to wait for more of the stupid, selfish white boomers to die.

 

[PhantomWolf]

“Toxic Bernie Bro culture” is narrative propagated by political opponents that provides many a justification for suspicion of the candidate.

Yeah no, it comes from observing certain extreme Bernie followers in both 2016 and now in 2020. Many have noted that there are Bernie Bros that was are more extreme than Bernie is, but make a lot of noise and end up putting people off Bernie.

 

[Sideroxylon]

Yeah no, it comes from observing certain extreme Bernie followers in both 2016 and now in 2020. Many have noted that there are Bernie Bros that was are more extreme than Bernie is, but make a lot of noise and end up putting people off Bernie.

Doesn’t address my point. The behaviour of any of his supporters is no rational reason not to vote for the man and his policies.

 

[PhantomWolf]

Doesn’t address my point. The behaviour of any of his supporters is no rational reason not to vote for the man and his policies.

Goes both way, I have seem a number of both his supporters and others on this board stating that they won't vote for other candidates because of how the perceive the supporters of that candidate to act.

 

[Venom]

Doesn’t address my point. The behaviour of any of his supporters is no rational reason not to vote for the man and his policies.

We've seen at least one poster, not seen in a while in the subforum, vow to sit the election out if Bernie gets the nom. Because people were being mean to him on Twitter and Facebook.

I understand his pain because Bernie Bros turn against me a lot of the time too, but that's not what Sanders is about.

 

[Stacyhs]

Are you better off now than you were four years ago?
.

Financially? Yes. A lot better. But I'm smart enough to know that Trump is not responsible for that. The economy would have been healthy if Clinton had been elected, too. It was growing under Obama and this is just a continuation. Sadly, his followers will continue to believe his lies that the economy is the best it's ever been and that's due to him.

In other areas, I'm worse off and my daughter will be worse off due to his huge and growing deficit, his denial of climate change and his EPA's actions that have rolled back environmental protections, his damage to the US's standing in the world, his divisiveness, his attacks on the media sowing distrust, and so much worse.

Am "I" better off? It's a mixed bag. But I will not vote for Trump.