Who started both World Wars?

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abenja1 said:
This is so fun watching 9/11 Investigator go down like this. Got my popcorn and soda and having a grand ol time.

BTW for 9/11 investigator:
1. Pearl Harbor was attcked by the Japanse
2. America didn't allow it to happen. It was more irresonsiblity on those manning the intelligence that let it slip by.
3. Hitler killed Jews.
4. Jews were gassed
5. The Axis were the bad guys, not the good guys.
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You forgot the part where Germany (Hitler) declared war on the United States before the US (Roosevelt+Congress) declared war on Germany.
 
Translation: Corsair and I agree that Japan attacked PH because of the oil embargo imposed by the US on Japan so that the Japanese were forced to go after the Dutch East Indies. As Buchanan said: "no oil, no empire".
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It would seem or non-historian hater has forgotten the Japanese announced policy of The Greater East Asia Co-Prosperity Sphere. The Japanese planned the Sphere in 1940 to create a Great East Asia, comprising Japan, Manchukuo, China, and parts of Southeast Asia, that would, according to imperial propaganda, establish a new international order seeking "co prosperity" for Asian countries which would share prosperity and peace, free from Western colonialism and domination

The Americans were fully aware that the Japanese were preparing to attack the Western colonies....but that Japan first needed to solidify her conquests in China. China was another step on their empires conquest of Asia starting with Taiwan in 1895, then Korea, the German colonies in WWI, then Manchuria and at the time China and later Indo-China.

The Americans were also fully aware that their naval/air strenght backed by their industrial capacity would crush Japan if the Japanese attacked. The embargo was an attempt to stop the war before it began.
 
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Hans said:
The Americans were also fully aware that their naval/air strenght backed by their industrial capacity would crush Japan if the Japanese attacked. The embargo was an attempt to stop the war before it began.
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The embargo was demanded by isolationists in Congress who didn't want us "sucked into war" because we were supplying the combatants. This is per the Congressional Record.
 
Hans said:
It would seem or non-historian hater has forgotten the Japanese announced policy of The Greater East Asia Co-Prosperity Sphere. The Japanese planned the Sphere in 1940 to create a Great East Asia, comprising Japan, Manchukuo, China, and parts of Southeast Asia, that would, according to imperial propaganda, establish a new international order seeking "co prosperity" for Asian countries which would share prosperity and peace, free from Western colonialism and domination

The Americans were fully aware that the Japanese were preparing to attack the Western colonies....but that Japan first needed to solidify her conquests in China. China was another step on their empires conquest of Asia starting with Taiwan in 1895, then Korea, the German colonies in WWI, then Manchuria and at the time China and later Indo-China.

The Americans were also fully aware that their naval/air strenght backed by their industrial capacity would crush Japan if the Japanese attacked. The embargo was an attempt to stop the war before it began.
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Not forgetting the land taken during the Russo-Japanese War.
 
Gawdzilla said:
Not/Even is tangling with a guy who used the term "Volkischer Beobachter" in a freshman history exam.
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[Vader]Impressive.[/Vader]

Seriously, though, it doesn't really matter. 911 could have a debate with Gordon Mork, be completely annihilated, and still claim victory.

1706047bdedf4603bd.jpg
 
SpitfireIX said:
[Vader]Impressive.[/Vader]

Seriously, though, it doesn't really matter. 911 could have a debate with Gordon Mork, be completely annihilated, and still claim victory.
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A poor knowledge of history pared with denial, spiced with hate can lead a man into some really silly statements and beliefs

ie see our less than sweet 9/11
 
SpitfireIX said:
[Vader]Impressive.[/Vader]

Seriously, though, it doesn't really matter. 911 could have a debate with Gordon Mork, be completely annihilated, and still claim victory.
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I had lunch with Gordon one day and he invited me into the graduate school at Purdue. He was Head of the History Department then. He knew me as an undergrad, inviting me into one of his graduate seminars when I was senior. A truly wonderful man with, at the time, two awesome Great Danes. He was kind enough to introduce me to Gerhard Weinberg.

9/11 wouldn't survive five minutes with him. Prof. Mork would politely destroy him.
 
9/11-investigator said:
Or you are not paying attention. It was Chamberlain himself who confided that the Jews were pushing him into the war.



Don't trust me, after all I might be an antisemite for all you know. Trust Kennedy, the father of JFK.
Oh wait, the Kennedy clan was antisemitic as well. That's why JFK had to die...
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I wouldn't trust anything Kennedy said. The man wanted an understanding with Hitler, attempting to get a meeting with him on more than one occasion. He had the same view of Jews as you seem to have, viewing the Nazi stance as reasonable.

Whereas, of course, Chamberlain was a pretty decent chap...
 
9/11-investigator said:
I never heard of the Open Door Policy and the Nine-Power Treaty before, I am not a historian remember and anything that happens outside Europe and maybe Russia and America hardly interests me. Call me a racist.
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You admit to having no knowledge of or interest in Asian history, yet you presume to tell us that FDR engineered American entry into WWII by maneuvering Japan into attacking Pearl Harbor. You also persist in citing such utterly discredited non-historians as Bacque, Buchanan, Butz, and Stinnett. Do you see where this would tend to undermine your credibility?

9/11-investigator said:
Maybe that these 2 thingies somehow did indeed hurt American interests like reduced availability of sushi or something. But I doubt that it represented a vital interest like the oil was for the Japanese.
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US GDP, 1930 (million $US): 91,200

US exports, 1930: 4,400

(source)

US direct exports to China, 1930: 90

US direct exports to China, 1931: 98

(source)

Further, the linked article implies that counting transshipping through Japan and Hong Kong, total US exports to China would be roughly 50% higher.

Although this represents only a few percentage points of total US exports during the period, many Americans viewed China as a vast untapped market with the potential for much greater trade (see here).

As for cutting off a Japanese "vital interest", the US had already tried milder sanctions, which had not worked. So why not apply harsher sanctions, particularly when the "vital interest" was only vital to Japan's continued attempt to undermine the Open Door Policy?
 
SpitfireIX said:
As for cutting off a Japanese "vital interest", the US had already tried milder sanctions, which had not worked. So why not apply harsher sanctions, particularly when the "vital interest" was only vital to Japan's continued attempt to undermine the Open Door Policy?
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It's entertaining for me to read one camp complaining that the US did too much and another complaining that the US did too little. "Damned if you do, damned if you don't."
 
am not a historian remember and anything that happens outside Europe and maybe Russia and America hardly interests me.
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That you are no historian is very evident to all. This lack of knowledge extends to Europe as you have also demonstrated repeatedly. Now the crazy thing is after showing the world that you have little knowledge of history - you are then attempting to show that accepted history is wrong.......

Of course the reason you appear to be a moron about history is that you are trying to distort it to fit you hate agenda. History is subject to opinions and different views but your looking at tiny parts of it and ignorning the rest is....wait for it......

Totally nuts

Yep the Japanese problem... was America to appease them or try to halt them short of war? After the pronouncement of the Co-prosperity sphere it was clear to all that all colonies in Asia would be "freed' by the Japanese. And except for Siam and most of China all of Asia WAS colonies
 
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MG1962 said:
They only became an allie after germany attacked them. before that they were an allie of Germany
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They were no allies, they merely had a non-agression pact. If I tell you that I am not going to hit you in your face today, that hardly makes us friends, would you not agree MG?

And who exactly was going to stop them. The world was pretty lucky Stalin didn't decide to go all the way to the French coast cause nothing the allies in Europe had was was going to stop them
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Huh? The Allies had enough military clout to stop the Russians. They could have mobilized the British, French, heck even the German populations to resist. And the Americans showed in August they could flatten Moscow in an hour. By 1945 the USSR had long stopped being Jewish controlled, it now was the US that was the premier address of the Jews. Until this day. The USSR had played it's useful role in bringing down Europe's core resulting in dividing Europe between the USSR and the USA. But that was enough for the Jews. From then on the struggle for world supremacy with the Zionists at the helm, now was between a zionist dominated USA and a communist block that had lost it's world revolutionary zeal (symbolized by the murder of world revolutionary #001 Trotzky, by Stalinists themselves). That struggle was won by the US in 1990 --> 'unipolar moment'.

I am in the US. You clearly know nothing about the United States, Great Britian or Stalin's Soviet Union to make that comment
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That's because you do not want to see. The US is probably only outdone on the internal spying front by North-Korea. 'Terrorism' and all that jazz.

http://www.thenational.ae/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20100723/OPINION/707229945/1080/FORIEGN

No country in the world has more camera's per capita than Britain.
 
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