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Moderated What's wrong with porn?

LissaLysikan said:
Advisory: You put yourself in the category of " I want to win even when I know I'm wrong".
Welcome to the killfile. You may be lonely for a bit - you're the first person to admit to being dishonest intentionally I've met in JREF. If I'm lucky, you'll be there alone for a while.
Might I suggest some lessons in proper debate? Such as having valid arguments?
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Like your glowing example here? Well done - you'll go far.
 
Southwind17 said:
Exactly. Not a fair comparison.
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If I was making a comparison you might have a point. I was not. I was pointing out that your line of argument, as presented, applied equally well to trashmen as to porn stars.

Now, as you don't seem to believe that trashmen have low self-esteem you must have left out a step in your reasoning that hangs on one of the many differences between the two jobs: something that, when added, makes your line of reasoning apply only to porn stars and not to trashmen.

There are several differences between the two occupations, but I don't know which particular one you feel is significant here and which yields "porn-stars have low self-esteem" and not "trashmen have low self-esteem." So, what particular difference did you have in mind?
 
fuelair said:
Why don't you list your assumptions, list your reasons/evidence for your belief in the validity of your assumptions and then make your point from those assumptions. I believe that would make your case - and prevent the twists and turns in your recent posts.:)

Just a passing thought.
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Here's another passing thought: I didn't start this thread to make a case one way or the other, and I have no intention to do so. I merely started it to solicit views of others, just out of interest. With that in mind I think my achievement deserves a round of applause!
 
Leif Roar said:
If I was making a comparison you might have a point. I was not. I was pointing out that your line of argument, as presented, applied equally well to trashmen as to porn stars.

Now, as you don't seem to believe that trashmen have low self-esteem you must have left out a step in your reasoning that hangs on one of the many differences between the two jobs: something that, when added, makes your line of reasoning apply only to porn stars and not to trashmen.

There are several differences between the two occupations, but I don't know which particular one you feel is significant here and which yields "porn-stars have low self-esteem" and not "trashmen have low self-esteem." So, what particular difference did you have in mind?
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Tell you what, why don't you explain exactly why you're focusing on trashmen here, as opposed to, say, doctors. Seriously - please do. Depending on your response I might then entertain your request.
 
Southwind17 said:
Tell you what, why don't you explain exactly why you're focusing on trashmen here, as opposed to, say, doctors.
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I'm not. I'm just using trashmen as a counter-example. I might just as well have used any other low-status profession.

Seriously - please do. Depending on your response I might then entertain your request.
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Heh. I'm not exactly holding my breath. I don't think you can point to a relevant difference. You've dug yourself into a rethorical hole and don't know how to get out of it, so you're laying down fog.
 
Southwind17 said:
Tell you what, why don't you explain exactly why you're focusing on trashmen here, as opposed to, say, doctors. Seriously - please do. Depending on your response I might then entertain your request.
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Because you brought up trashmen, just as you brought up cats. If you bring them up, it is legitimate to ask why and rational to expect a reasonable response. You appear to actually or puposively misunderstand that point.
 
fuelair said:
Because you brought up trashmen, just as you brought up cats. If you bring them up, it is legitimate to ask why and rational to expect a reasonable response. You appear to actually or puposively misunderstand that point.
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And if I didn't bring them up, pray tell, then what?:
Leif Roar said:
Most women taken from a cross section of society might deplore the idea of being a trashman. Does that mean that trashmen have low self-esteem?
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:rolleyes:
 
Southwind17 said:
I find it interesting how easily you seem to justify things using the "it's just a job" argument. Makes me wonder how you feel about these "jobs":
  • Executioner
  • Back-street abortionist
  • Soldier (in Afghanistan, say)
  • Japanese whaler
  • Malaysian tree feller
  • Drug trafficker (illegal, yes, like prostitution)
  • Seal culler
  • Poppy grower (Afghanistan, again)
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That's the point. How I feel about doing those jobs would be completely different than how others would. Every job you've listed someone does. Some people like them, some people don't some people want to do and some people don't.

I can say what I would like to do and what I wouldn't. But to say "Generally women wouldn't want to do X" is just making an assumption. I want figures. I want data. You are claiming that your impression and your assumption is true.

I would not do that, because by my impressions and assumption, I would say that the majority of women would love to have sex all day and get paid a lot for it.

See what I mean?

What "logic" would that be then?
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see above.
 
Leif Roar said:
Is it "low-status" or "profession" you're pretending you don't know what means?
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I assure you there's no pretense on my part. You used the term "low-status profession". I'm not sure what you mean when you use that term, and I'd like you to explain, however you'd like to cut it.
 
Stacy Head said:
What's wrong with porn?

The music is terrible
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Clearly you haven't dug enough :p

I've seen a couple porn movies with really awesome music. There's this one (which also happens to be very graphic) that had some sort of Mccoy Tyner music in the background (At least it sounded just like Mccoy. That type of explosive pentatonic piano music with heavy fifths played in the bass). I always found it hilariously odd that such a graphic movie has that music.
And as matter of fact, last night I stumbled upon another porn movie that had really good jazz in it.

But as matter of fact, what ruins it for me is precisely when porn has music, even if it's good. I hate that. I don't want nor need music. I've always found it distracting and annoying.
 
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bigred said:
:rolleyes:

I don't have any links to scientific studies proving that water is wet, but I'm sticking w/my opinion on that one too. No offense, but I honestly don't care if you believe/agree with me or not.
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That's it. Just because you think you're right, and you don't want to hear the evidence that shows you may be wrong, it's time to put your hands over your ears and go "NO NO NO NO NO NO NO".

No facts needed, just beliefs.
 
JFrankA said:
How I feel about doing those jobs would be completely different than how others would. Every job you've listed someone does. Some people like them, some people don't some people want to do and some people don't.
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Please don't try to avoid the issue at hand. You like to claim that "a job is just a job" when justifying your respect for porn actresses. So, please let us know how you feel about each of those jobs I've listed.
 
Southwind17 said:
Please don't try to avoid the issue at hand. You like to claim that "a job is just a job" when justifying your respect for porn actresses. So, please let us know how you feel about each of those jobs I've listed.
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Why is that relevant?

I've told you how I felt about women and doing porn. I am making the assumption based on my belief and experiences that most women would love to have sex all day and get paid a lot for doing so. I know I would.

Again, that is just a belief and an assumption based on my experiences. Is it right? Is it a fact? I dunno.

Neither do you.
 
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Southwind17 said:
Please don't try to avoid the issue at hand. You like to claim that "a job is just a job" when justifying your respect for porn actresses. So, please let us know how you feel about each of those jobs I've listed.
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You are missing the point. It's irrelevant what Jfranka says about those jobs. What would you prove with his personal take on those jobs anyway? Would you prove that nobody in the world likes to do them? No, you wouldn't, because as matter of fact there are lots of people doing those things.

To recapitulate, your claim seems to be about women and porn, specifically whether or not they like to do that job. It's a broad generalization. There are hundreds of women who wouldn't think of working in porn even if they got paid billions of dollars. So what? There are also hundreds of women who would do it for free.

The jobs you listed there, were intentionally selected so that most reasonable people would reply with "No, I wouldn't do that" to all of them. So then you can say "See? My point is made" but your point isn't made even if you find one hundred people in this forum to reply "No" to all of them. Does one hundred sound like a Deterministic Statistical number?

And just for the record, I would never do any of those jobs. I would also never work as the guy who clubs pigs to kill them, but I heard a lot of people work at that. I also heard it takes a certain type of personality to be able to do that.

I would never work as a surgeon cause I faint when I see broken bones. But I heard a lot of people can do that and not faint. Again, job preference clearly seems to be directly related to the unique personality of the individual.
 
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