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Merged What's happening in the Middle East?

Thunder

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http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110123/ap_on_re_us/tunisia_spreading_protests

first Tunisia and now possibly Yemen.

any chance that Saudi Arabia could follow?


I support any and all attempts to bring down dictatorships, but only if there is a democratic and secular movement waiting in the winds to take the reins of power once the might have fallen.

Unfortunately, we don't exactly have that in the Middle East.

Replacing one form of dictatorship with another form of dictatorship, is not an improvement.
 
Yemen and Saudi Arabia would probably get much worse under mob popular rule.
 
Algeria is real candidate for this scenario.

Not sure about SA though. The population may not be happy, but I understand that they are developing at breakneck speed to be able to compete once they run out of oil.
So the population is looking at a real chance of economic development under the current system. And as the saying goes; Hope shines eternal.

Happened to talk to a Saudi this weekend, so my information may be a lot rosier than is warranted.
 
WildCat said:
Yemen and Saudi Arabia would probably get much worse under mob popular rule.
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no clue about Yemen, but SA? Why do you believe so? I always had the impression the people are less radical than their government. But actually don't know why :D
 
DC said:
no clue about Yemen, but SA? Why do you believe so? I always had the impression the people are less radical than their government. But actually don't know why :D
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No, the government of SA is less radical than the Saudi Street. The harsh Islamic laws resulted from a deal the government made with the clerics. When jihadists took over Mecca in 1979 and locked themselves inside with hostages the government needed a fatwa to use armed force to take out the jihadis. The clerics made an offer. Let us control social policy while the government controls economic and foreign policy. Liberalization was rolled back and the country became a wealthy, glittering state with a stone-age mentality.

Don't let the talk fool you. The princes and royals talk puritanism in public before trotting off to Paris or Morocco to drink, gamble and whore.
 
Virus said:
No, the government of SA is less radical than the Saudi Street. The harsh Islamic laws resulted from a deal the government made with the clerics. When jihadists took over Mecca in 1979 and locked themselves inside with hostages the government needed a fatwa to use armed force to take out the jihadis. The clerics made an offer. Let us control social policy while the government controls economic and foreign policy. Liberalization was rolled back and the country became a wealthy, glittering state with a stone-age mentality.

Don't let the talk fool you. The princes and royals talk puritanism in public before trotting off to Paris or Morocco to drink, gamble and whore.
Click to expand...

i don't give crap about your opinion.
 
In all fairness, though, that the ruling clique doesn't actually practice what it preaches, hardly makes them enlightened. It makes them hypocrites. The regime is nevertheless enforcing an oppressive Wahhabi Islamism, and it's done with the full cooperation of those in charge.

And, again, making shows of piety to consolidate one's power doesn't make one enlightened or anything. Not in Saudi Arabia, not in the USA, not anywhere else. Some people are still using religion to get an advantage for themselves. Their not even actually believing what they preach and not acting accordingly, just makes it worse. It makes them hypocrites.
 
NPR's The World was talking about this yesterday, and the opinion of the several reporters was that other repressive governments were taking one big lesson.... Squash dissent earlier. Also, throw a few sops out to the masses; lower the price of gasoline and bread, for instance.
 
Virus said:
No, the government of SA is less radical than the Saudi Street. The harsh Islamic laws resulted from a deal the government made with the clerics. When jihadists took over Mecca in 1979 and locked themselves inside with hostages the government needed a fatwa to use armed force to take out the jihadis. The clerics made an offer. Let us control social policy while the government controls economic and foreign policy. Liberalization was rolled back and the country became a wealthy, glittering state with a stone-age mentality.

Don't let the talk fool you. The princes and royals talk puritanism in public before trotting off to Paris or Morocco to drink, gamble and whore.
Click to expand...

Still, if it's done on the cleric's instigation, it's still the opinion of a small minority imposed on the whole people. It doesn't say much about what indeed the average Joe (or Muhammed) in the street thinks of these Islamic laws.
 
ddt said:
Still, if it's done on the cleric's instigation, it's still the opinion of a small minority imposed on the whole people. It doesn't say much about what indeed the average Joe (or Muhammed) in the street thinks of these Islamic laws.
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I'd expect it to at least not be very unpopular on the street either, or not overtly unpopular. The house of Saud were the historical main peddlers of Wahhabi islamism, all the way back to the 18'th century. They used their claim to being the followers of what the Quran literally says as an excuse for their conquests in the area, and for the attacks on the Ottoman Empire who were claiming the title of Caliph.

Basically the people there are pretty used to live in the most ridiculous recreation of the 7'th century, and to be ruled by some guys who thump the Quran so hard and often that they probably need a reinforced edition.
 
I can tell you that in Egypt the Muslim Brotherhood would win a landslide victory if there were elections tomorrow.
 
Virus said:
I can tell you that in Egypt the Muslim Brotherhood would win a landslide victory if there were elections tomorrow.
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don't you believe that for any country that has some Muslim or Arabs in it?
 
HansMustermann said:
I'd expect it to at least not be very unpopular on the street either, or not overtly unpopular. The house of Saud were the historical main peddlers of Wahhabi islamism, all the way back to the 18'th century. They used their claim to being the followers of what the Quran literally says as an excuse for their conquests in the area, and for the attacks on the Ottoman Empire who were claiming the title of Caliph.

Basically the people there are pretty used to live in the most ridiculous recreation of the 7'th century, and to be ruled by some guys who thump the Quran so hard and often that they probably need a reinforced edition.
Click to expand...


This is all quite true. Let's not forget, people, that the founder of the House of Saud and the founder of Wahhabism were best of buddies. In fact their children married. The story of Saudi Arabia and Wahhabism is really just a single story.

Some members of the House of Saud may have heartily embraced westernism, but I think you'll find the majority of them (there's 25,000 of them, after all) are devout followers of Wahhabism.
 
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