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Vaccine/autism CT discussion
- Thread starter Clayton Moore
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Reality Check
Penultimate Amazing
Vaccine/autism CT discussion
NOT
Any vaccine causes any disease CT discussion
Discussing Anthrax vaccine and GWS is outside of the topic of this thread.
Clayton Moore: Cite the studies showing the links between the MMR jab and autism
First asked 4 March 2013 (1 days and counting)
In fact you have been unable to answer this question (except for rumors about anecdotes) for 644 days and counting
!Reality Check
Penultimate Amazing
r-j, a couple of problems with this assertion.
Firstly is the vagueness of "human activities" which includes things like people moving into areas where a disease is active. But this is the Conspiracy Theories section so we should be talking about people creating the disease (the usual CT fantasy. This is a problem with past diseases, e.g. the Black Plague
!Secondly is that you have provided no examples of any suddenly appearing disease that is unlike anything known in the history of medicine.
r-j
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It's a small surprise to see some people wanting to control what can be discussed, especially in regards to conspiracy theories. I mean, who cares?
While the starting post wasn't actually an opening post, it certainly has created a long running topic. It's also a look at how beliefs are formed, how they resist anything that challenges them, and how various other issues come up when discussing almost anything.
I didn't know children with health issues were excluded from vaccine studies, nor did I know there isn't a control group to compare side effects to. But it makes sense.
As for the obvious link between vaccines and autism, please. Give us a break. This topic is all about the two, as well as other related issues. The title is Vaccine/autism CT discussion
Vaccine/autism
And you don't know how they are linked?
While the starting post wasn't actually an opening post, it certainly has created a long running topic. It's also a look at how beliefs are formed, how they resist anything that challenges them, and how various other issues come up when discussing almost anything.
I didn't know children with health issues were excluded from vaccine studies, nor did I know there isn't a control group to compare side effects to. But it makes sense.
As for the obvious link between vaccines and autism, please. Give us a break. This topic is all about the two, as well as other related issues. The title is Vaccine/autism CT discussion
Vaccine/autism
And you don't know how they are linked?
r-j
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Injecting multiple vaccines into infants, with no long term safety/side effects studies, in regards to what can happen with multiple vaccines (http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/su6201a2.htm yikes!) is scary to the uneducated. It's enough to get people wondering if it's possible modern medicine is actually creating new conditions, created by the huge amount of vaccines. Now that is not a conspiracy theory, as it does not require any devious whispering among the powerful, or any intent to harm.
But it's something. Pretending it isn't a valid concern, dismissing the very idea it could be causing problems, now that seems more like a conspiracy of some sort.
Because it's hard to imagine the highly educated medical leaders of the modern world could be that stupid. To not do studies and double blind testing of all the vaccines together, not just individual vaccines.
Chris Haynes
Perfectly Poisonous Person
So exactly how to do you keep the multiple microbes away from any infant and child that they often contact each day away? Do you not breathe on them? Do you boil the bath water, and maintain the nursery as a sterilized clean room where you must go through decontamination protocols before entering?
Now where is that actual factual scientific data from the 1970s and 1980s that showed there is a connection between the MMR vaccine after its 1971 approval in the USA?
r-j
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I'm with you on this. Where are the scientific studies on children who receive vaccines? Not individual ones, on the entire issue.
It's not impossible to use animals and vaccines to see if it's even possible to create health problems by using too many vaccines. Where are the studies to show the safety of 20 or 30 vaccines in infant animals?
Obviously no study of infant children would ever be allowed.
But certainly animal studies could be done to see if it's even a possibility that too many challenges to an undeveloped immune system could lead to health problems.
It's not impossible to use animals and vaccines to see if it's even possible to create health problems by using too many vaccines. Where are the studies to show the safety of 20 or 30 vaccines in infant animals?
Obviously no study of infant children would ever be allowed.
But certainly animal studies could be done to see if it's even a possibility that too many challenges to an undeveloped immune system could lead to health problems.
Chris Haynes
Perfectly Poisonous Person
Now where is that actual factual scientific data from the 1970s and 1980s that showed there is a connection between the MMR vaccine after its 1971 approval in the USA?
Edit to add: An MMR vaccine had been in use in the USA for twenty years before Wakefield came on to the scene. There were three MMR vaccines introduced in 1988 in the UK, so Wakefield's paper was about ten years after that. So how come the less than a decade of use in the UK of three separate MMR vaccines there was an indication of autism that was not found in the previous two decades in other larger countries?
Come on! Give us those studies. Make us believe that Wakefield did not just make it up in order to get cash from a lawyer to support a lawsuit. If you don't, we will know that Wakefield was just making it all up.
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Clayton Moore
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The wonderful success of the small pox and polio vaccines has made the vaccine solution immune to criticism. Vaccines have become a one size fits all solution.
Vaccines have become the new aspirin, the new hysterectomy, the new prostate surgery.
And then you have Gardisil.
http://www.gardasil.com/what-is-gardasil/gardasil-side-effects/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=TG3mWgsMt-A#!
And the industry says Gardisil is safe.
The problem is that the vaccine concept has turned out NOT to be one size fits all.
And most of the medical community, after seeing what happened to Wakefield, refuses to rock the boat.
Dcdrac
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Clayton some HARD facts about Polio eradication
http://www.polioeradication.org/
"Polio can be prevented through immunization. Polio vaccine, given multiple times, almost always protects a child for life."
http://www.polioeradication.org/
"Polio can be prevented through immunization. Polio vaccine, given multiple times, almost always protects a child for life."
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Clayton Moore
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pakeha
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Please don't divert the thread with your ideas about Gardasil.
What happened to Wakefield is what should happen to all MDs putting their personal gain over their patients' health.
We. I think it's time to stop fluffing, CM.
Please post up your sources for believing in that connection.
dafydd
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