Transgender man gives birth

mike81 said:
I also said that I have the right to know if they're in a relationship. Does this mean that I'm comparing being in a relationship to having gender dysphoria?
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Yes, as well as having an STD.
 
mike81 said:
Nonsense.
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Nope, it's right there in black and white.

Look, I agree with you. It would be polite by a trans-gendered person to inform you prior to your date that he/she is trans, just as it would be polite to inform you if he/she is in a relationship.

Informing you about STDs isn't about being polite.
 
uke2se said:
Please address a trans-gendered person with the pronoun of his/her choice. It's only polite.
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Including "xer"?

Please allow a trans-gendered person to use the locker room/bathroom of the gender he/she is transitioning to.
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Bathroom I get. But locker room I don't. On the one hand we're been told that men or women being made uncomfortable by the presence of people of the opposite biological sex in their locker rooms is silly, but we're also asked to allow trans people to go into the locker room of their choice because... they will be very uncomfortable in the other?

If you find yourself on a date with a trans-gendered person and he/she didn't inform you before hand, please don't get violent.
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In fact: don't get violent unless you have a pressing reason to.
 
uke2se said:
Yes, as well as having an STD.
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Uke, you're being silly. You're basically saying that in this situation:

- Honey, could you buy me some salt? We're out.
- Sure thing.
- Oh, and some flour, too.

...the first person is saying that flour and salt are the same thing? They're enumerating things, just like Mike did.

Informing you about STDs isn't about being polite.
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The point wasn't about being polite but about giving you crucial information. You know this.
 
Argumemnon said:
Including "xer"?
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Sounds really weird to me. And there are whole lists of pronouns for every conceivable gender or sexual variation making the rounds. No idea if they're parody, fringe activism, or if we're meant to take them seriously.
I've never encountered anyone that wanted me to use any of those alternative pronouns, so I think being worried about those might be just a bugbear for people who like to complain about 'crazy stupid leftists' more than anything else.
Personally, I'd just avoid pronouns around people like that, or if they're the kind of annoying I expect, avoid them altogether. ;)

Argumemnon said:
Bathroom I get. But locker room I don't. On the one hand we're been told that men or women being made uncomfortable by the presence of people of the opposite biological sex in their locker rooms is silly, but we're also asked to allow trans people to go into the locker room of their choice because... they will be very uncomfortable in the other?
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Someone partway through a transition will look out of place in any locker room.
Other than individual stalls, or outright banning trans people from locker rooms altogether, I don't see a solution that isn't going to make at least some people uncomfortable undressing around them.
Making someone who looks like a dude except for their genitals use the women's locker room is going to cause at least as much of an uproar as letting them use the men's locker room.
 
Porpoise of Life said:
Sounds really weird to me. And there are whole lists of pronouns for every conceivable gender or sexual variation making the rounds. No idea if they're parody, fringe activism, or if we're meant to take them seriously.
I've never encountered anyone that wanted me to use any of those alternative pronouns, so I think being worried about those might be just a bugbear for people who like to complain about 'crazy stupid leftists' more than anything else.
Personally, I'd just avoid pronouns around people like that, or if they're the kind of annoying I expect, avoid them altogether.
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Yeah but if the theory is correct, then not using "xer" in the presence of someone who requires it is rude, and possibly bigoted.

Someone partway through a transition will look out of place in any locker room.
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I'd avoid locker rooms altogether during that period but that's just me.

Other than individual stalls, or outright banning trans people from locker rooms altogether, I don't see a solution that isn't going to make at least some people uncomfortable undressing around them.
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True, however if we're to balance one against the other, would you say that making the fewest possible people uncomfortable would be the better option? (serious question. I don't know the answer myself.)
 
Argumemnon said:
Hear, hear.



I'd say about as much harm, on average, as being told you're not a biological woman just because you believe that you are.
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The trans friends I have don't have any disbelief in their biology. Of course you need to constantly correct them about how they are not real women and all of that to make yourself feel better.

As for hooking up with people, what if you find out they voted for Trump? True horror that is.
 
uke2se said:
Should I read this to mean that the trans-gendered person is to blame if he/she gets murdered by someone who discovered bits where they didn't expect them?
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Most of the blame should go to the one doing the murder, but part of the blame should go to the TG person outright lying fully knowing to the other party on such intimate matters. Yes blah blah blame the victim blah blah. I am sorry but once you do intimate stuff with two persons and you outright lie to the other on intimacy, and they react poorly, part of the blame is to be born by the liar. By the time you are intimate it should have been told BEFORE. (ETA: and by intimate I am speaking of beyond dating).

This isn't a case of blaming for a short skirt in a dark alley, it is the case of outright lying about an intimate situation shared to two.

Do you want really want to assign no blame whatsoever for lying on such matter ?
 
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p0lka said:
but transmen are not real men. That's why they go through the whole trans thing in the first place.
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And no one thinks african americans are real americans. They never have been and never will be. Why else would they only count as 3/5 of a person to start with? When ever anyone talks about real america you know what they really mean right?

When anyone talks about Americans with out qualifiers they clearly mean white people.
 
Aepervius said:
Most of the blame should go to the one doing the murder, but part of the blame should go to the TG person outright lying fully knowing to the other party on such intimate matters. Yes blah blah blame the victim blah blah. I am sorry but once you do intimate stuff with two persons and you outright lie to the other on intimacy, and they react poorly, part of the blame is to be born by the liar.

This isn't a case of blaming for a short skirt in a dark alley, it is the case of outright lying about an intimate situation shared to two.

Do you want really want to assign no blame whatsoever for lying on such matter ?
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See GlennB. My interpretation wasn't so bad after all.
 
qayak said:
The problem is with your logic.

Forged Picasso
Real Picasso

There is, without question, a difference even with your mistaken use of the word "real" in your comparison. The issue is more accurately, and less inflammitorily, expressed this way:

Transman
Man

Once again there is an obvious difference.
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Also

American
African American

Also an obvious difference.
 
Aepervius said:
Most of the blame should go to the one doing the murder, but part of the blame should go to the TG person outright lying fully knowing to the other party on such intimate matters. Yes blah blah blame the victim blah blah. I am sorry but once you do intimate stuff with two persons and you outright lie to the other on intimacy, and they react poorly, part of the blame is to be born by the liar. By the time you are intimate it should have been told BEFORE. (ETA: and by intimate I am speaking of beyond dating).

This isn't a case of blaming for a short skirt in a dark alley, it is the case of outright lying about an intimate situation shared to two.

Do you want really want to assign no blame whatsoever for lying on such matter ?
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Your honor I had to kill him.........he lied.
 
uke2se said:
Are you saying trans-people should inform their dates that they are trans or risk being murdered?
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Of course just like trump voters, people who have ever gotten a cold sore, any chronic illness and non virgins. All these deal breakers must be disclosed before meeting someone.
 
Aepervius said:
ETA: correction here (*) they probably want both

It isn't any *random* stuff though. It is about sex in the very end, and not gender. The crushing majority of people don't date a specific man/woman gender , they wish to date a specific sex (*)male-man/female-women. And such things should be disclosed and taken into accounts.
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No they seem to only date people where the sex and gender match. No matter how much they say that Trans Men are really women they wouldn't date one.
 
mike81 said:
Just because you don't seem to care about the details of someone you might have sex with does not mean we should all feel that way. I have every right to know whether or not someone I might have sex with is a natural born woman with a vagina. Just like I have the right to know if they have any STDs, if they are currently in a relationship, etc.
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Religion, voting record, chronic illnesses and so on. I mean I am sure you list all of that on your dating profile. Though of course how do you know you don't have STI's when so many have no symptoms and are not tested in men?
 
applecorped said:
Your honor I had to kill him.........he lied.
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That would be more like , "your honor we were in bed and it turned out it was a man with full pieces, and I badly reacted with emotion , disgust and rage".

It does not make it acceptable at all, but it explains it, and it is a high risk of reaction if you outright lie to somebody you are getting intimate with. Love and sex are not exactely a rational stuff, and violent reaction CAN be expected. There is a reason crime of passion is a term, sudden rage.

So you can either outright lie as a TG and risk that, or you can be honest and tell it before this come to this point.

What we should be discussing is how long before it should be told, and NOT whether this should be told.
 
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