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Cont: Today's Mass Shooting (2)

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tyr_13 said:
At the local school the doors in the 'new' (twenty years ago) wing and any that have had to be replaced, turning the key from the outside unlocks the door only while the key is turned. That is to say, you can't keep the door unlocked from the outside. Once the key is out, or even not turned because it is under spring tension to unturn, the handle can't be used to open it from the outside. These doors are steel and steel framed, but that's just good sense from a cost over time standpoint anyway. I'm not sure if there is a way to lock the newer doors from the inside. That is, I think these doors might always open from the inside but only with a key turned from the outside.
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In the UK we call that a prison.
 
Cain said:
. . .The Buffalo shooter talked about circumventing NY's "cucked" magazine capacity. (He also talked about spending an afternoon at a gunshop "finger-[effing]" -- a deranged subculture's highly amusing patois).
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I am curious, what method, if any did he talk about using to get around the cucked capacity thing?

Dope Clock II: It's been 349 days since Bobby Menard announced plans to create "Artists Valley". So far all he has done is lie through his teeth.
 
arayder said:
I am curious, what method, if any did he talk about using to get around the cucked capacity thing?

Dope Clock II: It's been 349 days since Bobby Menard announced plans to create "Artists Valley". So far all he has done is lie through his teeth.
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He got his guns somewhere else.
 
His sentence was confusing.

The doors are always openable from the inside for emergencies.

From the outside, a key must always be used, and they self lock afterwards.
 
The Republicans can't think of a good example where you need an AR-15. Feral pigs they said. But I thought of one. A blind person protecting themselves in a home invasion. Shoot everything!

So there is my solution. Require permits for. AR-15s and give those permits only to the blind. Deaf does not count. Those people need to carry a hammer around the house, or keep one at every window. Do they can jump out when being invaded.
 
JoeMorgue said:
The problem is we've let the Nutcases on the Right define "Day gunna take our guns" as step 1 in the "Evil Liberal Takeover" narrative for so long that literally any gun law, no matter how rational or well supported by the 60% of the population who isn't intentionally stupid because it tweaks the libs, is going to come across as "Act 1 in our paranoid Red Dawn Prepper Fantasy"
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I've read this claim before and no one was willing to back it up. For example, a poll that shows a majority of people supporting something like universal bkgd checks for gun sales. But then the bill people are talking about is more than bkgd checks.

It seems to me that most gun control bills are made bloated with additional requirements so that they will not pass.

Can you show me a gun control bill that has a poll which shows 60% support of the population?
 
JoeMorgue said:
Here's one of the things we DO have to account for.

America does have a massive murder rate even if you take guns away.

If we get some kind of sane gun laws based someone is sooner or later going to go on a stabbing spree or drive a car into a crowd or something and you know, you just know the gun nuts are going to use that as "proof" that gun control doesn't do anything even if overall rates go down. You know they'll do it. You can probably already imagine the... well not arguments but the "LOL good thing he didn't have a gun hardy hardy har" trolling they will do.

This is America. You take away handguns (8029 murders), Firearms, Unspecified (4863 murders), Knives (1739 murders), Other weapons (983), Rifles (455), Clubs/Hammers (393), Shotguns (223), Narcotics (113), Fire (106), Asphyxiation (71), Strangulation (58), Poison (16), Drowning (5), and Explosives (4) we would still have 662 murders a year in America, which is still more murders than Japan, Spain, Italy, Australia, Sweden, Israel, the Netherlands, Finland, Greece, Scotland, Norway or many, many, many, many other countries have.

Americans beat each other to death with their bare hands at a murder rate greater than most countries.

We have both a gun problem AND a murder problem and the gun people WILL dishonestly try and argue that not solving the murder problem means we shouldn't try and solve the gun problem.

We need to go ahead and figure out how we are going to address that fallacious counter-argument now.


*2020 stats, last year I can find them broken down by weapon used
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I look at those numbers and I see a very clear problem with guns.

What did I quote yesterday....around 75% of all murders are with a gun? Your numbers seem to agree. I look up and I see around 13,000 murders with guns and a few thousand "other".

Sure some will find another way to kill, but I bet most of them would have never happened. Eliminating guns would demolish that number. Guns make it too easy.

I guess one problem with America is that people can see those numbers and say it isn't as big a problem as we all think it is. WTF?

ETA:
66% of gun deaths are suicides. Didn't see that on the list. That's a mighty big number.

It's easy to kill with a gun, even accidentally. How many innocent kids would be killed in a drive-by knifing?
 
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Instead of painting and criticizing big pictures, we can concentrate on narrower issues. Our grumphy old pal dudalb proposed (in this thread? some other one?) focusing on the seriously objectionable types of guns, specifically assault rifles. That can readily be done. The ATF regulates "destructive devices," a category that already includes a large number or firearms. That category can be expanded to include self-loading centerfire shoulder arms, guns that are of no use to civilians, as in zero, zilch, nada. (I specify centerfire to cover all those ridiculous pistol-caliber carbines, not-quite SMGs, that sell to the cheap thrills crowd.) That clears the way for sensible restrictions on weapons that no sane person would ever put in the hands of civilians.

Would this be an opening wedge for eventual confiscation, a slippery slope? Goddamn right it would!
 
Cain said:
Most kids do not, but some of these mass shooters obviously plot their attacks, which was true for the guy in Buffalo, who drove to gun shops out of state, left behind a sprawling manifesto, and wanted to livestream the atrocities. The Buffalo shooter talked about circumventing NY's "cucked" magazine capacity. (He also talked about spending an afternoon at a gunshop "finger-[effing]" -- a deranged subculture's highly amusing patois). Oddly, the public wants gun regulations to stop these mass shootings, but that's where they're least likely to have an effect (some of the most prominent recent shootings involve 18 year-old men, so maybe raising the age to buy any type of weapon to 21 could have an impact).

Never mind that the vast majority of gun homicide victims are not part of a mass shooting. Gun suicide is even more common than all types of firearm homicide, but I don't think we need to worry about high-capacity magazines in cases of self-harm. Handguns, as opposed to "assault rifles," are still the biggest problem in terms of public health. The regulations that poll well (universal background checks) are unlikely to make much of a difference. If I could, I'd ban all pistols and semi-automatics, but that's politically impossible given the culture.
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And in one school shooting that a poster mentioned yesterday, the school's classroom doors were all locked so he set off the fire alarm and shot kids as they mistakenly fled. Then he shot kids through the small windows that are in each door.

That's some cold-blooded calculated stuff there.

In a non-sick country we would all be in agreement that too many of our kids are dying from guns. My evidence is the rest of the civilized world.
 
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So once you turn all the schools into fortified bunkers what will be the Republicans plan when this dismally fails to save children in the next mass shooting? Replace all the school buses with APCs when some lunatic hoses one down with automatic rifle fire? Demolish any surrounding building taller than the school in case of a sniper? have teachers wear full SWAT gear when going to and from the car park? If one of these ******** can't get into the school they will target a playground or a school sporting event. This miserable insistence on lying about the content of the 2nd Amendment and refusal to entertain the idea that just maybe making people wait a couple of days to get their shiny new toy while the dealer makes sure they aren't a felon or a domestic abuser or otherwise raising a huge red flag, is beyond disgusting.
 
Captain_Swoop said:
Dan Crenshaw says on CNN that he doesn't support red flag laws nationally or in Texas because "what you're essentially trying to do with a red flag law is enforce the law before the law is broken"
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Kind of like a drunk driving law, yeah. I wonder if he has a problem with drunk driving laws.
 
Darat said:
Not aiming at you directly but don’t most Americans realise how insane it is that you have to be even thinking about these types of issues - in a school?
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Yes. But tell that to the anti-gun control "But, mah freeeeeeedoms" crowd. They want to address the symptoms, not the cause.
 
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