THE WASP-18b & Space Probes Mysteries

If you are driving 100 km/h and suddenly you get increasing resistance proportional with the velocity. Do you deny this is negative velocity?

Anyone remotely familiar with physics would deny it. What you are describing is negative acceleration, or decelleration.

Negative velocity is meaningless. Your confusion probably originates from calculations where we use negative velocities to describe something moving the opposite direction of a defined positive direction.
But is has no meaning in the physical world.
 
Yes. Negative velocity does not exist. What exactly does -2 km/h mean? Does the meter in your car show values below zero?

Doesn't negative velocity just mean that you're going opposite to whichever direction you have decided is positive? You're right that negative speed does not exist, though. Of course, a resistance would be a force, so Bjarne is wrong either way.
 
My equation have nothing with yours manipulated equation to do camrade Sensation_of_physics

We are still waiting for Bjarne to point out exactly where I have manipulated his equations.

And finally comrade Sensation_of_physics had begun to see that both equation are direct proportional . It took him 1/2 year.
And his own mistake is now claimed to have been caused by a "Skinner-constant Q"

No, I can't have, because my conclusions are based on manipulated equations and faulty math, Right? :)

anyway seriously, they are not "directly proportional". They are approximately proportional in a limit of large r, which explains why Bjarne seems to get this "exact equlity" he's so worked up about. Everyone else seems to get this point.

But lets take it one more time, just for Bjarne, and lets see if we can reproduce his results:

Bjarne is comparing the two sides of the equation

[latex]$$\omega\frac{M}{Qr}=a_{0}\left(\frac{1}{\sqrt{1-\frac{v^2}{c^2}}}-1\right)$$[/latex]

But with the little twist that he's using already known orbital data to get v; to boot, Keplers Law. Thus we substitute v for Keplers Law:

[latex]$$\omega\frac{M}{Qr}=a_{0}\left(\frac{1}{\sqrt{1-\frac{\frac{MG}{r}}{c^2}}}-1\right)$$[/latex]

(This is what Bjarne himself is doing, although he doesn't quite realize it, being oblivious to algebra, so I expect some more accusations of manipulations coming this way)

This is the onset of the circular reasoning; because we knew that the equation would already reduce to Keplers Law, i a large-r limit.

Bjarnes Claim is now that the above equlity holds exactly for each planet distance, r, in the solar system and that a slight discrepancy would mean that said planet is in an unstable orbit.

But a little more Algebra reveals that the equation can have at most one exact solution for r - it may even have none. All comes down to the constant Q, which Bjarne seems to have pulled out from one of the nether orifices of his body.

But if there is only one point where the equlity holds exactly then all planets not at this exact distance should be in unstable orbits!

In principle we are done here. But Bjarne seems obsesed with numbers so let do a few:

Constants (from Bjarnes webpage):

M=2 1030omega=2Pi/2.592.000
Q=6.52 1021c=2.99 108
(yes I omitted the units - including them would cause major incompatibility)

And The Gravitational constant:

G=6.67428 10-11
Mercury:

r=5.8 1010
[latex]$$\omega\frac{M}{Qr}=1.28203 \times 10^{-8}$$[/latex]

[latex]$$\left(\frac{1}{\sqrt{1-\frac{\frac{MG}{r}}{c^2}}}-1\right)=1.28716 \times 10^{-8}$$[/latex]

Whoops! Discrepancy already on third decimal place... So much for the "exact equlity" - perhaps this goes to explain why Bjarne chose to stop at second decimal place.

I hope this serves to illuminate that Bjarnes equation is not exactly equal, at least not from a mathematical viewpoint.

But all this fuzz about numbers is a bit bizare. After all, I my self have statet that the agreement will be better and better with increasing r. That is true, and when including measurement uncertainties and such, you might argue that from a physical viewpoint, the equation hold. But Bjarne still hits the snag that his idea doesn't explain anything new, it merely restates what we already know. And thus he is simply incorrect in his statement that this idea "solves numerous mysteries" - It doesn't! It predicts the exact same mysteries!
 
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Anyone remotely familiar with physics would deny it. What you are describing is negative acceleration, or decelleration.

Wtat about the expression negative mass?
Its that to wrong ?


Hardly. Does that mean that positive velocity is acceleration?

You got it

In the inital post, he shows that your claim that the "space wind" and "opposite force" equalize results in objects that move with a defined velocity in orbits less than 400 meters from the Sun.


Notice what Sensation_of_physics claims is that "all planets" should orbit the same orbit.
This can only mean he have got it all wrong. . Hence such statement or math can I not take seriously.
We talk about a insignificant deviation that e.g: maybe could explain the last unexplain mystery of Mercury's orbit.
This also mean that this could maybe cause Mercury VERY slowly to be thrown out in space.
If this was Sensation_of_physics wanted to say, its a different story.
Everybody can participate to check that out.
I can do that in the future but I will need a lager calculator, mine (10 digits is too small) .
What make all these difficult to calculate is that the inner planets transmit KE to the outer and KE is use to maintain the rotation as well.

A friend told me ½ year ago, that all the inner planets doesn’t seems to be where they should be.
He had seen this in TV
I do know more than this.
It could be nice to hear from you comrades what is this about.

Hopefully the internet can be used not only to tear to pieces people that thinks differently than the authoritarian want us to think
Hopefully somebody can see that this is maybe a track to discover a lot more of the law of the universe.
 
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Of course, a resistance would be a force, so Bjarne is wrong either way.

No
Matter is connected to space.
We know that space and matter is connected just not how.

We also know that space moves when matter moves

Therefore: - matter moves when space moves and resistance MUST emerge by constant velocity as well.

Is that really so hard to imaging.
And how can you disprove

What people world wide believes is not important at all.
 
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Wtat about the expression negative mass?
Its that to wrong ?
I see you are trying to change the subject, and I also see you are asking a question you know "stupid and lazy" people would answer no to. I've seen these little tricks before and will not respond to it.

But these are questions we can play around with after you explain how negative velocity manifests itself in the physical world.
 
Bjarne: You do not seem to be able to understand Sensation_of_physics's algebra since you call it "manipulation". Manipulation happens to be a large part of algebra.

Perhaps you can show where Sensation_of_physics went wrong in his arithmetic?
 
That 100% reflect the negative resistance too.

If you are driving 100 km/h and suddenly you get increasing resistance proportional with the velocity. Do you deny this is negative velocity?
Yes,your language usage is not correct. It creates a decrease in velocity (in the absence of further energy from the engine), a change in velocity is called 'acceleration'.
 
Notice what Sensation_of_physics claims is that "all planets" should orbit the same orbit.

No

Bjarne Claims that a condition for a stable orbit is that the space drag and space wind forces are balanced.

I have show - using Bjarnes equations - that if one stars with the orbital velocities given by Keplers Law, then this balancing happens at exactly one distance, for a given choise of the constant Q, and thus there should be no stable orbits execpt for this distance. The acutual effect on real orbits may be insignificant, it may be very significant - seeing as Bjarne has gleefully omitted any uncertainties, there are no way to say for sure.

I have futher shown that if one start without prior assupmtion of Keplers Law Bjarnes equations predict the same distance/orbital velocity relationship as Keplers Law and are thus redundant.

This can only mean he have got it all wrong. . Hence such statement or math can I not take seriously.

I couldn't have provided a clearer insight into Bjarne's void and nutty reasoning myself.

Bravo!

We talk about a insignificant deviation that e.g: maybe could explain the last unexplain mystery of Mercury's orbit.

which mystery of Mercury's orbit?

This also mean that this could maybe cause Mercury VERY slowly to be thrown out in space.

All planets are very slowly being throw out into space, though for very different reasons than Bjarne would imagine.

Perhaps it has something to do with the fact the the sun continuously loose mass literaly as sunshine.

A friend told me ½ year ago, that all the inner planets doesn’t seems to be where they should be.

I always get very amazed over such statements. How does anyone know where planets "should" be? Any Kepler's Laws surely doesn't place any such constraints on planet distances.

He had seen this in TV

Oh. Uncited, popular TV show... that explains it.
 
Wtat about the expression negative mass?
Its that to wrong ?

Negative mass is at least theoretically possible, although I doubt it exists in the real world. Negative velocity OTOH, is impossible.

You got it

You just equalled acceleation with velocity. Are you sure you wanna do that?


Notice what Sensation_of_physics claims is that "all planets" should orbit the same orbit.
This can only mean he have got it all wrong. . Hence such statement or math can I not take seriously.

No, he said that according to YOUR equation, there is only one stable orbit. AND hence, in a stable system, all planets had to have the same orbit.

This can only mean that YOU have got it all wrong, and cannot be taken seriously.

A friend told me ½ year ago, that all the inner planets doesn’t seems to be where they should be.
He had seen this in TV
I do know more than this.
It could be nice to hear from you comrades what is this about.

It is about a friend of yours who seems to have seen something on TV. Do you really think we should have an opinion on that? (Would this friend, by any chance, be mother cow?)

Hopefully the internet can be used not only to tear to pieces people that thinks differently than the authoritarian want us to think

Certainly. In fact the internet is much more used to tear apart what the authorities want people to think.

Hopefully somebody can see that this is maybe a track to discover a lot more of the law of the universe.

Well, for that, the internet can at best be a tool for knowledge sharing. It takes more than that to do real science.

Hans
 
No
Matter is connected to space.
We know that space and matter is connected just not how.

For a suitable definition of 'connected', yes.

We also know that space moves when matter moves

No, we don't know that. We know that space is distorted in the presense of matter (mass). Distorted does not equal move.

Therefore: - matter moves when space moves and resistance MUST emerge by constant velocity as well.

No, that conclusion is not valid. Even granted your premises, we have no indication that space provides resistance to moving masses.

In fact we have empirical evidense that it doesn't.

What people world wide believes is not important at all.

Agreed. However, what scientists can supply evidence for IS important.

Hans
 
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Oh, and Bjarne, please refrain from posting the same post in different threads. I notice you also posted at least most of post #44 in the other thread.

Hans
 
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Perhaps you can show where Sensation_of_physics went wrong in his arithmetic?

Why should I
His concluded the planets according to my equation “should” all be in the same orbit . This is wrong.
And this is not what my equation shows.
Sensation_of_physics's equation is not necessary, if you want to focus on “insignificant” deviation my equation will show that too.

But as I wrote it’s a lot more to figure out in the future according to tiny small different of force effecting each single planet.

As mention already KE must be transmitted from the inner planets to the outer. This is what drives the ""so called dark matter" in galaxies. Inner stars transmit KE to the outer starts because the inner stars also causes space to move/rotate and hence matter / stars to move too...

Also the point:

  • that planets rotations “consume” KE
  • ellipses of the planets are different .
  • the moons of the planets do also require KE to maintain theirs orbit.

All this is super complex to understand / calculate excac, - and will need software.

This has already been pointed out to Troels (Sensation_of_physics's ) ½ year ago, and still he does what he can ONLY to confused and misunderstand, and try to show that I am wrong doesn’t matter what I say.

At the Danish Forum: "Sensation of Physics" use the name Troels I suppose.
HERE everybody can read the essence of the “equation” repeated at this Forum.

The essence of the exact same equation was quote:

In Danish
Hvis Bjarne havde ret skulle vi med andre ord se alle planeter søge mod samme afstand fra Solen.

Google Translation
If Bjarne was right we should, in other words to see all planets move to the same distance from the Sun. We do not!

This is what Troels “”equation”” above “should” reveal.

Such conclusion is manipulation.

It have never been a secret that it’s not two completely parallel lines and also not that the distribution of KE is much more complex.

* * *​

The discussion “negative velocity” is in a same way nothing else as hair splitting. You guys know what I mean right ?

For those that takes them self time to read what I write in this chapter: The Pioneer Anomaly will see its all clear, and also that the equation is unique for exactly our solar system compared to many others.

THIS have cheated many scientist to believe that resistances against motion only “””should””” apply to acceleration.

Try seriously to think about WHAT is this resistance agains motion.
We know this exist (by acceleration) and WHY in h.... should it NOT apply to constant velocity.

Such kind of half work / physics screams to heaven for help.

Sorry I have not time to edit to perfect englishm you will understand

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Why should I
Evasion noted.

There are plenty of math-savvy people around here, and not a single one has supported you. You seem to be the only one who can find a fault with Sensation_of_physics' reasoning.

It is quite clear that you do not do it because you cannot do it, but you need nevertheless to be specific if you want to convince anybody here. "Why should I?" is not a convincing reply.
 
Try seriously to think about WHAT is this resistance agains motion.
We know this exist (by acceleration) and WHY in h.... should it NOT apply to constant velocity.
Because it cannot be observed empirically, that's why.
 
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There are plenty of math-savvy people around here, and not a single one has supported you.
You seem to be the only one who can find a fault with Sensation_of_physics' reasoning.

It's always so in Science No exception ...
For example … Already before I begin to wrote I knew the reaction>> crackpot >> crasy >> mental sic `>>> liar
It’s the same the whole way around the Earth and to all times, - and this is one of the reasons to science can be compared to fanatic concrete religion.

It is quite clear that you do not do it because you cannot do it, but you need nevertheless to be specific if you want to convince anybody here. "Why should I?" is not a convincing reply

I even do not want time to understand it.
My equation is OK
How stupid do you think I am?
It’s about this hair-splitting, that really only demonstrate because nobody seriously can disprove or seriously attack the theory, left is only hair splitting, and to make a fool out of me.
Because it cannot be observed empirically, that's why.

How many stars do you think follows a Keplerian orbit
Less than 1 %?
Billion doesn’t.

What many Planets do you think follows a Keplerian orbit?
All what we ""know"" is 7 ( Mercury does not).

Something possible shows that also the Earth and Venus also doesn’t. ( Juno must figure out what is wrong)
If old observation of Saturn is correct, also Saturn doesn’t. ( according to a russian scientist)
And what about the rest of the billion of planets ?

More and more data shows that MANY planets doesn’t follows kepliran orbits. (if you open you eyes)

Jupiter’s atmosphere must have come from a much cooler place (!)

Wasp-18b – that should have been demised for at least 500.000.000 years ago, where have it hidden it self ?

Gas-planets that should not could exist (be born) so close to stars

Planet found more than 15 billion km from their mother stars. Once everybody agreed this was impossible for planets to be born that fare away, and it is impossible , So what are the planets doing on a such trip ?

And so it goes on and on and on again

OPEN YOUR EYES

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It’s the same the whole way around the Earth and to all times, - and this is one of the reasons to science can be compared to fanatic concrete religion.

And yet, it works. No matter how many times it gets compared to religion, science keeps producing concrete, useful results. Something which no religion, and no crackpot, does.
 
And yet, it works. No matter how many times it gets compared to religion, science keeps producing concrete, useful results. Something which no religion, and no crackpot, does.

But remember all sceintist are crazy crackpot until they have proven their claims.
(Except those that follow the religion.)
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When I am wrong they will say I am a jude
When I am right they will say I am a German
Albert Einstein
 
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But remember all scientist are crazy crackpot until they have proven their claims.

Crazy crackpots, who actually manage to give evidence for their claims, stop being seen as crazy crackpots. Worth thinking about, perhaps?
 
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