The "Carlos Swett affair"

[Guest]

YOUR WORDS

At least I'm repeating my own words. Latin just repeats the words of others (or in this case, the pictures of others). And as I've told you before, just because I figured out why you were originally confused doesn't mean I don't think you were confused. And the fact that you have yet to see the truth, no matter how many times we tell it to you, clearly shows that anything positive I said about you was wrong.

Carlos believes that he can show evidence that a paranormal event took place on 9/11. I tried telling him that one video does not constitute "proper observing conditions," but because Randi and Andrew did not specifically say this, he does not think this was the reason he was rejected. So, anyway, his misinterpretation of the rules at least has some basis."
Rwald 08//30/2002

 

[rwald]

You're just proving my point, Latin. You do nothing other than copy other's words and repost them...

 

[Guest]

I WANT YOUR COMMENTS ABOUT YOUR OWN WORDS

Carlos believes that he can show evidence that a paranormal event took place on 9/11. I tried telling him that one video does not constitute "proper observing conditions," but because Randi and Andrew did not specifically say this, he does not think this was the reason he was rejected. So, anyway, his misinterpretation of the rules at least has some basis."
Rwald 08//30/2002

Please rwald i want to know about your comment about Carlos you said that his misinterpretations of the rules al least has some basis????

 

[rwald]

There's one sentence which, when read by some with a limited ability to read English, could be misinterpreted to mean that Carlos's challenge is valid. However, there are also about 20 other sentences which clearly state that Carlos is wrong. Apparently, Carlos read the first one and figured the rest didn't matter. That's where the basis is. Carlos misreading one sentence.

 

[Guest]

BUT.......

There's one sentence which, when read by some with a limited ability to read English, could be misinterpreted to mean that Carlos's challenge is valid. However, there are also about 20 other sentences which clearly state that Carlos is wrong. Apparently, Carlos read the first one and figured the rest didn't matter. That's where the basis is. Carlos misreading one sentence.

That is your opinion as a fan of Randi, but if JREF thinked that Carlos`s challenge is not valid, they must answered in the first email: YOUR APLICATION IS NOT VALID.

Remember that JREF studied Carlos`s challenge and they are still in silence.

 

[rwald]

Since I'm the native English speaker, I think I can say that the below equality is true:

"You have no claim. There is nothing supernatural going on." = "Your claim is invalid."

 

[Guest]

RANDI'S COMMENTARY : I SAW AN ALIEN SHIP

In James Randi's commentary of October 11, 2002, and in reference of what a reader George Paz wrote, there is a picture of the Basilica of the Virgin of Guadalupe in Mxico.

Below this picture and with big blue words is Randi's mockery:AN ALIEN SHIP....?

He is refering about the letter of the other "skeptic" George Paz.

This STUPID mockery of two "skeptics" (Randi and Paz) can be interpretate in this way :

A) Both beleives in alien

B) Both saw an alien ship.

Because ,if Randi only do this stupid joke based in where the church is (Mexico, "the third world" ) , I Carlos Swett protest and remember "the amazing" that the "first world" is full of churches with differents forms and cults, even your favorite cult JR : "the satanic" ("what in hell are you raving abouth"? ).

I am not going to debate about people's faith and the particular way of receive GOD inside them, this forum is full of nicks of demoniac names, those are they choises, but they also appears as skeptics (what a contradiction)

In the same Randi's commentary are his own words:

"George, my own experience with this cruel farce was far more serious and shocking, but I do appreciate that you shared yours with our readers. Though I'll someday write up my account, I'll only tell you now that during the filming session there, I wandered down a flight of stairs — not unintentionally — and found the vast counting room where currency of many nations was being busily and noisily sorted and counted. The amount of cash I saw there was staggering. The stark contrast between the tiny copper coins the stricken poor were dropping into the many collection-boxes upstairs, and the gold-clad altars, figures, and ornaments that were set up to glorify this stupid painting as one of divine origin, stays in my mind like a scar. Just thinking about all this depresses me and re-affirms my determination to fight this sort of flummery. Thanks very much for your contribution.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Yes James Randi you are right, they are collecting contributions and money in "name of god" , using a churche.

And you?

You do the same , only in "name of the devil ", washing brains of young people to don't have faith in God.
Your church is the JREF foundation (the trick to don't declare your income),
You also ask for donations (nobody knows how much, is top secret) , you sell T-shirts , books, etc of the same old stuff, you always talk about the same, you are preparing an "amazing meeting" just like another bussiness, etc., etc., etc.,

What is the difference?
We, hispanoamericans, have our faith, we are people with anccestral cultures that already discovered what you are trying to do with high technollogy.

RESPECT US ,the hispanics, JAMES RANDI.

So you saw an ALIEN SHIP?
Iam sure you did; and I know when and why.

Thanks,

CARLOS SWETT (S&S)

 

[hal bidlack]

latinijral and Carlos,

Let me suggest something to you. You seem convinced you should get money or credit or something for your video tape claim. I can't tell you how fully that offends me.

I am a US military officer, and I was in the Pentagon when the plane hit. What to you is some kind of bizzare quest for money or fame was for me the worst day of my life. And you repeatedly post pictures of that horror, those attacks. You are chasing fuzzy blobs while the real importance of the image are the deaths of people in that building. Can't you understand why it is wrong to repeatedly post this stuff?

On September 11th I didn't see any space ships in Washington. I held part of the airplane in my hands, I helped a guy with a head wound, I watched the roof collapse, I heard it. That was the worst day of my life, I still have nightmares most nights.

You wonder why some folks think you are idiots? You have trivialized a national trauma. You mock what we went through that day. I can still smell the jet fuel, I can still see the images. And you wonder why we don't respect you? How dare you.

sorry, but all those pictures really pushed my buttons tonight. I've tried to make light of what you are doing, but no more. You have a right to post here, you will not be censored or banned. But you have no honor.

When I think of Sept 11th, the image that comes to mind is not a stupid claim of a space ship. If you are right and we are all wrong, call the media, call 60 Minutes, call the New York Times, call the national guard for all I care, but leave us the hell alone. You are worse than a clown, you are heartless. You have my contempt but also my pity. I hope you get over this soon.

edited for stupid typo

 

[Guest]

RANDI: I SAW AN ALLIEN SHIP

RANDI'S COMMENTARY : I SAW AN ALIEN SHIP
In James Randi's commentary of October 11, 2002, and in reference of what a reader George Paz wrote, there is a picture of the Basilica of the Virgin of Guadalupe in Mxico.

Below this picture and with big blue words is Randi's mockery:AN ALIEN SHIP....?

He is refering about the letter of the other "skeptic" George Paz.

This STUPID mockery of two "skeptics" (Randi and Paz) can be interpretate in this way :

A) Both beleives in alien

B) Both saw an alien ship.

Because ,if Randi only do this stupid joke based in where the church is (Mexico, "the third world" ) , I Carlos Swett protest and remember "the amazing" that the "first world" is full of churches with differents forms and cults, even your favorite cult JR : "the satanic" ("what in hell are you raving abouth"? ).

I am not going to debate about people's faith and the particular way of receive GOD inside them, this forum is full of nicks of demoniac names, those are they choises, but they also appears as skeptics (what a contradiction)

In the same Randi's commentary are his own words:

"George, my own experience with this cruel farce was far more serious and shocking, but I do appreciate that you shared yours with our readers. Though I'll someday write up my account, I'll only tell you now that during the filming session there, I wandered down a flight of stairs — not unintentionally — and found the vast counting room where currency of many nations was being busily and noisily sorted and counted. The amount of cash I saw there was staggering. The stark contrast between the tiny copper coins the stricken poor were dropping into the many collection-boxes upstairs, and the gold-clad altars, figures, and ornaments that were set up to glorify this stupid painting as one of divine origin, stays in my mind like a scar. Just thinking about all this depresses me and re-affirms my determination to fight this sort of flummery. Thanks very much for your contribution.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Yes James Randi you are right, they are collecting contributions and money in "name of god" , using a churche.

And you?

You do the same , only in "name of the devil ", washing brains of young people to don't have faith in God.
Your church is the JREF foundation (the trick to don't declare your income),
You also ask for donations (nobody knows how much, is top secret) , you sell T-shirts , books, etc of the same old stuff, you always talk about the same, you are preparing an "amazing meeting" just like another bussiness, etc., etc., etc.,

What is the difference?
We, hispanoamericans, have our faith, we are people with anccestral cultures that already discovered what you are trying to do with high technollogy.

RESPECT US ,the hispanics, JAMES RANDI.

So you saw an ALIEN SHIP?
Iam sure you did; and I know when and why.

Thanks,

CARLOS SWETT (S&S)


__________________

 

[rwald]

You want to talk about the Basilica in Guadalupe? Sure, we can talk about that.

To start off, I should say that I've never been there, and will basically base my arguments on what was in Randi's commentary. If you've actually visited this basilica, tell us, so we can see where you're coming from.

First of all, Randi was NOT saying he or Paz saw an alien spaceship. He was just comparing the basilica to a spaceship. He said that the basilica was "like a massive alien ship sucking the life out of that dying harvest of humanity." He isn't saying it's like a spaceship because it's in Mexico; he's saying its like a spaceship because it sucks people's lives away.

The difference between the way that the basilica took money and that Randi takes money is this: the basilica takes money from the very poor, from those who need every last penny to feed themselves. The basilica then uses this money for external decorations, buying "gold-clad altars, figures, and ornaments" instead of helping the poor. By contrast, Randi does not take money from the poor; presumably, he only takes money from people who can afford to give (if you can prove this wrong, then do so). Also, he doesn't spend the money just buying ornaments; he uses the money to help educate people about con-men and hoaxers pretending to have supernatural powers. There is no valid comparison.

 

[Guest]

latinijral and Carlos,


I can't tell you have fully that offends me.

I am a US military officer, and I was in the Pentagon when the plane hit. What to you is some kind of bizzare quest for money or fame was for me the worst day of my life. And you repeatedly post pictures of that horror, those attacks. You are chasing fuzzy blobs while the real importance of the image are the deaths of people in that building. Can't you understand why it is wrong to repeatedly post this stuff?


.

Bidlack:

Why you did not protest when Rwald in this thread posted the FIRST picture of the tragic event?

Rwald did a gallows humor with the image. I protested, stupid, where were you?

Do you know how many inocent people died because and after that fatidic 9/11 in the other side of the world?

No, there is only inocents people died in the towers, there is still the problem of war in the world.

Do you know how that incident affected the third world?

Open your eyes, birdlack YOu were the first person in this thread to make a mock of this.

About the money, Randi have the e-mail for what the money was going for: ask him.

I am claiming another point, is not my fault that happened also that tragic day.
I share all that sentimental feeling you have but we can not block the sun with one finger.

So you were mockering on me before?
This is an educational forum , is not war.

Thanks,
S&S

 

[Blue Monk]

To latinijiral,

That really, REALLY looks like an alien spaceship.

Where's the proof that it really, REALLY is?

There is a difference you know. You don't really believe David Copperfield is making those 747s disappear do you? I mean it really, REALLY looks like it.

To Carlos,

I can't help but notice that you have conviniently chosen to overlook my post.

I contend that you were not treated unfairly in your quest for winning the Million Dollar Challenge based on the fact that you cannot meet the requirements spelled out long before you came into possesion of that tape.

I am further of the belief that you cannot even meet the first requirment, reposted here for your convinence.

One Million Dollar Paranormal Challenge
I, James Randi, through the JREF, will pay US$1,000,000 to any person who can demonstrate any psychic, supernatural or paranormal ability under satisfactory observing conditions. Such demonstration must take place under these rules and limitations.

1.Applicant must state clearly in advance, and applicant and JREF will agree upon, what powers or abilities will be demonstrated, the limits of the proposed demonstration (so far as time, location and other variables are concerned) and what will constitute both a positive and a negative result. This is the primary and most important of these rules.

You have claimed for sometime that you have been treated unfairly. On this basis you have even chosen to slander others.

Can you or can you not satisfy the first rule of the challenge.

I look forward to being ignored again.

 

[Purple Tentacle]

i have an AVI here that shows an angle similar to carlos, it shows quite a few birds fly past the camera and no sign of the paranormal event !

now me telling you this is nice and all but i really need to make this AVI available to all of you.

where can i post / upload this 2mb AVI so you all can download it??
because i believe that it will stop this thred for good.

 

[Purple Tentacle]

ok everyone, Big it up for Blue Monk, for his help hosting the file.

here is the link : http://www.inlex.net/bluemonk/WorldTrade01.avi

 

[Doubt]

Re: HONOR OR HONOUR

Hi Doubt:

Yes , si, of course, we, yap, afirmativo.

I have the second one.
Was taped from the perspective of the street , (not from a building as the other one).

Is curious that tape is also censored.
Was not showed at the anniversary of the tragedy (kike the other one ), but was broadcasted by CNN at the six months of the tragedy(edited in the moment of the cross of the "thing").

But at the first week of the tragedy was transmitted ,considering
people was focused in the plane crashes.I have it. Is my surprise to Randi when he decides to write about it.

Yes they are more , another one from a long view of CNN 5 seconds (and 300 feets )before the plane crashes the second tower. In that "long"trayectory of the plane are many white points in "triangle formations" that appears and dissapears.

*snip*

Carlos,

Please clarify this for me:

Do you have a second tape that show the same "paranormal" object as the one you submitted or do you have a second tape of a different object?

Two tapes of different phenomena is no better than one tape of one phenomenon. The images posted here from your tape are not many white points in "triangle formations".

If the two tapes do not show the same object, then you have nothing. Since you mentioned no second tape before now, then I can only assume that the tapes do not show the same object and that you have no proof.

If you do have two different tapes of the same object, then get in contact with the UFO people. This is the kind of proof they have been searching for.

 

[Guest]

WHY NOT JREF?

Carlos,

Please clarify this for me:

Do you have a second tape that show the same "paranormal" object as the one you submitted or do you have a second tape of a different object?

If you do have two different tapes of the same object, then get in contact with the UFO people. This is the kind of proof they have been searching for.

Hi Doubt:

And Why not the JREF?
Is not the kind of proof they are challenging and searching for?

So you are also afraid now?

Thanks,
S&S

 

[Guest]

The avi file didn't work for me. Anyone else have trouble? Latinijral did you take any pictures from your TV the show the object just before it first enters the tower? Are there any pictures available which show the object halfway out of the hole?

 

[Guest]

JUST READ MY SIGNATURE

To latinijiral,

That really, REALLY looks like an alien spaceship.

Where's the proof that it really, REALLY is?

There is a difference you know. You don't really believe David Copperfield is making those 747s disappear do you? I mean it really, REALLY looks like it.

To Carlos,

I can't help but notice that you have conviniently chosen to overlook my post.

I contend that you were not treated unfairly in your quest for winning the Million Dollar Challenge based on the fact that you cannot meet the requirements spelled out long before you came into possesion of that tape.

I look forward to being ignored again.

Hi Blue Monk:

I invite you to read my signature.

Then you can read Andrew Harter's answer to my application and if you can find a quote that my application was not valid , please tell me.

Then I invited you to focus in "the bird".
Just analize it the propper way, but don't forget to see the tape.

Thanks,
S&S

 

[Blue Monk]

Hey Carlos,

You keep ignoring my posts.

I've got a better clip than yours from the World Trade Center a year before the tragedy.

Check it out http://www.scifi.com/happens/happens_1_big.mov

Gee, that's a lot spookier than yours. Beats you by a year too.

What's the matter Carlos? Too busy calling everyone liars to actually show a little ethical backbone and back it up.

Again I ask, and this is for the third time and I will continue to ask it, can you meet the rules requirements to make you eligible for the Million Dollar Paranormal Challenge. If you can't then your slanderous remarks and claims to unfair treatment are false. You haven't been treated unfairly. You simply cannot meet the rules set out long before you acquired the tape.

Again, only the first requirement......

Million Dollar Paranormal Challenge
I, James Randi, through the JREF, will pay US$1,000,000 to any person who can demonstrate any psychic, supernatural or paranormal ability under satisfactory observing conditions. Such demonstration must take place under these rules and limitations.

1. Applicant must state clearly in advance, and applicant and JREF will agree upon, what powers or abilities will be demonstrated, the limits of the proposed demonstration (so far as time, location and other variables are concerned) and what will constitute both a positive and a negative result. This is the primary and most important of these rules.

So again I ask, can you or can you not meet even the first requirement listed in the official rules?

Do you have any ethics? Do you understand what ethics are? Do you have no qualms about slandering people, calling them liars and claiming unfair treatment when you know yourself that you cannot meet the basic requirements of the challenge?

What powers or abilities do you intend to demonstrate and under what observing conditions do you suggest?

Well don't worry Carlos. I'll repeat my question tomorrow and the day after lest anyone truly have any doubts as to whether you were treated unfairly and have a legitimate claim.

 

[Guest]

WELCOME

The avi file didn't work for me. Anyone else have trouble? Latinijral did you take any pictures from your TV the show the object just before it first enters the tower? Are there any pictures available which show the object halfway out of the hole?

Hi Zaphodb:

Like a virgin? Your first quote and curious.

Well, welcome to the mental hospital.

There are four pictures in sequence in the page 12 of this thread.

Just look at those pictures and "think " whatever you want, you are free to make your opinion.

In page 1(first post) is the answer Andrew harter gave to my application and in page 2 (?) is my translated application.

I hope this recomendations help you in your correct curiosity.

Thanks,
S&S