Cont: The behaviour of US police officers - part 2

[Thermal]

But if they can say they feared for their life, they get to shoot the suspect! It's more fun that way!

There is a lot of things they could do if they weren't conditioned to meet any conceivable danger with lethal force.

Tru deez. It's sickening. Valuing human life needs to be a little higher on these guys' priority list. Let the courts dole out punishment.

 

[Suddenly]

Tru deez. It's sickening. Valuing human life needs to be a little higher on these guys' priority list. Let the courts dole out punishment.

They value human life. Just their own infinitely more than anyone they see as a remotely plausible threat, being cowardly in the face of danger, and playing it safe by blasting away.

(I don't think most of these cases are cops deciding to play executioner. They for sure do this but in those cases they tend to be way more neat about not getting caught)

It's telling when they criticize the idea of social workers attending to mental health crises because the workers could get hurt or killed. The idea that a person might be willing to put their life on the line for a stranger in distress is that alien to them.

 

[Bob001]

There is a lot of things they could do if they weren't conditioned to meet any conceivable danger with lethal force.

That's not an exaggeration. Police have been getting training to kill as "warrior cops" for decades, paid for by our tax dollars.
https://www.insider.com/bulletproof...-trainer-teaching-officers-how-to-kill-2020-6
https://newrepublic.com/article/141675/professor-carnage-dave-grossman-police-warrior-philosophy
https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2020/06/warrior-cop-trainings-industry.html
https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2020/08/warrior-cop-class-dave-grossman-killology.html

 

[lobosrul5]

I saw a medieval approach used by German police a while back for dealing with knife weilding suspects (medieval in the good sense this time): literal chain mail, protecting the cop from a bladed weapon.

For the US, don't they keep riot shields in the trunk of the cruisers? Seems like they could just walk up and, you know, knock the suspect over.

Yeah, or they could've tased him from behind. But that might've raised the risks to the officers from 0 to very very slight, and thats what the police union will be saying in there defense.

 

[Thermal]

Yeah, or they could've tased him from behind. But that might've raised the risks to the officers from 0 to very very slight, and thats what the police union will be saying in there defense.

The article said they did tase him, but to no effect. Possibly because of bulky clothing?

ETA: LAPD says tased twice. Still, three cops with bog standard riot shields, they should be amply protected against throwing a butcher knife (which they said they "feared", not that he actually did).

I'd like to try out the argument that I "feared" a cop was going to shoot me, so I had to kill him. Pretty sure they'd go "oh, well we see your point".

 

[lobosrul5]

The article said they did tase him, but to no effect. Possibly because of bulky clothing?

ETA: LAPD says tased twice. Still, three cops with bog standard riot shields, they should be amply protected against throwing a butcher knife (which they said they "feared", not that he actually did).

I'd like to try out the argument that I "feared" a cop was going to shoot me, so I had to kill him. Pretty sure they'd go "oh, well we see your point".

Ahh, missed that. A third or fourth try was asking too much I guess.

 

[plague311]

We'll have to wait to see what happens with the bodycam on this one. Per NBC:

An investigation is underway after a 28-year-old Ohio man died Tuesday, one day after he was shot by police who believed he was a burglary suspect, as his family says he was cleaning out his late grandmother's home.

There are a few things that are a little weird.

...officers responded to an apartment building in the 300 block of Durrell Avenue at shortly before 1 a.m. on a report of two to three people attempting to break into a residence.

Like I said, a bit strange to clean out a place at 1 a.m., especially an apartment building.

To sum a lot of it up, the cops said they encountered Frasure (the victim) and his father behind the building, Frasure refused to get out of the vehicle, the van backed up and hit a tree, then drove forward quickly so the cops shot at the van a bunch, killing the son.

I doubt the Chief is making it all up, but something seems a bit off.

 

[mgidm86]

From the earlier link:

Responding officers found a victim suffering from “a life-threatening stab wound resulting in a collapsed lung and internal bleeding,” the statement said.

The victim described the attacker as a black man in a wheelchair who “dismounted the wheelchair, ran to the victim without provocation, and stabbed him in the side of the chest with a 12-inch butcher knife” and then fled the scene in his wheelchair, Department said.

Two stories here. One is supposed trigger happy cops. The other is that this man allegedly attempted to murder someone by stabbing them.

The cops appear to have overreacted. On the other hand, don't go around stabbing people then threatening police with the same weapon!

Also, this guy jumped out of his chair and ran at the person he stabbed.

I do think the cops overreacted, from what little I've seen, but I reserve final judgment for now. Can't hurt.

Finally, I wonder if the stabbing victim (collapsed lung, internal bleeding) gives a **** that this man was shot?

He's probably mentally disturbed. Actually that's an assumption. He could just be a criminal *******

 

[Gulliver Foyle]

We'll have to wait to see what happens with the bodycam on this one. Per NBC:



There are a few things that are a little weird.



Like I said, a bit strange to clean out a place at 1 a.m., especially an apartment building.

To sum a lot of it up, the cops said they encountered Frasure (the victim) and his father behind the building, Frasure refused to get out of the vehicle, the van backed up and hit a tree, then drove forward quickly so the cops shot at the van a bunch, killing the son.

I doubt the Chief is making it all up, but something seems a bit off.

Not necessarily, when I worked evening shifts in Tesco, I'd mostly do housework when I came home, around midnight.

 

[Aridas]

Not necessarily, when I worked evening shifts in Tesco, I'd mostly do housework when I came home, around midnight.

Ehh, "a bit strange" would still fit even in that case, though? It's not at all proof of something bad, just unusual in a way that invites a bit more investigation. Similarly, panicking when clearly trigger happy police show up like that isn't proof of wrongdoing, but it does invite questions (including ones about said police behavior, both past and present).

 

[bruto]

Ehh, "a bit strange" would still fit even in that case, though? It's not at all proof of something bad, just unusual in a way that invites a bit more investigation. Similarly, panicking when clearly trigger happy police show up like that isn't proof of wrongdoing, but it does invite questions (including ones about said police behavior, both past and present).

It seems like another example of someone afraid the police will kill them, and the police killing them to correct the mistake.

 

[catsmate]

Here's a question: What kind of person commits murder while he's wearing a camera that records it? All five of these guys thought they were untouchable.

One who believes there will be no adverse consequences to them from murder, a common belief in USAian police and one quite well supported by previous inaction.

 

[catsmate]

Oh you can **** right off with your semantic ********. If you shoot someone and they don't immediately die at the scene but hours or days later at the hospital you are still on the hook for killing the person by shooting them.

If the cause of death is the beating they did indeed beat him to death even if he didn't die *while* the beating was taking place.

Indeed.
I wondered when the first of our resident murder-apologists would turn up.

 

[plague311]

Not necessarily, when I worked evening shifts in Tesco, I'd mostly do housework when I came home, around midnight.

Ehh, "a bit strange" would still fit even in that case, though? It's not at all proof of something bad, just unusual in a way that invites a bit more investigation. Similarly, panicking when clearly trigger happy police show up like that isn't proof of wrongdoing, but it does invite questions (including ones about said police behavior, both past and present).

Absolutely, I'm sure we've all worked a late shift in our life and came home with some energy to burn that led to getting the house cleaned up or something like that. In this case though they're talking about moving things out of an apartment in an apartment building, which seems like it would be common courtesy to not do it at 1 a.m. since people are generally sleeping.

I get it, though. Sometimes that's not an option, it has to be done when you have the people to do it at a time that works for everyone. I'm more interested to see what the bodycam shows as far as if the police escalated the situation for no reason or if the people moving the stuff out panicked and escalate it.

 

[smartcooky]

Without the video, there would have been no demonstrations and no prosecution, and Chauvin would still be on the street. The police story would have been the only one anybody would hear: a drug-addled ex-felon had a heart attack while resisting arrest. Same story in Memphis without the videos. What's making the difference is video evidence, not demonstrations.

Yup. To paraphrase Will Smith...

"Police violence isn't getting worse, its getting filmed"

 

[Graham2001]

Yup. To paraphrase Will Smith...

"Police violence isn't getting worse, its getting filmed"

Indeed, I found this 2019 story from CNN about the struggle to get the bodycam footage from the 2016 killing of Tony Timpa by Dallas police, a case that has eerie parallels with the George Floyd killing, but for some strange reason nobody knows about Tony Timpa, he doesn't even have his own wikipedia page, I wonder why...

The body camera footage tells the story: Tony Timpa was struggling, begging Dallas police officers who were holding him in a controversial position to let him go.

Within minutes he had stopped breathing, while officers joked that he had fallen asleep, according to the footage first obtained from the police department by The Dallas Morning News after a nearly three-year battle for its release – part of the newspaper’s investigation into the August 2016 death of the 32-year-old man.

https://edition.cnn.com/2019/08/02/us/dallas-police-body-cam-footage-captures-death/index.html


The above also goes part way to refuting the claim I've seen around that the 'mainstream' media buries stories like this that contradict 'The Narrative' (e.g. White Cops hunt Blacks.)

 

[erlando]

https://edition.cnn.com/2019/08/02/us/dallas-police-body-cam-footage-captures-death/index.html

According to The Dallas Morning News, Timpa was in the parking lot of a Dallas porn store when he called police, telling a dispatcher he suffered from schizophrenia and depression. He told the dispatcher he was not taking his medication.

He called for help. They responded by killing him.

Never EVER call the police if you need help especially if it has to do with mental health. They are in no way equipped to handle the situation and will take any and all deviation from normalcy as a threat to their life and will escalate accordingly.

 

[Graham2001]

He called for help. They responded by killing him.

Never EVER call the police if you need help especially if it has to do with mental health. They are in no way equipped to handle the situation and will take any and all deviation from normalcy as a threat to their life and will escalate accordingly.

I've also been hunting for something that cropped up in my newsfeed at work a few weeks ago but I've not been able to track down, supposedly the victim called 911 because they had either broken down or had a flat tire and needed assistance. During the call the victim mentioned they were a geology student and had things in the car that could be misinterpreted as weapons (geology hammers, etc).


The victim was instructed to drop the items outside the car when the cops arrived.


When the cops did arrive the victim was shot dead, in the article the parents were fighting to get the bodycam footage.


What caught my eye is that both victim and the police who shot him were white.

 

[Darat]

Indeed, I found this 2019 story from CNN about the struggle to get the bodycam footage from the 2016 killing of Tony Timpa by Dallas police, a case that has eerie parallels with the George Floyd killing, but for some strange reason nobody knows about Tony Timpa, he doesn't even have his own wikipedia page, I wonder why... ….snip…)

No you don’t.

 

[erlando]

I've also been hunting for something that cropped up in my newsfeed at work a few weeks ago but I've not been able to track down, supposedly the victim called 911 because they had either broken down or had a flat tire and needed assistance. During the call the victim mentioned they were a geology student and had things in the car that could be misinterpreted as weapons (geology hammers, etc).

You're probably thinking of the shooting of Christian Glass. See post 1631 in this thread.

There's also a wiki page.