Merged Stolen Palestinian Land

Tin Foil Timothy said:
And this is what has led to the creation of the Zionist Movement and the plans to create Israel and ensure it's expansion past the initial stepping stone of the UN Plan.
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Well, I would say they represent the extreme right wing of that movement.

The talk of a 2 state solution by Politicians is complete BS. The agenda, as Cleon has said in his/her first paragraph, is for Israel taking the lot.
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I wouldn't say that. I'm sure there are Israeli politicians who genuinely believe in a two-state solution (though I imagine those who support complete independence and self-determination for a Palestinian state are few and far between).

But the problem is that they form coalitions with and make concessions to those who don't support any sort of two-state solution. The net effect of this is that, whatever the intentions of the politicians, the settlements continue to expand, and a two-state solution becomes less and less viable.

Good post by Cleon there.
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Thanks.
 
I'm sorry..but wasn't the Zionist movement originally secular and semi-socialist?

Yes. Yes it was. It was subverted by religious extremists and nationalists AFTER 1967.

Let us never forget that Communist King of the USSR, Joseph Stalin, voted to allow Israel into the United Nations. This was done AFTER Israel's expansion of territory to the 1967 borders and their expulsion of 700,000 Arabs.
 
parky76 said:
I'm sorry..but wasn't the Zionist movement originally secular and semi-socialist?
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Secular, yes. Butonly the left wing was really any sort of "socialist."

Yes. Yes it was. It was subverted by religious extremists and nationalists AFTER 1967.
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True, and it's worth noting that this has largely been an American movement that expanded into Israel. It was largely the work of people like Meir Kahane and the Lubavitcher Rebbe.

Let us never forget that Communist King of the USSR, Joseph Stalin, voted to allow Israel into the United Nations. This was done AFTER Israel's expansion of territory to the 1967 borders and their expulsion of 700,000 Arabs.
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Yeah. And? :confused:

(I seriously don't get what your point is, here.)
 
Cleon said:
It was largely the work of people like Meir Kahane and the Lubavitcher Rebbe.
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What?

How exactly was Menachem Schneerson key to the settlements in the West Bank and their expansion??

This is truly new to me.
 
parky76 said:
What?

How exactly was Menachem Schneerson key to the settlements in the West Bank and their expansion??
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Hassidim were generally not real keen on support for Israel until Schneerson started making waves. He was the first Hassidic leader to enthusiastically support Israel, lobbied for its expansion, and was absolutely opposed to any sort of concessions on Israel's part.

In 67, not only did he support the conquest of the West Bank, Gaza, and the Sinai, he publically called for the IDF to take Damascus and Cairo, as well.

The guy was every bit as rabid as Kahane, he was just better at putting on a friendly public face. Between the two of them, they were the spiritual (and political) leaders of the "religious extremists and nationalists" you spoke of.
 
Cleon said:
Hassidim were generally not real keen on support for Israel until Schneerson started making waves. He was the first Hassidic leader to enthusiastically support Israel, lobbied for its expansion, and was absolutely opposed to any sort of concessions on Israel's part.

In 67, not only did he support the conquest of the West Bank, Gaza, and the Sinai, he publically called for the IDF to take Damascus and Cairo, as well.

The guy was every bit as rabid as Kahane, he was just better at putting on a friendly public face. Between the two of them, they were the spiritual (and political) leaders of the "religious extremists and nationalists" you spoke of.
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Schneerson was such a fervent Zionist..that he never ever visited the place.
 
Tin Foil Timothy said:
I'm not contradicting myself at all. There's a difference between having a right to exist and the methods entailed in creating that existence. If you can't understand that basic notion then there's no hope.
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a_unique_person said:
You don't see theft of land as provocation?
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Neither of you have understood my post.

For Hamas and regimes like Iran, Israel itself is stolen land (again, pay attention, I'm not talking about the illegal settlements in the West Bank, but the entire Israel where it stands now), so therefore for them Israel has no right to exist.

Do you agree with that assessment?
 
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Pardalis said:
Neither of you have understood my post.

For Hamas and regimes like Iran, Israel itself is stolen land (again, pay attention, I'm not talking about the illegal settlements in the West Bank, but the entire Israel where it stands now), so therefore for them Israel has no right to exist.

Do you agree with that assessment?
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I smell a big portion of ignorance in your question, Goury:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1948_Palestinian_exodus
 
Pardalis said:
OK, so that makes it three of you who didn't understand my post.
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No, I understand your question - but you seem to misunderstand the historic fact that a minority of Jews in Palestine took a majority of the land due to the declaration of the State of Israel. What about that is hard to understand? :confused:
 
Pardalis said:
So you agree with the Hamas and Iran assessment?
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Uhm, I'm agreeing with the fact that the declaration of the State of Israel was the loss of the majority of land to a Jewish minority. Look closely to spot the differences in both images: :rolleyes:

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Palestine for and after Israel's declaration of independence
 
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