South Carolina, tear down that flag!

[jhunter1163]

I photographed the SC state house about ten years ago and nothing has changed since then.

After much controversy, the Confederate flag was removed in 2000 from atop the state house. It was relocated next to the Confederate memorial in front of the building.

Belatedly, the SC legislature did give African-Americans a monument on the side of the capital building. Unlike the Confederate memorial and flag, it's easy to miss.

So it's on the side, near the kitchen?

 

[Checkmite]

The Confederate "battle flag" is nothing but a legally acceptable way for white bigots to openly show contempt for blacks while paying wink-wink-nudge-nudge lip-service to a "heritage" that, except for the specific issue of asserting the alleged importance to them of honoring this single symbol, they otherwise don't give two shakes about and are largely uninformed of anyway. It's the vestigial remnant of an army formed solely to fight, kill, and die in defense of the "right" to keep humans with black skin in chains, to be used as beasts of burden by humans with white skin - a sentiment that most of the flag's enthusiasts aren't entirely unsympathetic to, even while they insult the galaxy's intelligence by proclaiming that their love of the Confederacy and its symbols has absolutely nothing to do with the cause that was the Confederacy's sole raison d'être.



Take down the flag.

 

[TragicMonkey]

The Confederate "battle flag" is nothing but a legally acceptable way for white bigots to openly show contempt for blacks while paying wink-wink-nudge-nudge lip-service to a "heritage" that, except for the specific issue of asserting the alleged importance to them of honoring this single symbol, they otherwise don't give two shakes about and are largely uninformed of anyway. It's the vestigial remnant of an army formed solely to fight, kill, and die in defense of the "right" to keep humans with black skin in chains, to be used as beasts of burden by humans with white skin - a sentiment that most of the flag's enthusiasts aren't entirely unsympathetic to, even while they insult the galaxy's intelligence by proclaiming that their love of the Confederacy and its symbols has absolutely nothing to do with the cause that was the Confederacy's sole raison d'être.

Worse than that, it's ugly. Orangey-red? With navy blue? Ewww.

 

[pgwenthold]

I just read elsewhere that the Confederate (Battle) flag displayed at the South Carolina statehouse was put up in the 50s or 60s in protest to segregation laws.

We've talked about the great heritage of the Confederate flag in general, but that is the heritage of that flag, in particular.

But it's not a symbol of racism, or anything.

 

[Olowkow]

The mayor of Charleston, Joseph P. Riley, Jr., just announced that he is taking down the confederate flag. State officials considering state wide ban.

Riley's a democrat by the way.

 

[ponderingturtle]

Just checked.
Yeah, all flags at the Carolina Capital Building lowered except the Confederate Flag.

It really is kind of fitting and symbolic that way. Lowering it for a few blacks would be a major cultural violation of its historic use after all.

 

[ponderingturtle]

The flag in question is the Confederate Battle Flag (it is not the Confederate Flag, despite the common error in labeling it as such). It doesn't represent a governmental entity at all. It represents an army that no longer exists. There is no particular reason it ought to be lowered.

And not even the confederate Battle Flag but the Battle Flag of the Army of Virginia. Why South Carolina would ignore their own army is interesting.

 

[Upchurch]

The mayor of Charleston, Joseph P. Riley, Jr., just announced that he is taking down the confederate flag. State officials considering state wide ban.

State wide ban on the confederate flag or a state wide ban on taking down the confederate flag?

Because, frankly, I'm willing to consider that it could be either.

 

[ponderingturtle]

South Carolina was like Confederacy central. It will be the last place to abandon those roots.

The county my brother lives in is proud that they never rejoined the union. Of course why the consider themselves Americans is a self defeating question.

 

[pgwenthold]

And not even the confederate Battle Flag but the Battle Flag of the Army of Virginia. Why South Carolina would ignore their own army is interesting.

You see? It's about heritage! Not South Carolina heritage, of course, but the heritage of another state's army in their great rebellion against the US.

 

[ponderingturtle]

It is fascinating how these things get spun.

The flag isn't really part of the statehouse as such. That's why there are no other flags near it. It isn't part of a display of flags or set of flagpoles or anything. For the gawker article, I was trying to picture where it was, because the camera angle was not straight on.

Apparently, there is a confederate soldier's memorial in front of the SC stItatehouse. Part of that memorial is a confederate battle flag.

It would make no sense to lower that flag as a sign of mourning.

Why not the flag of their own army? I know the KKK did a great job of making it the symbol of all things southern but still.

 

[ponderingturtle]

Southern pride.

As to why the south prides itself on the Confederacy, I couldn't tell you.

And the traditional garb of the south has taken to many hits. You will not get much respect in the sheet and hood anymore.

 

[ponderingturtle]

I photographed the SC state house about ten years ago and nothing has changed since then.

After much controversy, the Confederate flag was removed in 2000 from atop the state house. It was relocated next to the Confederate memorial in front of the building.

Belatedly, the SC legislature did give African-Americans a monument on the side of the capital building. Unlike the Confederate memorial and flag, it's easy to miss.

Where else should it be but the servants entrance though? Very fitting.

 

[Senex]

Please, I lived in Georgia for 4 years before the Olympics. Every single day there were calls to take the huge confederate symbol off the state flag. Nobody I knew (political science graduates at UGA and law students at Emory) thought Georgia would actually host the world under a confederate flag.

Yeah, they did.

They didn't change the flag until 5 year after the Olympics (and they retained some symbol of the confederacy until 2003).

I lived in Atlanta, GA a couple of years before the Olympics and several years after. I was appalled at the state flag. Not only did they lose the war but the good guys won. That flag should be an embarrassment not a source of pride. I'm back in Connecticut now and that flag wouldn't fly here.

 

[Border Reiver]

To be fair, the founding fathers were all traitors too. They seceded from and rebelled against England.

There is one crucial difference - the Founding Fathers succeeded.

The Confederacy, not so much.

 

[grunion]

While I agree with those protesting the confederate flag flying on the grounds of the SC Statehouse, I imagine that a corporate boycott, much the way that the homophobic "religious exemption" laws were defeated in Indiana, might be the only effective way to finally get that execrable piece of cloth removed.

 

[Cleon]

I lived in Atlanta, GA a couple of years before the Olympics and several years after. I was appalled at the state flag. Not only did they lose the war but the good guys won. That flag should be an embarrassment not a source of pride. I'm back in Connecticut now and that flag wouldn't fly here.

In our defense, we did finally ditch it about ten years ago.

 

[beren]

There is one crucial difference - the Founding Fathers succeeded.

The Confederacy, not so much.

The founding Fathers succeeded.
The confederacy seceded.

Not that different.
[emoji1]

 

[Cleon]

There is one crucial difference - the Founding Fathers succeeded.

The Confederacy, not so much.

The major difference is that the Founders rebelled against Britain to expand liberty. The CSA rebelled against the Union because they wanted to keep their slaves.

It's not a question of treason good/treason bad or who wins and loses. It's about the principles for which they fought.

 

[Yuchi1]

Could this mean both sides had the blood of slaves on their hands?

http://www.etymonline.com/cw/economics.htm

BTW, where/when was the first and deadliest race riot in US history?