Sean Hannity offers to be waterboarded for charity

[thaiboxerken]

Funny...here again, we have a pro-boarding advocate arguing for it's effectiveness..without giving any scientific evidence. Also, he's not actually arguing that it isn't torture..why?

 

[Dr Adequate]

Since you don't know me, you're merely speculating, and, thus, wasting your time and that of everyone else.

It seems that my "speculation" that you were being honest has offended you in some way. This is the first time I have ever seen anyone take umbrage at the suggestion that they were sincere, but I guess it takes all sorts to make up a world.

I was misled into "speculating" that you were honest by the further "speculation" that you wouldn't be stupid or crazy enough to expend your time in posting opinions that you believed to be false. I am chastened by your rebuke, and now realize that I have no real basis for believing in your mental competence or stability. What was I thinking?

By way of apology, let me freely concede the possibility that you may indeed be a liar and a fool. From now on, I shall never waste my time, nor anyone else's, by "speculating" that you actually believe the tripe that you come out with.

And I trust that others will follow my example.

 

[Thunder]

By way of apology, let me freely concede the possibility that you may indeed be a liar and a fool. From now on, I shall never waste my time, nor anyone else's, by "speculating" that you actually believe the tripe that you come out with.

And I trust that others will follow my example.

Give this man a Gold Star!!!!

 

[Thunder]

Funny...here again, we have a pro-boarding advocate arguing for it's effectiveness..without giving any scientific evidence.

Um, my friend, this is clearly his motis operandi. He has already stated that he does not need to provide evidence...ever, since there would be no reason for him to be untruthful.

He has also said that everything he ever says, is correct.

 

[Marc39]

It seems that my "speculation" that you were being honest has offended you in some way. This is the first time I have ever seen anyone take umbrage at the suggestion that they were sincere, but I guess it takes all sorts to make up a world.

I was misled into "speculating" that you were honest by the further "speculation" that you wouldn't be stupid or crazy enough to expend your time in posting opinions that you believed to be false. I am chastened by your rebuke, and now realize that I have no real basis for believing in your mental competence or stability. What was I thinking?

By way of apology, let me freely concede the possibility that you may indeed be a liar and a fool. From now on, I shall never waste my time, nor anyone else's, by "speculating" that you actually believe the tripe that you come out with.

And I trust that others will follow my example.

At least, this thread has nothing to do with inane Middle East peace proposal ideas.

 

[CapelDodger]

By all accounts, information elicited by water-boarding prevented another tower-attack in Los Angeles.

"By all accounts" is not evidence. There all sorts of claims going around about what torture has prevented : where's the evidence?

If someone privy to details of such an attack were picked up the plan would be dropped or drastically changed. That's common sense. The idea that weeks or months of torture would provide useful information about ongoing plans is not credible.

It quite credible that a "subject" would say "There's going to be an attack on Los Angeles" and then provide some plausible details; after all, while they're doing that they aren't being waterboarded, which is no doubt a relief. Every attack on Los Angeles that hasn't happened since can then be claimed (by all accounts) as proving the efficacy of torture.

In the end, I don't really care one iota about inflicting a little discomfort on terrorists.

You presumably wouldn't approve torture of suspected terrorists. A line has to be drawn somewhere, after all.

 

[Marc39]

"By all accounts" is not evidence. There all sorts of claims going around about what torture has prevented : where's the evidence?

The tower was not toppled. It's self-evident. Don't over-complicate the issue.

 

[CapelDodger]

We have satellites that go around the earth every 24 hours now. We have predator drones patrolling the Stans. We have sophisticated digital eavesdropping and packetsniffing. We can verify some forms of intelligence to some degree very quickly and figure out what is actionable.

Do you have any evidence that this has actually happened? Information on how often statements turned out not to be kosher would also be welcome.

As I Ratant pointed out, it's an obvious ploy to give plausible but false information which the torturer can be expected to like the sound of. That, after all, is when the torture stops, if only temporarily.

Repeating the incorrect statement doesn't make it factual.

Claiming that a statement is incorrect does not make it so. History is replete with examples of people tortured into false statements that confirmed the torturers' expectations. Examples of useful information obtained by torture are much harder to come by.

 

[CapelDodger]

The tower was not toppled. It's self-evident. Don't over-complicate the issue.

Are you pulling my chain? You surely can't be serious.

 

[CapelDodger]

Um, my friend, this is clearly his motis operandi. He has already stated that he does not need to provide evidence...ever, since there would be no reason for him to be untruthful.

I think he just tried to provide some evidence in post 347. Unless he was being ironic.

 

[CapelDodger]

I consider statements from George Tenet and other senior national security authorities supporting the effectiveness of water-boarding to be sufficient evidence.

You don't suspect there might be a teeny bit of self-justification there?

Wasn't Tenet the guy who had WMD's existing in Iraq down as a "slam-dunk"? There's a guy who knows what his boss wants to hear. And apparently what you want to hear.

If your life were in danger and a terrorist knew details about it, you would have a different point of view on how far to go for eliciting that information.

Would that apply if you suspected your life was in danger, and suspected that the person you had at your mercy might know something about it?
We have to draw a line somewhere, after all.

Muslims go by the word of Allah, so, why do they also happen to be among the most violent on the planet?

Do you have a thing about Muslims too? I hear that a lot from US Americans.

 

[Marc39]

You don't suspect there might be a teeny bit of self-justification there?

And, isn't everyone engaging in a teeny bit of self-justification?

Wasn't Tenet the guy who had WMD's existing in Iraq down as a "slam-dunk"? There's a guy who knows what his boss wants to hear. And apparently what you want to hear.

Didn't every intelligence agency, including those from Jordan and Egypt, all confirm WMD? Didn't Saddam Hussein use WMD on the Kurds?

Do you have a thing about Muslims too? I hear that a lot from US Americans.

I have a thing about Islamofascist psychopaths.

 

[Dr Adequate]

At least, this thread has nothing to do with inane Middle East peace proposal ideas.

If you wish to whine about a topic raised on another thread, then that other thread would be the perfect place to do so.

 

[Thunder]

Didn't every intelligence agency, including those from Jordan and Egypt, all confirm WMD? .

The American, British, Russian, French, and Israeli intelligence services, all thought Iraq had modern, useable WMDs. They apparently were all wrong.

 

[Marc39]

The American, British, Russian, French, and Israeli intelligence services, all thought Iraq had modern, useable WMDs. They apparently were all wrong.

How could they all have been wrong? Hmmmmm. Maybe, just maybe, they weren't wrong.

 

[Thunder]

How could they all have been wrong? Hmmmmm. Maybe, just maybe, they weren't wrong.

Bush says they were wrong. Cheney says they were wrong. Condi says they were wrong.

what more do u need?

Saddam lied to the world..and his own people. And we got duped.

 

[Marc39]

Bush says they were wrong. Cheney says they were wrong. Condi says they were wrong.

what more do u need?

Saddam lied to the world..and his own people. And we got duped.

Bush was forced, politically, to say there was no WMD. WMD was transferred to Syria.

 

[Thunder]

WMD was transferred to Syria.

When it comes to matters of international intelligence, I trust Condoleeza Rice a whole lot more then you. And she says there is no credible evidence Iraq transferred WMDs to Syria.

 

[Marc39]

When it comes to matters of international intelligence, I trust Condoleeza Rice a whole lot more then you. And she says there is no credible evidence Iraq transferred WMDs to Syria.

Rice was out of the loop. Nice lady, but, way over her head.

 

[Kevin_Lowe]

I saw footage of trucks. Trucks!.

What more proof do I need that those trucks were loaded with WMDs and being given to Syria?