Primitivism Discussion

Skeptical Greg said:
How can you add two people to the population and call that ' 0 ' growth ?
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Take 2 oranges. Let them wither and decompose fully. Now put 2 new baby oranges in your hands. What percent growth did you have?

Now take 2 oranges. Let them wither and decompose fully. Don't replace them. Now your hands are empty. What percent growth do you have?

I made a comment about negative population growth in my particular family unit, and that's it.

There's lots of info on the Internet about zero population growth for those who are interested in talking about that.
 
Skeptical Greg said:
Uhmm ... O.K. then ..
I really wasted a lot of time with my earlier math lessons .. Should be able to manage from here; now that I know about the withering and decomposing part ..
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People age and die, Greg. Hard truth of life, but it's time someone told you.
 
Skeptical Greg -- think about it this way. Zero population growth means that the population 50 or 100 years from now will be THE SAME as the population today. This means the number of births should equal the number of deaths on average, over time. Naturally this means people need to have children, or else the population growth will soon be negative.
 
Skeptic said:
Skeptical Greg -- think about it this way. Zero population growth means that the population 50 or 100 years from now will be THE SAME as the population today. This means the number of births should equal the number of deaths on average, over time. Naturally this means people need to have children, or else the population growth will soon be negative.
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...as it should be.
humans need to quit breeding like a virus.
 
Skeptic said:
Why is it that all these great "lovers of mankind" seem to really, really hate actual, existing people?
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i don't hate anybody, and this has nothing to do with hating actual, existing people.
i feel that mankind has to acquire ) new way of thinking if we are to survive. (or deserve to survive.
surviving certainly requires living sustainably.

we are not living sustainably.
 
ITA with the above. Except I do hate some living people, let's be real here.:D

Even if I didn't--I love kittens too but I don't think they should breed like tribbles.
 
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bikerdruid said:
...as it should be.
humans need to quit breeding like a virus.
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Life IS like a virus. Tell viruses and flies to stop breeding like viruses. :p

Okay, so humans are supposed to be smarter than the average housefly. But you'll notice that most people want kids, for some reason. Might have something to do with natural tendencies.

...of course that would mean that humans are part of nature and such a suggestion would be anathema to some ecologists.
 
Belz... said:
"Population growth" doesn't refer to the moment after your baby is born. It represents a growth over X years.
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I get it; really I do ..

My earlier response of " .... did you kill a family member ? " to the claim that they were:

" ....doing their part by deliberately creating a family with negative population growth."

... was a joke ..


It got out of hand...
 
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and this has nothing to do with hating actual, existing people.
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Suppose I said, "The Chinese need to stop breeding like a virus" or "Blacks must stop breeding like a virus". Would you conclude that I am just deeply concerned about over-population, or would you conclude I might have something against actual, living Blacks or Chinese?

Primitivists tend to treat people in general like some bigots treat Blacks and Chinese: they think there are far too many of them, that they are ruining the world, and that if it only wasn't for them "humanity" will be doing great.
 
Skeptic said:
Suppose I said, "The Chinese need to stop breeding like a virus"
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The Chinese government felt this way and implemented radical policy to address it. Are you saying that the Chinese government hated their own people, or can you imagine they were addressing the practical problem of population growth?

As for the phrase "The _______ need to stop breeding like a virus" any criticism level at a racial group will sound pretty bad because the phrasing suggests a racist determination that the problem does not exist in other racial groups and that inherent traits of race is the cause.

If I say "People are lazy", that's a truism. We all know it doesn't apply to all humans, but as a group we generally prefer not to work too hard when given the same outcome. If I say "Mexicans are lazy" I'm implying that they as a racial group are especially lazy. The two statements are not comparable.
 
jiggeryqua said:
Take your pick: 80 years of life in a tiny cell with no window, or 40 years outside? Duration is not the only measure.
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Actually, the low life expectancy of former eras was due to the high infant mortality, not people dropping dead at 40. That's a major misconception many people have.

Once you made it past childhood, your changes of getting pretty old weren't that bad anymore.

Statistic's a bitch. :)
 
Cavemonster said:
The Chinese government felt this way and implemented radical policy to address it. Are you saying that the Chinese government hated their own people, or can you imagine they were addressing the practical problem of population growth?
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I think you missed Skeptic's point about the tone of Druid's statement.
 
Belz... said:
I think you missed Skeptic's point about the tone of Druid's statement.
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No, I disagreed with Skeptic's point about the tone.

I addressed both the sentiment and the phrasing, read my entire post.
 
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